At the bare minimum - what would be the most practical Tig welding machine that could handle welding bolt knobs on to bolts, and filling small imperfections in receivers?

I'm on a budget.

Air cooled torch with a high frequency start 150 amps max. I would look at the ones made by everlast.

I was looking at a Miller Diversion 180. But I am rethinking that now because it can't be used for stick welding. The leads are proprietary.

All I want is the minimum Tig welder required to do bolt knobs and fill in small receiver imperfections.

Minimum would be a high frequency module that allows you to use your AC stick welder with a tig torch. You'll need the tig module, a tig torch, gas regulator and bottle, and lead adapter to hook the torch to your welder. If you don't already have an AC stick welder, might be about the same cost to buy a dedicated TIG machine.

However, this would just give you BASIC capability.

quote:

Originally posted by ssdave:
Minimum would be a high frequency module that allows you to use your AC stick welder with a tig torch. You'll need the tig module, a tig torch, gas regulator and bottle, and lead adapter to hook the torch to your welder. If you don't already have an AC stick welder, might be about the same cost to buy a dedicated TIG machine.

However, this would just give you BASIC capability.

I don't have any welder at all so buying accessories for my "AC stick welder" aint gonna work!

I've been using a Lincoln Inverec v-100 for over ten years. When I bought mine over a decade ago they were around $600 new without the Torch and consumable or regulator, now you can find a nice used one for around $200.00 then another $100-200 for torch, regulator and consumables depending on how fancey you wnat to get.

It's a Scratch start TIG or you can flip the leads and use it as a light duty stick welder, it runs on 110V, so no extra wiring just run it on an outlet that has a 30 amp breaker.

For some people scratch start is a problem but I was a certified combination welder and journeyman pipefitter for years before I became a fulltime custom gun maker...but even if you are new to TIG, like most things with time and practice you can get good with scratch start.

I have yet to find a gunsmithing welding job that I haven't been able to do with my Invertec 100 amp unit and a bottle of argon.

Hope this helps you.

Colin

P.S. I should mention this unit isn't like a fully equipped high frequency unit you can't TIG aluminum with it but if most of your work is traditional bolt rifles it will handle everything in carbon and stainless that you'll probably ever do.

The Miller Diversion 180 was what I considered to be the minimum for my use. For gun work it would be 100% duty cycle but for other shop work like welding up the bumper on your truck or making mounting brackets for your winch the duty cycle would be restrictive. The no stick policy really throws a monkey wrench into it. It's nice to be able to switch to stick welding if you need to lay down a heavy track of glue. I've been TIG, stick and MIG welding for a lot of years.

There are a whole raft of Chinese made TIG inverter welders hitting the market now for under $1000 with everything you need but a 110 or 220 outlet to plug it into and something to burn up. I just don't know how well they stand up or if you could get parts if something went FUZZLE ! Thats why I was looking at Miller or Lincoln. Yeah I know you pay $700 for the name but peace of mind has something going for it too.

If I want to weld truck bumpers I drag out the SAE 250 Pipeliner and well go where ever I want and weld. It was one of the things I kept off my welding truck when I sold it, I figured having a portable around the farm was a good thing to have.

On a budget?

Saving up money to buy some Texas land?

Or maybe lease a farm in Missouri?

So after your thread in the North American Hunting forum on Texas you are now asking for advice on the purchase of a TiG welder?

GFY

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
On a budget?

Saving up money to buy some Texas land?

Or maybe lease a farm in Missouri?

GFY

Ted,

Why drag the Texas land rights argument over to this thread that has absolutely nothing to do with that?

This looks like a legitimate question that the answer might benefit more than just the OP.

Is there a reason you felt the need to trash a perfectly good thread just because you didn't like what he said in another thread?

quote:

Originally posted by CowboyCS:

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
On a budget?

Saving up money to buy some Texas land?

Or maybe lease a farm in Missouri?

GFY

Ted,

Why drag the Texas land rights argument over to this thread that has absolutely nothing to do with that?

This looks like a legitimate question that the answer might benefit more than just the OP.

Is there a reason you felt the need to trash a perfectly good thread just because you didn't like what he said in another thread?

Yep...there are several perfectly good reasons.

you asked about tig, not other process, so i'll assume this is all you want to know about

150-180 amps - you are asking to heat up some large puddles for what you are describing - and with a large duty cycle.

do NOT try the super cheap and tempting import brand -- those have a tiny duty cycle, though for a single, 30 minute job, it might last.

i personally like the thermal arc products -- and i really like foot pedals -- i rewired a miller to work with my US350 years ago ...

this is likely my next tig, as it does 110/220 .. the 350 was ph1/ph2 !
http://www.weldingsuppliesfrom...IVrLf9JQNBoC-wjw_wcB

Jeff, are you not a Texan?

I weld for a living.....TiG welding

Ask yourself....what are you welding that's firearms related @ 150+ amps?

On page 2 of the Texas thread the OP admits to being a troll

quote:

Originally posted by Quick Karl:
This has been fun, gents, but like a man suggested earlier, y'all been trolled.

He wants advice I suggest he GFH

Ted,

I didn't need a link to the Texas thread, I read it, how do you think I was able to put in my post that it was about land rights?

So your reason for ruining a perfectly legitimate and informative thread is immaturity...he trolled you in one part of the playground so now you are going to follow him around the rest of the playground interupting everyone else. Well aren't you special----ed.

quote:

Originally posted by CowboyCS:
Ted,

I didn't need a link to the Texas thread, I read it, how do you think I was able to put in my post that it was about land rights?

So your reason for ruining a perfectly legitimate and informative thread is immaturity...he trolled you in one part of the playground so now you are going to follow him around the rest of the playground interupting everyone else. Well aren't you special----ed.

The link was not for you but for anyone not feeling the need to be trolled.

I ruined this thread? Not hardly

If you wish to waste time then please continue.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
you asked about tig, not other process, so i'll assume this is all you want to know about

150-180 amps - you are asking to heat up some large puddles for what you are describing - and with a large duty cycle.

do NOT try the super cheap and tempting import brand -- those have a tiny duty cycle, though for a single, 30 minute job, it might last.

i personally like the thermal arc products -- and i really like foot pedals -- i rewired a miller to work with my US350 years ago ...

this is likely my next tig, as it does 110/220 .. the 350 was ph1/ph2 !
http://www.weldingsuppliesfrom...IVrLf9JQNBoC-wjw_wcB

Thanks Jeff! I appreciate the advice. I had looked at that line of welders but was unsure about what model might be the one to do what I need.

I got tired of getting my welding done by someone else and bought a Miller MaxStar with an attached Snap-Start. It is small and compact and does everything I need it for. By the way, it welds better than I do!

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe (CG&R):
My money says the cheapest route for you is to have your work done by an experienced,competent metalsmith

If I do that I will still have watched my money go away, I won't be able to learn to do the work myself, and I will still be waiting forever to get the work done -- or for the guy to even answer his email!

I prefaced my original comment to avoid having to hear about welding machines capable of welding 8" thick beads in titanium in a single pass!

You know how internet forums can be!!

quote:

Originally posted by Quick Karl:
All I want is the minimum Tig welder required to do bolt knobs and fill in small receiver imperfections.

I didn't say I was looking for the cheapest, anything, sir!

QK What's wrong with a Mig wire feed like a Lincoln Pro-Mig for small jobs on steel? Not appropriate for bolt handles? Mine works fine on lighter materials. Never tried to weld anything as heavy as a bolt handle.

quote:

Originally posted by custombolt:
QK What's wrong with a Mig wire feed like a Lincoln Pro-Mig for small jobs on steel? Not appropriate for bolt handles? Mine works fine on lighter materials. Never tried to weld anything as heavy as a bolt handle.

Tig welding is cleaner and more precise (higher quality welds).

Why 150? It's a good general use , and can be trend down with a knob. Why did I answer? Well, it was a good question that I had a decent answer for.

It's a decent box, not great, but the answer was minimum, which this is what I consider a 150 max to be.

I don't need my 2 ton mill to drill stock bolts. But it works

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe (CG&R):
Karl: I guess I jumped to a conclusion when you wanted "minimal" That usually means cheap to me. Anyway before you end up screwing up actions, why don't you try some welding classes..might give you a hands on experience of what will work for you.

NRA sponsored gunsmithing classes may be useful

I've got a half dozen 98 bolts that have handles welded beyond repair. The best piece of equipment in the world will not make a compotent weld with a dilatant operator.... yet I've seen gas welds done by experts that were flawless

+1

You can't really understand the limitations of tooling unless you have used some of it. I could get by with the $1800 Miller. But past experience has shown me that I will be trading it off the first time I couldn't convert it to stick to lay down heavier welds. See if you can get into some night classes at a community college. If not, the rule of thumb in an uncertain situation is always OVERKILL. Figure out what you think you need and double it!

Thanks gentlemen - please rest sure that I do not intend to start ruining actions/bolts until I feel confident I can achieve my goal without wasting things.

Truthfully, it takes too long anymore to send something somewhere to get work done anymore, and most times I cannot afford the asking prices, so I want to learn to do as much as I can, myself.

I am not even a blip in Duane's (and other's) league, and I am sure that there is not enough time left in life to get there if I was so inclined, but I've done a few things that lots of people told me I could not do and they don't look all that bad -- and they even work!

I admit, I would like to be a riflesmith - not because I think I am going to get rich overnight doing it, but because it is probably what I enjoy doing more than anything else I can think of - but I cannot build exhibition grade DG rifles.

I've learned an awful lot from just reading internet posts by some of the more experienced guys on this and some other forums.

Thank you, again.

This tig rig should work.

On the serious side we have a small tig machine we have used for several years that our welders really like. I will get the model number in the morning for you.

quote:

Originally posted by MikeBurke:
This tig rig should work.

On the serious side we have a small tig machine we have used for several years that our welders really like. I will get the model number in the morning for you.

LOL now THAT is what I am talkin about!

Take a look at this one. Operates on 120 or 230 volt and can weld aluminum. It sells for around $1400.00

Square Wave® TIG 200 TIG Welder

http://www.lincolnelectric.com...cts/K5126-1/e338.pdf

If you ever intend on welding aluminum make sure the unit has a high frequency AC capability.

quote:

Originally posted by Quick Karl:

quote:

Originally posted by ssdave:
Minimum would be a high frequency module that allows you to use your AC stick welder with a tig torch. You'll need the tig module, a tig torch, gas regulator and bottle, and lead adapter to hook the torch to your welder. If you don't already have an AC stick welder, might be about the same cost to buy a dedicated TIG machine.

However, this would just give you BASIC capability.

I don't have any welder at all so buying accessories for my "AC stick welder" aint gonna work!

My suggestion is to purchase a decent oxy/acet torch and learn to use it well. You can weld your bolt handles on with that just as good as with TIG. Since you do not have anything else right now, a torch is going to be a zillion times more useful the rest of the time you are not welding on bolts.

When you get an extra grand saved up in the kitty I'm sure there will be people still here willing to help you spend it but you'll have some experience then and hopefully a few personal preferences at that point.

Any CC/constant current power source could be converted to TIG capabilities w/ the addition of a Hi Freq unit & back to a SMAW/Stick unit by turning the Hi Freq OFF.
(once you stick w/ hi freq you'll never go back to scratch start)

A CV/constant voltage machine is dedicated to MIG/Submerged Arc use only as both are a short arc process dedicated to filler wire diameter.

A Miller STH 150 DC Inverter unit has built in Hi Freq w/ pulse & has SMAW/Stick ground/leads,#17 air cooled TIG torch & regulator in a molded plastic carry case.
The inverter power source weighs 14Lbs.
Input power required is 1Ph 220/230.

Any 120 input power source will have basically less than 10% duty cycle-weld 1 minute in 10 minutes.

If AC/DC power is required the Miller Dynasty's have the capabilities.

Polarity by AWS is a bit confusing-
DCSP-straight Polarity-electrode is NEGATIVE,Ground is POSATIVE used to TIG weld steels/stainless/inconel/monels.

DCRP-reverse polarity-electrode is positive,ground is negative used to weld brass,coppers,al/sil bronze.

AC-Alternating current w/Hi Freq is used to weld aluminum & magnesium.

I'm not to big on Micky Mousing stuff together. It never works as well as the real thing.

There is an old adage that I've grown accustomed to overusing Duane. You might like it: "Don't attempt vast projects, with half vast equipment."

For the pure spirit of discussion my main TiG is a Miller Syncrwave 250

I have 2 torch options....

Standard and a micro........both water cooled

IMO....The better bare basic TiG welders power supply doesn’t make economical sence to buy just to weld a couple bolts

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
For the pure spirit of discussion my main TiG is a Miller Syncrwave 250

I have 2 torch options....

Standard and a micro........both water cooled

IMO....The better bare basic TiG welders power supply doesn’t make economical sence to buy just to weld a couple bolts

AAHHHHEeeemm. You never did give me your address and business hours Ted. I might want to stop by some night. I mean day, for coffee. That's right some day for coffee! he he he

1452 Rowe Parkway
Poplar Bluff MO

We never run out of coffee

Geez guys - y'all act like I might want to go into business to compete with y'all, or maybe start welding up some oil rigs...

I'm like the guy that builds his own hot rod in his garage and cannot afford a Roush-Performace-built motor, but still gets a lot of enjoyment out of his real nice hot rod! I'm not going to give up my hobby just because the rich guy up the road can afford a $100K hot rod...

I wont be selling my guns at Barrett-Jackson so while I would love to own a Syncrowave 250, it is a steep investment just to weld bolt handles.

However, if one of y'all wants to be nice and let me come use your welder (presuming you are within driving distance) and coach me a lil, that'd sure be nice of ya!

Send them to me and I will weld them pro bono

I won't have the correct filler rod for blued steel though

quote:

Originally posted by ted thorn:
Send them to me and I will weld them pro bono

I won't have the correct filler rod for blued steel though

See ya in Missouri!

DC and Argon
My filler rod selection
H13
S7
01
TiGtectec 680
Brutis
A2
D2
P20
420 SS
440 SS

On the AC side of the dial......and sometimes helium my choices are thin
Beryillium Copper
Mold Max
Amco Bronze
Aluminum

The micro welding rods we have are just H13 and 420 SS

ted thorn-
you may want to edit your above post.

A trained professional may get the wrong impression.

Do you/have you hard faced w/ bare carbide also?
Hopefully not
OR use pure tungsten for all processes?

quote:

Originally posted by Dans40XC:
ted thorn-
you may want to edit your above post.

A trained professional may get the wrong impression.

Do you/have you hard faced w/ bare carbide also?
Hopefully not
OR use pure tungsten for all processes?

I beg your pardon but I'm assuming you are asking about my electrode material?

None of us are trained "professionals"......just plain ordinary Plastic Injection Mold Makers.....we really don't know much about much.....

I do have a useless stack of paperwork in the top drawer of my toolbox
that reads to some that I may just be a "trained" this and that

We don’t work on firearms are firearm parts

As to address your question the best that I can.......my favorite is 2% for everything....

Even very HOT!! AC

But the diameter of said tungsten varies from .040 through .125