My question is both broad and specific.

If I get a Ruger Alaskan and give it to a smith can he make it function as smooth and fast as a Sako. That's my specific question.
The more broad question, it the main difference just the attention to detail and labor that happens at the factory? Or are there fundamental differences that no amount of work can overcome?
Thanks.

A very tough question. One may start out comparing apples and apples, and then be faced with an apple/orange situation.


My OPINION is that IF you hand the gunsmith rifles made of good materials, if of equivalent quality designs, and IF the gunsmith is a truly knowledgeable and experienced man, he can improve either or both of them to a point you wouldn't have believed until you handled his finished work. (Lot of "ifs" in there.)


So, if you hand a Ruger to a truly skilled gunsmith experienced with Rugers, yes, I believe he can make it as smooth and reliable as any Sako. You of course may have to pay more money (rifle cost and 'smith work) than if you had bought a Sako to start with. Or vice-versa.


But, if you hand a gunsmith a Mossberg Model 800 and ask him to make it into as excellent a rifle as a Sako, then I suspect you are pretty much dreaming.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong but
IMO
1. depends on the smith
2. depends on the condition of the action.

As far as the condition of the action goes as far as I know the reason a action feels good to beging with is due to the fit and finish of the working parts i.e. bolt, extractor, ejector, mag follower, etc. any off the shelf non custom or higher end action can be made to function smoother. But will action X be as good as action Z after the work??? Who knows.
Then there is the tolerances involved if the bolt is loose as goose to begin with and binds from becoming cocked in the raceway then no amount of polishing will ever make it better.

As for the smith well that comes down to one issue Money How much are you willing to spend on a less expensive rifle to feel like it cost $4000??? And is the smith wiling to take your money.
I'd be willing to bet that the difference in cost of your untouched Sako to a polished Ruger is next to nil and may even put you in the red. If I was the Smith I'd say buy the Sako and be done with it.

A friend of mine had an ex military Colt or S&W revolver, he used it for target shooting .He decided that to be more competitive he would send the gun to Parker Hale to be refurbished and worked over, when he got it back he still didn't have a target pistol but...he had the nicest M&P revolver you could ever want.

The moral of the story..... it's a Ruger ,it will always be a Ruger ,although ,it could be a very nice Ruger.

I would say it all goes back to the old racing adage: "Speed costs money. How fast can you spend it?"

Or fun cost money. how much do you want to have??

yes.. and a ruger is no cheaper than a m70, remington, or mark x... snd certainly more costly than almost any milsurp mauser.. in fact, a ruger can be cleaned up in less than an hour, in terms of smoothness... there's no need for polishing stones, fixutres, etc.. though all those tools REQUIRED to slick up a mauser camn be used.

mother's billet polish... that the whole trick... it can't tsakr off enough metal, without severe effort, to hurt anything..

oh, yeah, some me another NEW
dual square bridge
hinged bottem metal
CRF and "feed over the extractor"
return to zero scope mounts
3 position safety
does NOT require heat treating
stainless or cm
lefty or righty
4 sizes
and stainless bolt
with superior gas venting

platform available for under 2k ...

there aint one...

put some mother's on the bolt, avoiding the lugs, and work it for an hour, EMPTY, touching up the mother's when you need to.

it will be wicked slick

frank,after my gunsmith finished with my CZ 458WM, it works faster and better than my Sako and the Sako was fast to begin with.My CZ works so fast that you will be scared to fire a rifle that fast and when pushed to the limits,the bolt will catch a spinning, ejected round, that has not yet cleared the ejection port and jam.

what Shootaway says of Wayne's work on CZs plus One!!

Rich

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
what Shootaway says of Wayne's work on CZs plus One!!

Rich

I was reffering to a famous gunsmith in B.C.However, I am sure others may be just as good.

quote:

Can a gunsmith make a "cheap" action work like an expensive one?

The short General answer unless it is poorly made to begin with is YES. The issue is that it is no longer a "cheap" action when it is done. Take a "cheap" $200 Military action, throw 1-3 grand at it (depending on what you want) and you have a really sweet start point for a custom rifle but it is no longer a "cheap" action.

If you have fond memories hunting with that gun, by all means, go for it. Just know that the resale value will most likely never increase by the amount of money you put into it. If it is a rifle you want for yourself, "Till death do you part", trick that Ruger out dude....

You can start the "Pimp my rifle", reality show on the hunting channel.

Sign me up as the first contestant....

Specifically in the example above where you are just getting the rifle, Jeffeosso has a good answer in lapping the bolt/action and calling it good. If you don't want to, any decent gunsmith can do this for you.

quote:

But, if you hand a gunsmith a Mossberg Model 800 and ask him to make it into as excellent a rifle as a Sako, then I suspect you are pretty much dreaming.

I hope that gunsmith is an honorable man and will tell you up front "No; I can't do what you want with this as the starting point, but I'll charge you as much as I can in the effort." Then keep your mouth shut and your mind open when he suggests what you can or should do...

Trez you know what would be really awesome, is a rifle build off, ala discovery channel biker build off. two smiths, x number of days to build a custom. you'd get some that do more work themselves than others. that would be cool to see.

quote:

Originally posted by Dago Red:
Trez you know what would be really awesome, is a rifle build off, ala discovery channel biker build off. two smiths, x number of days to build a custom. you'd get some that do more work themselves than others. that would be cool to see.

Yeah but in this day in age of liberal media we can't possibly promote a trade as evil as gun building

Sort of on topic, "what a good smith can do". About 1970 I bought one of those cast 1911 frames. I came up with a GI slide, a NM barrel and bushing, and all the small parts. (I was in the Army at the time). Well, it wouldn't go together so i put it in a shoe box and forgot about it. A couple of years later i was at FT benning. I ran into an old friend who asked me if I had ever finished my .45. I said no. He told me to take it to the Accuracy Gun Shop and tell them I sent you. A few weeks later I got back a .45 which looked like a new older commercial Colt. Blue, Plain GI sights. $100. It would shoot next to any National Match Made. Sweet trigger. So it does make a difference.

Well yes you are correct but the quality of parts you had in the shoe box was the key. If you had boxed up Norinco junk It may have cost more to get it to shoot correctly.
If the actions are designed alike and the quality of parts the same then there is no comparison
But have one action from brand X and a junker from brand Y and you will play hell trying to get it to compete with a better made action.
I wanted a high capacity (10 rnd min) semi auto 45 pistol in Double action
Well I'm limited to a few choices HK USP, Ruger P series, Glock But it's not a tru double action. and I can't remember the rest.
Well the Ruger felt like junk loose and clunky. Glock's trigger pull sucks so I went with an HK.
$950 later and I couldn't be happier

You get what you pay for.