Someone on the phone suggesting making them of 01 tool steel, or better still, machinable carbide Ferro Tic.

How to you make them?
TIA

o1 would be a bad choice, due to the nature of the ht process for it and the hardness of the o1 afterwards ...that is, unless you machines it from hardened o1... o1 has to be quenched to properly harden .. OIL-1 hardening

annealed 4140 or 8620 would be better choices, with the nod going to 8620 for the small shop guy, as you can just use standard tooling, including die reamers on those materials, and 8620 is a cinch to surface harden ... LOL, so is 4140 if you get it hot and quench it.. that sucks, btw... 8620 can surface harden and be core soft...

TNEKKCC;

Making dies is a challenge but not impossible.

I sometimes use O-1 for interchangable neck sizing die inserts but it can warp easily in thin sections. I prefer the air hardening steels for most die work as you don't have to liquid quence them, just heat to the proper temperature let it air cool, then temper, but then I have heat treating equipment so it is fairly easy. In any case you will need to prevent scale from forming on the surface of the steel. If you use a torch as your heat source, not terribly accurate but it can and does work, one of the powdered anti-scale compounds will work, these are available from your local welding supply. Since I use furnaces I wrap the die in a piece of brown paper sack and then in stainless steel foil and seal it, heat and let air cool then when the part reaches about 150 degrees I put it back in the furnace at the proper draw temperature. The brown paper chars and uses up the O-2 inside the stainless wrap preventing scale formation. It would be possible to make dies from some type of mild steel and then use a case hardening compound, again available at your local welding supply, to make a hard skin on them. Properly done they would last quite a while.

I have made a number of reloading and bullet forming dies, swaging presses and some bullet moulds over the years, it has been frustrating, fun, and personally rewarding, but mostly it makes me appreciate how cheaply they can be bought.

Give it a try you might find you like it.

For what it takes to make you own die...unless you just want to learn the process...I would buy a set of blank dies, the proper reamer and be done with it.

Cutting the dies is nothing but a fairly easy lathe project and just about any free machining metal can be used. The dies don't have to be hardened unless you plan on sizing a vast amount of brass, and unless you are familiar or want to learn the process...hardening can be a difficult process in itself.

Blank dies are available through several online resources, you just have to do a search as I don't have the links right at hand.

The easiest way is to buy custom dies from CH4D or one of the other die makers or have custom dies made by RCBS, LEE, FORESTER, HORNADY.

I would do ANYTHING else to obtain needed dies before I would make my own.

'Njoy

I made the resizing die for my 20 tactical in 3 steps, with 3 different reamers and a drill to rough it out-

Rough out with a twist drill, cut the shoulder with a #3 1/2 center drill, ream the neck with a different reamer (sorry forgot the dimension) and cut the body with a properly tapered reamer.

Body of the die is 4140 IIRC, unhardened. I have some 7/8" threaded rod that I think would be fine for moderate use but I'll have to experiment with it before I know for certain. I think a 7/8" grade 5 or 8 bolt would work too. I don't think most brass will wear an unhardened die, but that is only my uninformed opinion and I may change it in the future.

Anyway, it was a pretty easy setup to do.

I don't mean to sound like a SA , but WHY would anyone want to make Dies for ?. Dies are available in any caliber and are inexpensive enough so what's the purpose ?.

I've always been told by " Experts " in what ever field ; If you can buy it don't make it !.

Shoot Straight Know Your Target . ...

Dr K
a resizer reamer costs $150, and RCBS charges 400 bucks for a 500 jeffe dies.. if you are long on tools, and short on clams, it makes good sense.. and when they say 12-16 weeks for delivery.. that sucks, too

You can BUY anything, but is it cost effective?

quote:

Originally posted by Dr.K:
I don't mean to sound like a SA , but WHY would anyone want to make Dies for ?

because you can
because it's fun
to say you did
because you are bored
too see if you can
my friends have not

there are probably more reasons too

I was thinking of a set of 19 Badger form dies.

In talking about this subject with Troy Newlon, his suggestion was to use 416SS, cut with the same reamer as the chamber (we were talking about a bushing type die). IF your barrel is CM and the die SS, than the finished holes will be about .0015-2 smaller in the SS. The SS will also shrink a small % when heat treated to RC-38 (+/-2). If you need it even smaller (or your barrel is also stainless) have the ID hard chromed to bring the ID down to the desired diameter (about .0015-.0020 / side).
The other choice is "leaded steel", and if you go that route you need to use a undersize (die) reamer.

DrK
The best reason I can think of to make your own is the tighter tolerances, higher potental accuracy, and longer case life. With a max spec chamber and a min spec die your going to get a lot of case working going on, VS having the die cut to match the chamber exactly. Think of it as the difference between mass production and hand fitted.

Edited twice, once cause I thought I'd made a mistake, and once to put it back the way I typed it the first time.

my head machinist here used to be head for bonnanza sports (now forester) making co-ax dies they used leaded screw stock and then case hardened. he also made the reamers for them, but thats a while different story

Thanks for the info ; I wasn't aware that Dies were that kind of pocket damage $$, As I don't shoot that caliber .

Some peoples Idea of Fun differ from others !.

Shoot Straight Know Your Target. ...

quote:

Originally posted by tnekkcc:
I was thinking of a set of 19 Badger form dies.

Do you want to make a case form die, or a resizing die, or both?

Regarding an intermediary case forming die, I don't have dimensions in front of me but what about experimenting with a 222, 223, or 17 remington die if you have one laying around? Probably have to cut 1/2" off the bottom to get it to fit, but worth a try IMHO. When you get it to chamber use cream of wheat to blow everything out, it doesn't have to look pretty beforehand but the firing will take care of the rest.

The simple way to make a reamer is to machine the cartridge profile in steel, then cut in half, harden and sharpen. Use that to cut the chamber, then take .003 off and use it to cut the resizing die. (to be honest I made mine .003 undersize and if I did it over would make it .0035)

Mark, I have the Forster 19 Badger sizing die.

@12% necking per step:
a) .290"
b) .265"
c) .235"
d) the 19 Badger FL sizer die:


I have some 7/8-14 threaded rod that is not hard, but I am going to see what I can do with it.

The 30 Carbine brass has something of a neck and I am going to size it with a 32acp carbide die to get a uniform diameter going into the form dies.

For the 30 degree shoulder, I was going to grind down a 60 degree spotting drill to .318" dia.

When I was in gunsmith school the common reamer set from the manufacturer in Raton,NM (Don't remember their name) was a set of four,Rougher,finisher,Throater and sizer. Dies were commoinly cold rolled and then heat treated with I think casenite for a case hardened finish. I think I still have a set of 6.5x54's I made that way and they still worked fine last time I used them a couple of years ago. Hardly anyone ever made them unless for some really unusual cartridge not available from the factory. Most guy's would rather take the discount by not orderiing the sizer reamer and buy factory dies. I remember the 6.5x54 was not a common cartridge then in the US and was the only reason I bought the sizer and made the die set.

commercial dies from well known manufacturers are made from 12L14 and are case hardened .010 deep.

I've made dies from O-1 tool steel and it works quite well....heat treating it is no problem where A-2 requires a furnace and O-1 can be done with a torch!

quote:

Originally posted by Tailgunner:
In talking about this subject with Troy Newlon, his suggestion was to use 316SS... The SS will also shrink a small % when heat treated to RC-38 (+/-2).

Are you sure he didn't mean 416 stainless?
316 is not hardenable through heat treat methods.

Rusty,
You are right. It must be a 400 series stainless or maybe 17-4.
Butch

416 would be easier to machine, but it has a tendency to not obtain the finish you could with a better quality steel, like 4140. 12L14 suffers from the same problem, in that it gets a milky-smeared finish to it, rather than a high luster and low-drag look, which is what you'd want.

If it were me, I'd use 304 or 303 and leave it non-heat treated......brass is pretty soft from what I hear.......grin

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty Marlin:

quote:

Originally posted by Tailgunner:
In talking about this subject with Troy Newlon, his suggestion was to use 316SS... The SS will also shrink a small % when heat treated to RC-38 (+/-2).

Are you sure he didn't mean 416 stainless?
316 is not hardenable through heat treat methods.

CRS is a horrable thing to suffer from. From his website
"416 Stainless Steel or 12L-14 Steel (non-hardened)"