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What do y'all view as the best rear aperture sight for a DGR and why? Thanks! Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | ||
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I would look for something that sits low and out of the way, is protected from direct contact with foreign objects i.e. rocks and such, is made of steel and has the least amount of moveable parts. What are you putting it on? _______________________________________________________________________________ This is my rifle, there are many like it but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend, it is my life. | |||
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I would prefer open sights. Peeps are good in broad daylight but arn't worth a shit at dawn or dusk. They do look nice though!   Doug Humbarger NRA Life member Tonkin Gulf Yacht Club 72'73. Yankee Station Try to look unimportant. Your enemy might be low on ammo. | |||
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If I'm gonna be using something at dawn or dusk, it'll be a low power scope. I don't see irons very well and apertures are waaaay easier for me to shoot than open sights. Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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What about the Talley rear peep that fits into a base? Or one of the XS (Ashley) ghost rings? Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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Hello Just make sure you use a big enough aperature, most sights are way to small for hunting, which is why Doug mentions the low light issue. The less you think about a rear aperature sight the better you'll shoot, and unless trying to increase the depth of field (thats what a small hole does) then big is good. If you take the disk OUT of a Williams thats the MINIMUM size to consider for hunting in the forest or under cover. Cheers Edited to correct info on depth of field | |||
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In truth, the smaller the aperture the greater the depth of field. flaco | |||
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That may be, but the field of view is lots smaller. Testing by Ashley Express showed that small or large had no apprecible affect on accuracy at hunting distances. | |||
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That is. | |||
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That's not in dispute. However you give up field of view which on a hunting rifle is fairly important. Something a target shooter like flaco may not be aware of. | |||
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flaco is a photographer, and not an iron sight target shooter... how do i know? He has posted he compeats in hunter class br with a scoped rifle, and he is actually an accomplished photag #dumptrump opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club Information on Ammoguide about the416AR, 458AR, 470AR, 500AR What is an AR round? Case Drawings 416-458-470AR and 500AR. 476AR, http://www.weaponsmith.com | |||
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As a photographer all I will say is that the smaller the aperture, yes the greater the depth of field ( depth of FOCUS ) but the the smaller the aperture more light is needed. Bright light allows the use of small apertures (F stops) for you old photogs out there.  Doug Humbarger NRA Life member Tonkin Gulf Yacht Club 72'73. Yankee Station Try to look unimportant. Your enemy might be low on ammo. | |||
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I'm leaning toward a ghost ring with an aperture between .190" and .230". I doubt it would ever be used at much over 50 yards. Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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I don't understand how that could be. All you are doing is looking through holes of different sizes. With the camera lens example you are looking through lens of varying distances apart which will change the depth of focus. With the aperture seems all that will change is the field of view. Howard Moses Lake, Washington USA hwhomes@outlook.com | |||
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You can determine which size aperture will produce the best universal view by drilling different size holes in a piece of steel and looking. Cardboard, or card stock is too fiberous and clouds the view. _______________________________________________________________________________ This is my rifle, there are many like it but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend, it is my life. | |||
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I have a 0.190" aperture on my truck gun.  I have no problem shooting these groups at 100 yds.   Aut vincere aut mori | |||
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I'm sure coffee and being surrounded by all that green helps.  It's not everyday you see the pattern of a fine stock match the table. Let's get some oil on that table!_______________________________________________________________________________ This is my rifle, there are many like it but this one is mine. My rifle is my best friend, it is my life. | |||
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And letting your Marine buddy shoot the groups, lol. I made the stock from the table's twin.  Aut vincere aut mori | |||
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Acrecurve, If you need a talley base with .50 holespacing that has the rear recoil shield ground off to accept the peep sight let me know. I have one laying around Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue.  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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Respectfully, a hole is a lens, glass or no glass; think of a pinhole camera. When you see old photos, or in a movie, say, of a guy holding his fist to his eye like it's a binocular, what he's actually doing is leaving a small hole, created with his thumb and fore finger, to look through to bring a distant object into focus*- in fact with a small aperture, just about everything will be in focus over great distances. There are "glasses" made with metal or plastic "lenses" that are perforated all over with small holes, also, to attain the same effect. Photographers using bellows view cameras will stop the lens down to it's smallest aperture, then tilt the lens-carrying front board which then presents the aperture as an ellipse to the film plane to increase depth-of-field; this is in effect making the smallest aperture smaller, as an ellipse of the same (major) diameter of a circle will have less area than the circle would have. Elmer Keith always wrote that one should just unscrew the aperture disc and use the threaded hole as the sight for hunting: two-for-one as you have the option of using the eyepiece for fine work if wanted. *It works, if you don't mind looking like a weird-o  And I still like this rifle, plenty: -one day I'm gonna make one like it.
I use that same front rest... gotta lotta divots in the yard. | |||
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I've done that before and it works nicely...even if it looks like ya lost part of the sight. Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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Excellent post by tin can. Yes, there are target shooting glasses made up of not magnifying lenses, but just a black background with numerous apertures. And it sounds like Elmer Keith had it right. Thank You, Jeff. Although I most often shoot with scoped rifles, I still enjoy my otherwise stock 1909 Argentine with a Lyman 57 rear and a globe front. It will shoot 1 1/2" at 200 yards. LOL. flaco | |||
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Hi Flaco, I use scopes way over 90% of the time...but this is for a 500 Jeffery and, like I said, won't be used at much over 40-50 yards. I can shoot 1.5" groups at 200 yards quite consistently with irons...on the internet, but not at the range.  Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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I applaud your courage, ACRecurve. I like to shoot lots--on paper--and it's pretty easy to subdue paper targets. My first response was to the aperture issue. I know a little about this, so I felt comfortable with my reply. If you're shooting Dangerous Game--why else would you use it?--with a 500 Jeffery, I'd just stick with open sights. Best, flaco | |||
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Do I have to say it's a Target Acquisition issue? flaco | |||
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Nope! It's a deteriorating eyesight issue!  Good hunting, Andy ----------------------------- Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish funds for the propagation of ideas he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.” | |||
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Wait 'til you see the whites of their eyes. flaco | |||
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Oh yes. I simply can't use open sights anymore. I can sometimes fake my way with a rifle, but it is absolutely impossible for me to sight a pistol; and, I always have preferred aperture sights. | |||
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A folks... Aperture settings on a camera lens impacts depth of field issues; i,e, how different objects across a depth of distances will be in focus for the picture... The human eye is not a camera lens and can only focus at one distance at a time period. That distance is measured in inches. For example, when looking thru an aperture sight the human eye can either focus on the front sight, the aperture or on the target. And the rule is front sight, front sight, and front sight. The size of the apeture simply allows you to acquire the front sight within the aperture either quickly (large) aperture or not so quickly small aperture. The humna eye is bad at focus on more than one distane that even the rear sight of a handgun and the front sight of a handgun cannot be kept in focus simultaneously. Mike Never under estimate the internet community's ability to reply to your post with their personal rant about their tangentially related, single occurrence issue. What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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-also the sight radius is almost twice the distance with aperture sights vs. open. | |||
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Go look at Lon Paul's website (photo gallery). He builds a lot of rifles that are set up for aperture sights. His website is http://lonpaulcustomguns.com/index.html | |||
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I use a peep sight on many of my big bore rifles. I normally use a Talley and toss the screw in apature out the window, and use the big wide open screw hole of about .125 ...that way I don't have any problems at dusk or dawn...I always get a clean clear picture and I use a NECG gold faced partridge front post sight. It is quick and slick. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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