Shooting technique question.

23 April 2009, 04:46

frank4570

I have been working with my .458 win mag and I have a specific question.

When shooting the rifle if the sights are on the x and the shot breaks well, will there be a noticable difference in point of impact if the stock is held very firmly versus if it is not held firmly? And if so, then how much.

I hope this is the right forum.

23 April 2009, 06:01

Snellstrom

frank I'm not your expert but I shoot enough to have figured this out, if your grip on the rifle or hold on the rifle is different from shot to shot it will affect the point of impact.
In my opinion this becomes more apparent with harder kicking rifles. I have a very lightweight 9.3x62 that kicks like a mule with its leg caught in a fence (I know 9.3's don't kick but you should shoot this one!) This rifle will shoot sub 1" groups with full power loads and 286 grain bullets if held tightly and consistantly. If you hold it loosely it is all over the page (3-4" groups).
Hope this helps...........
Good luck with yours.

23 April 2009, 06:59

frank4570

This is the answer I am looking for. IF it is the answer I am looking for.(Makes sense,no?)
This gun kicks pretty hard and I am not used to guns that kick like this. My rest today was crap because I brought the wrong car.
I think I have a one hole group at 50 yds. But I am not sure because it may be 1 hole with a flyer, but I think that has to do with the inconsistency of my hold. Your post does give me hope.

quote:
Originally posted by Snellstrom:
frank I'm not your expert but I shoot enough to have figured this out, if your grip on the rifle or hold on the rifle is different from shot to shot it will affect the point of impact.
In my opinion this becomes more apparent with harder kicking rifles. I have a very lightweight 9.3x62 that kicks like a mule with its leg caught in a fence (I know 9.3's don't kick but you should shoot this one!) This rifle will shoot sub 1" groups with full power loads and 286 grain bullets if held tightly and consistantly. If you hold it loosely it is all over the page (3-4" groups).
Hope this helps...........
Good luck with yours.

23 April 2009, 16:21

jeffeosso

yes, it will impact/change

opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club

Words aren't Murder - Political assassination is MURDER
Information on Ammoguide about
the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR
What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR.
476AR,
http://www.weaponsmith.com

23 April 2009, 17:31

CRUSHER

quote:
Originally posted by jeffeosso:
yes, it will impact/change

23 April 2009, 19:55

El Deguello

quote:
Originally posted by frank4570:
I have been working with my .458 win mag and I have a specific question.

When shooting the rifle if the sights are on the x and the shot breaks well, will there be a noticable difference in point of impact if the stock is held very firmly versus if it is not held firmly? And if so, then how much.

I hope this is the right forum.

Yes, there will be a difference! But you will have to determine how much by actually testing the rifle held both ways!

24 April 2009, 00:04

shootaway

With the 458,you will have no choice but to hold the rifle firmly or else you will injure yourself.In answer to your question,NO.It does not make any difference on the point of impact.The rifle should shoot the bullet to the spot your sights are fixed no matter how tight you hold it.Drops in the point of impact are caused mostly by a fouled bore and never by how you hold the stock or shooting position.

24 April 2009, 00:32

Michael Robinson

Grip tension - along with all sorts of other variables that go into how one holds and sights a rifle - certainly will have an effect on point of impact.

Give the same, accurate rifle to two different expert shooters and let them shoot groups from the prone position at 100 yards.

Group centers - i.e., points of impact - can vary by as much as several inches.

That is why, in order to shoot accurately, everything that goes into holding and sighting the rifle must be consistent from shot to shot.

That is also why no one (except by pure luck) can properly sight in a rifle for anyone else.

24 April 2009, 01:04

shootaway

It's easy for anyone to come on here and tell us that it will not do so.But if they believed what they were saying,they would explain to us why?

24 April 2009, 02:16

pointblank

quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
It's easy for anyone to come on here and tell us that it will not do so.But if they believed what they were saying,they would explain to us why?

I guess it hasn't occured to you that the bullet is traveling through the bore DURING recoil? Kinda stands to reason that a light hold will have a different POI than a tight hold.

24 April 2009, 04:37

JBrown

quote:
Originally posted by pointblank:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
It's easy for anyone to come on here and tell us that it will not do so.But if they believed what they were saying,they would explain to us why?

I guess it hasn't occured to you that the bullet is traveling through the bore DURING recoil? Kinda stands to reason that a light hold will have a different POI than a tight hold.

There are many things that have not occurred to him.......

Jason

"You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core."
_______________________

Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt.

Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry
Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure.

-Jason Brown

24 April 2009, 04:44

Dall85

Not correctly positioning the rifle on your shoulder and/or cheek will create POI changes also. True with a shotgun or rifle.

24 April 2009, 05:02

Duane Wiebe

The hold seems to make a difference. I was shooting once with Bob Sturgis (Founder of Gander Mountain) We shot the same 222 and his groups were tighter than mine....the difference was apparent...he almost did not touch the rifle, while I kinda snuggled against it...sure enough, when I used his technique, my groups tightened

I would suppose the difference would amplify in heavy kickers???

24 April 2009, 06:19

jeffeosso

quote:
Originally posted by JBrown:
quote:
Originally posted by pointblank:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
It's easy for anyone to come on here and tell us that it will not do so.But if they believed what they were saying,they would explain to us why?

I guess it hasn't occured to you that the bullet is traveling through the bore DURING recoil? Kinda stands to reason that a light hold will have a different POI than a tight hold.

There are many things that have not occurred to him.......

24 April 2009, 08:18

frank4570

I found in 1000yd competition the less you hold onto the gun the better the groups are. In the heavy gun class many guys avoid touching the gun at all except to adjust the bags and touch the trigger. An that is mostly how I have shot.
If I try that business with this .458 Win mag the rifle is going to end up on the ground after it bounces off my face.Literally.

quote:
Originally posted by Duane Wiebe:
The hold seems to make a difference. I was shooting once with Bob Sturgis (Founder of Gander Mountain) We shot the same 222 and his groups were tighter than mine....the difference was apparent...he almost did not touch the rifle, while I kinda snuggled against it...sure enough, when I used his technique, my groups tightened

I would suppose the difference would amplify in heavy kickers???