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How much weight is removed when you "hollow out" a wooden stock.
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posted
If you you do that ball end mill trick in the barrel channel and in the butt stock?

Is that like 4 ounces? 2 ounces?. Obviuoulsy it depends on the density of the wood but an estimate.


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10181 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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As you said, it depends. Not only on wood density but how far and how big a hole you drillin the butt. Same for the fore arm. Depends how big an endmill you use, how deep, how long the fore arm.

Often it is done not just for weight savings but to minimize the amount of pressure the usefull on thin barrels.
 
Posts: 583 | Registered: 28 May 2007Reply With Quote
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Rem721,

Give me a guess brother.


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10181 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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Anywhere from one to four ounces, maybe more if the wood is dense and you really hog out the butt.
 
Posts: 583 | Registered: 28 May 2007Reply With Quote
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Picture of Westpac
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
If you you do that ball end mill trick in the barrel channel and in the butt stock?

Is that like 4 ounces? 2 ounces?. Obviuoulsy it depends on the density of the wood but an estimate.


Or, how much wood can a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood? Big Grin I guess it would depend on how big the woodchuck is and how much wood he is capable of chucking.


_______________________________________________________________________________
This is my rifle, there are many like it but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend, it is my life.
 
Posts: 3171 | Location: SLC, Utah | Registered: 23 February 2007Reply With Quote
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Tough crowd tonite


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10181 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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As you know it depemnds on the wood, but also the stock style. A typical Amercian stock has a lot more wood than a true Teutonic style stock. The American can afford to loose more wood without sacrificing strength.

In Steve Hughes first book "Double Shotguns" he measured a straight gripped shotgun butt stock before and after hollowing. He removed almost 8 oz from the butt to get the gun balanced like he wanted.

In "Mastery of Wood and Metal" Turpin shows Kurt Crum boring 2 holes in a butt stock of one of their rifle stocks and removing 4-5 oz of wood. It could be whittled down a hell of a lot more if they wanted to do it.

So there are 2 data points for you. Both of these were measured weights and were the easiest for me to grab for you. It should give you an accurate idea.
 
Posts: 2509 | Location: Kisatchie National Forest, LA | Registered: 20 October 2004Reply With Quote
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Mike,
Please, for the love of god, don't DIY this.. You, a drill motor, and a great big drilbit ... the livingroom will flow with blood!!

all the answers below ar "depending" . but assuming a normal stock layout, and about 3# for the weight, it will be HARD to get more than 10-15% out.. but, if the stock if very heavy for size, the wood is probably denser than a light for size stock. If the stock has a rip ease or limbsaver, consider swapping for a decelerator

Anyway, 2 to 8 oz, probably, and you might save 2-4 more by changing your recoil pad. should be able to get 1-3 from the forearm, depending, and 2-6 from the butt, only if you have it milled out. Doing this DIY could lead to a side out... not a good thing for the looks of the stook, or perhaps even the hand next to it.

if the rifle has a recoil lug, leave at least an inch from the back of the lug to the major taper, if not, you probably can mill from the taper to tip, a darn good bit.

jeffe


opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club

Information on Ammoguide about
the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR
What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR.
476AR,
http://www.weaponsmith.com
 
Posts: 40232 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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I did it to a winchester featherweight stock and a remington classic. In both cases about two ounces. Probably could have taken another half ounce or so from the remington but you dont want to weaken it too much. I did not take anything from the foreend of the winchester as that stock is very thin in that area.
 
Posts: 108 | Registered: 09 February 2006Reply With Quote
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The only time I did this and weighed the before and after was on a laminate stock. Like Marc says, most American stocks, like most of us, could stand a little thinning down. Anyway, the difference was 8 ounces. In this case three 5/8's or 11/16 holes were drilled, can't remember exactly, and then the connecting material was chiselled away to leave a trapazoidal cavity. The first hole drilled parallel to the top line of the butt, the next parallel to the toe line, and one in between.

Next was a series of interupted cuts in the bottom of the barrel channel.




Aut vincere aut mori
 
Posts: 4869 | Location: Lakewood, CO | Registered: 07 February 2002Reply With Quote
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average walnut is about 1/3 Oz per cubic inch..... you can take it from there.


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"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."
Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 28849 | Location: western Nebraska | Registered: 27 May 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by vapodog:
average walnut is about 1/3 Oz per cubic inch..... you can take it from there.


Lightness costs me an average of $10/ ounce.

If a guy's time was worth $20/ hour, he would have to cut out 6 cubic inches per hour.
 
Posts: 9043 | Location: on the rock | Registered: 16 July 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by tnekkcc:
quote:
Originally posted by vapodog:
average walnut is about 1/3 Oz per cubic inch..... you can take it from there.


Lightness costs me an average of $10/ ounce.

If a guy's time was worth $20/ hour, he would have to cut out 6 cubic inches per hour.


Confused Huh? I know I am dense, and like often happens I do not understand a post. At least I am an equal oppurtunity idiot-I doubt if I have uynderstood every post any memeber ever made on this site!

Are you talking about finding a light blank, or...?
 
Posts: 2509 | Location: Kisatchie National Forest, LA | Registered: 20 October 2004Reply With Quote
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But, how much would wood can be removed from the butt without compromising the stock? On a Lee Enfield?


Regards
303Guy
 
Posts: 2518 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 October 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Marc_Stokeld:
quote:
Originally posted by tnekkcc:
quote:
Originally posted by vapodog:
average walnut is about 1/3 Oz per cubic inch..... you can take it from there.


Lightness costs me an average of $10/ ounce.

If a guy's time was worth $20/ hour, he would have to cut out 6 cubic inches per hour.


Confused Huh? I know I am dense, and like often happens I do not understand a post. At least I am an equal oppurtunity idiot-I doubt if I have uynderstood every post any memeber ever made on this site!

Are you talking about finding a light blank, or...?



PAWS Aluminum bottom metal for Mausers weighs 3.5 ounces, as opposed to 8.625 ounces for typical steel bottom metal.

It costs $60 and so the weight savings is ~ $12/ ounce.


Most wood rifle stocks weight ~35 ounces. Take it off and sell it for $50 and buy a HIGH TECH SPECIALTIES stock for $200 that weighs 20 ounces.

The weight saving is ~ $10/ounce.


If a cubic inch of Walnut weighs 1/3 ounce, then an ounce would be 3 cubic inches.

One could remove 3 cubic inches of wood, or pay $10 in parts to lighten a rifle one ounce.

If a person was worth $20/ hour, then he would have to remove 2 ounces per hour, to make it worth his while.

2 ounces per hour would be 6 cubic inches of wood per hour.

This is no exact calculation, but it gives an idea where to quit when the easy wood has already been removed.
 
Posts: 9043 | Location: on the rock | Registered: 16 July 2005Reply With Quote
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303Guy. I think you are on the right track. How much can be removed without weakening the stock. I don't like the idea of having one large open cavity in
the buttstock. It would be much stronger to leave a solid strip of wood between
two smaller holes. Also, if you remove wood in 'pockets' in the forend with
an end mill. Doesn't that leave spaces for rain water to sit and swell the forend?
In answer to the original question, I just bored some holes into the butt of
a stock made of a dense piece of Turkish walnut. I bored 2 holes, 7/8" dia.
4 1/4" deep. Then, stepped down to 3/4" dia. for an addional 3/4" depth.
Weight reduction was 2 1/2 ozs.
 
Posts: 175 | Registered: 08 December 2007Reply With Quote
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Great idea, Tommyhawk. I was thinking of cutting a cone-like cavity from the rear of my 303 butt-piece, tapering down to the bolt. For the fore-end, I was thinking of hollowing out quite a chunk as mine is a rather big fore-end. (One I made). I was worried about the hollow piece being too flexible. The milled cavities rather than a single hollow makes good sense. Much more rigid.


Regards
303Guy
 
Posts: 2518 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 October 2007Reply With Quote
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3 cubic inches of walnut is only 1 ounce? Maybe, but it just sounds wrong.
 
Posts: 16304 | Location: Iowa | Registered: 10 April 2007Reply With Quote
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Picture of vapodog
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quote:
Originally posted by wymple:
3 cubic inches of walnut is only 1 ounce? Maybe, but it just sounds wrong.

Unless it's found at the DNC and then it weighs a lot more as everything there is quite dense anyway!


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"Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery."
Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 28849 | Location: western Nebraska | Registered: 27 May 2003Reply With Quote
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Well, dry black walnut weighs about 38 pounds per cubic foot, and we know that there are 1728 cubic inches in one cubic foot and that there are 16 ounces in one pound; therefore, with the above you can do the arithmetic yourself
 
Posts: 1138 | Location: St. Thomas, VI | Registered: 04 July 2006Reply With Quote
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An unloaded average WW II military rifle weighs in at about 9 1/2 lbs. Super light weight guns are sorta of fun to carry, but fall off the mark on a quick shot...too whippy...at least that's my experience. My favorite 270 of 22 years finally needed a new barrel..I purposely installed a slightly heavier barrel (4 oz) to "settle it down". Shoot it better than I ever did (8.5 lbs ready to go) You need to carry around a couple pounds less...skip dessert!
 
Posts: 2221 | Location: Tacoma, WA | Registered: 31 October 2003Reply With Quote
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Bryan Chick / VapoDog; Are correct average Black Walnut ( Juglans Nigra ) weighs close to 38 lb. per cubic Ft. which = 1728" cubic " X 16 o/z = 608 o/z's divided by 1728 = .35 per o/z .
European or Circassian Walnut or ( Juglans Regia. ) weighs slightly more 40 lb. per Cubic Ft. .

Alaskan Yellow Cedar which is an Excellent wood for very light colored stocks ( can be stained ) is very close in weight and strength . The grain is straight and tight .

Read below to save on your fuel Bills .
It's only going to continue to rise until
our country is Broke !. Get a head start on
Pellet burning stoves and solar !.

# Burning one cord of good hardwood = using a ton of coal
# Burning one cord of good hardwood = using 200 gallons of fuel oil.
# Burning one cord of good hardwood = using 4,000Kwh electricity.
# The actual weight of wood is variable. Dry hickory weighs 63 pounds per cubic foot; oak and maple weigh 43; sycamore weighs 35; and white pine weighs 25.
# Burning wet wood looses 15% of the potential heat in the same wood if dry (25% moisture after 6 months of seasoning).
# Pine knots have 40% more heat than average woods.

Shoot Straight Know Your Target . ... salute
 
Posts: 1738 | Location: Southern Calif. | Registered: 08 April 2006Reply With Quote
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Mike,

I had remembered reading about this somewhere so I asked at the double gun website, here's the thread. Crossed Chisles is David Trevallion he's the one that took an old Purdeys stock that had 1/8" wall thickness and stood on it with no ill effects.

Double Gun thread
 
Posts: 1705 | Location: East Coast | Registered: 06 January 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Duane Wiebe:
An unloaded average WW II military rifle weighs in at about 9 1/2 lbs. Super light weight guns are sorta of fun to carry, but fall off the mark on a quick shot...too whippy...at least that's my experience. My favorite 270 of 22 years finally needed a new barrel..I purposely installed a slightly heavier barrel (4 oz) to "settle it down". Shoot it better than I ever did (8.5 lbs ready to go) You need to carry around a couple pounds less...skip dessert!


Duane,

First, let me say that I respect your abilities tremendously and the work of yours that I have seen is first rate, maybe better if there is such a thing.

That said, I think you are somewhat off the mark here. By that I mean that I have shot enough silhouette to know that heavier rifles be more taxing and lead to wobbles. What I found more important than weight is proper balance for the shooter. For off hand shooting I found that a little weight slightly forward helps things to settle better.
 
Posts: 583 | Registered: 28 May 2007Reply With Quote
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I agree that less body weight = better health & sporting ability. But, I also feel that in the case of light weight hunting rifles you can have your cake and eat it too. My speacialty is Mausers. I have nowhere near the experience as Mr. Wiebe but I feel that a light weight hunting rifle is achievable and shootable. I tend to favor a little extra weight forward especially on slim barrels. My .30-06 is based on a vz24 with what amounts to a Shilen #1 barrel 25" long. It weighs 7.25 lbs unscoped, 8 lbs scoped. Not an ultralight by any means but pretty damn light for a 25" barrelled standard length mauser 98. The extra length and subtle tweaks to the contour put more weight forward and help the relatively lightweight rifle settle nicely for easy offhand shots.

My .338-06 on a vz24 actions goes 9 lbs. It has a 26" bbl and weighs 9 lbs scoped. It too is easy to shoot offhand due to the slight weight forward bias I incoporated into it.

But, as with most things, there are diminishing returns. I believe it is more a matter of weight distribution than absolute weight.




Aut vincere aut mori
 
Posts: 4869 | Location: Lakewood, CO | Registered: 07 February 2002Reply With Quote
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I can certainly attest to the shoot ability of Z1R's 338-06.

I saw him sling up and drop to a knee all in one motion and drill a cow elk between the shoulder blades at a lasered 250 yds if I recall correctly.

Meanwhile I was stinking up the joint, by missing 3 shots in a row at the same group. I did how ever connect later on that day.


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10181 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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Another way around the problem....

 
Posts: 1705 | Location: East Coast | Registered: 06 January 2003Reply With Quote
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Now that is uglier than a Berkeley Co Ed


Mike

Legistine actu quod scripsi?

Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.




What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 10181 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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Hey, ... now there's an idea! It may be "uglier than a Berkeley Co Ed" but that would depend on who's looking at what. Exactly how is it uglier than, say, a roll-over cheek-piece? Wink Actually, my Anschutz's roll-over cheek-piece is a beauty! Thing is, a lot more wood could be removed that way without a milling machine.


Regards
303Guy
 
Posts: 2518 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 October 2007Reply With Quote
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That's a restored Thomas Turner 16 bore hammer "ultra-light". 5 lb. 5 oz., 28" barrels, 2 3/4" chambers, cut away stock, must hit you back pretty well.
 
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