While I recognize that converting Savage 99 rotary magazine action is acknowledged to be a major headache, what's the skinny on - what appears to be - a nearly non-invasive, simple conversion, such as 300 Savage to 308 Winchester?

Would there be significant differences in difficulty/complexity between side lever safety and tang safety models? Between brass rotor and aluminum rotor models?

The problem is rotor length. The .308s have longer rotors than the .300 Savages. Savage modified the action to use the longer rotors when they began to chamber for the 7-08, .284 Win., .308, and .358 Winchester.

I don't know where you could get one of the longer rotors, nor how much work it would take to make it fit and function in the earlier Savage actions. I do know it wouldn't be cheap to get someone to make you just one of those rotors.

Even with the longer rotor in hand, questions might still arise about clearance for loading and/or ejection.

can work, cheaper to sell 300 and buy 308

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
can work, cheaper to sell 300 and buy 308

I agree...

OR, just buy a bunch of 300 Savage "stuff", either factory loaded ammo, or reloading supplies.

Cheaper yet to buy 300 savage reloading stuff. I have used my 99 in 300 to take a lot of game.

The problem may not just be with the rotary magazine feeding the round. If it's not a solid frame 99 I wouldn't recommend doing it. Check to see which 99 you have first. Paul.

I have a .308 for sale, drop me a line if you're interested in a trade.

Many thanks for the information.

I may be wrong but I seem to remember the guys on the 99BBS saying that Savage adjusted the metallurgy of their 99 actions when they introduced the .308 family. If your gun is an older .300 Sav. you may want to check that out.

For heaven's sake, why would you want to ruin a great .300S by turning it into a pedestrian .308?

There should never have been a .308. The .300 Savage was everything the .308 sought to be. The Savage is a more "modern" design with less case taper and a sharper shoulder, which give its shorter case virtually the same capacity as the longer .308.

Napthali, post your question on 24hourcampfire.com, Savage collectors forum. That is where the trueblue 99 guys lurk. My impression is that the .300 to .308 conversion is close to impossible .... ask them. RecoilRob, there was a change in heat treatment at ser. no. 266,000, decades before the .308. Savage would retember your action for five or ten bucks, I have a service department letter. Don't know if any change was made when the .308 came in, again, ask the experts.

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
For heaven's sake, why would you want to ruin a great .300S by turning it into a pedestrian .308?

There should never have been a .308. The .300 Savage was everything the .308 sought to be. The Savage is a more "modern" design with less case taper and a sharper shoulder, which give its shorter case virtually the same capacity as the longer .308.

Geesh, they you go again! Let's see, the .300 Savage has less case capacity, less velocity capability, and less accuracy than a .308, other than those MINOR details why would anyone want the superior cartridge, the .308 Winchester?

Hey Naphtali, The conversion can be made with extra $$$spent$$$, but the real trade off is very short Case Life.

300Sav Case Life is short enough as is in a M99 with the Rear Lock-Up. I always used Cases made from once-fired Military 308Win in order to get the stouter Cases. It was a lot of trimming, but I typically got 2-3 more firings per Case over the regular civilian 300Sav Cases.

Once you go to the 308Win level of Pressure, that speeds up the reduced Case Life process. If you do not Reload, then it would not matter and the cost of the conversion "might" be worth the time and $$$money$$$. But if you do Reload, the result is not as great as it first appears to be.

Best of luck with which ever way you go.

There certainly was a change in metallurgy when they introduced the 99 in 243 and 308 .If you have to have a 308 trade off !

I have the same problem, I've been considering using 30-30 Win. after some lenght sizing of the neck. It isn't perfect but I think close enough & 30-30 is very common. Any comments on this? --- John303.

quote:

Originally posted by mete:
There certainly was a change in metallurgy when they introduced the 99 in 243 and 308 .If you have to have a 308 trade off !

Yup and even after the new metallurgy the 99 Savage does not have a lot of safety error. The new models may be adequate for .308 pressures but with very little to spare.

quote:

Originally posted by Gatogordo:

quote:

Originally posted by Stonecreek:
For heaven's sake, why would you want to ruin a great .300S by turning it into a pedestrian .308?

There should never have been a .308. The .300 Savage was everything the .308 sought to be. The Savage is a more "modern" design with less case taper and a sharper shoulder, which give its shorter case virtually the same capacity as the longer .308.

Geesh, they you go again! Let's see, the .300 Savage has less case capacity, less velocity capability, and less accuracy than a .308, other than those MINOR details why would anyone want the superior cartridge, the .308 Winchester?

Yeah, I used to think that, too. Then I came by a .300 Savage and began comparing cases. What you say about case capacity and velocity is true -- but only marginally. The capacities are so close that, using the same powders at the same pressures, the difference in velocities is de minimus, perhaps 25 fps or so.

While the .308 is loaded to significantly higher pressures than the Savage, when the two cartridges are in the same gun they should be loaded to the same pressures and would be ballistically essentially identical.

As I say, although it preceded the .308 by decades, the .300 Savage has the attributes considered more modern, i.e., less case taper, a sharper shoulder, and a shorter neck. This produces a case with the maximum capacity for its length.

My assumption is the reason the military adopted the .308 in lieu of the existing .300 Savage is that there was some trepidation about its straight walls and sharp shoulder giving either feeding problems, or alternatively, extraction problems when loaded to military standard pressures around 55,000 psi. Or maybe they didn't want high pressure military ammunition finding its way into decades old lever action rifles, thus changed the dimensions. Or maybe the private contractors who get paid to design such things couldn't charge much for simply handing the military a set of drawings for a cartridge which already existed.

At any rate, the only reason I can think of to alter a .300S to a .308W would be if a person's only alternative was factory ammunition and he wanted the extra power .308 factory loads provide over those for .300S.

There, I've gone again .

Here's a photo of a .308 on the left and a .300 Savage case on the right. If you'll note the location of the juncture of the body and the shoulder on the .300S, you find it is almost exactly in the same place as that of the .308W. The only difference in case capacity measured to the neck/shoulder junction would be the tiny amount represented by the more tapered shoulder of the .308W. I haven't tried the messy process of measuring water weight to the base of the neck, but by looking at the cases I can see that it would be difficult to actually measure the difference. Incidentally, with these two particular cases, the .300 mikes .008" larger at the shoulder, giving it a tiny advantage in case capacity at that point.

I wouldn't be surprised to find that heavy military .308 cases actually have LESS capacity, measured to the neck/shoulder junction, than a lighter commercial .300S. Like I say, the ballistic differnce in these is negligible.

If you believe that the longer neck of the .308 is somehow advantageous, I won't argue with you. However, I suspect that the impetus for rechambering a .300S to a .308W was not about the unhappiness of the owner with the short .300S neck.

Oh wow! I just tried filling each of the cases in the photo above with H414, a spherical powder that packs very evenly.

The .308 case is a military LC 84 and holds 46.3 grains of H414 level with the base of the neck when settled by tapping the base gently twice on the bench. The .300 Savage, which is a commercial Federal case holds 46.5 grains measured the same way.

I'm sure that the average capacity of .308W commercial cases exceeds that of .300S cases by a tad, but the above test demonstrates just how close the two cases are in real world capacity.

Somewhat of an error in my previous post, brain was in neutral from lack of coffee. My problem is lack .303 Savage brass / ammo. for which the 30-30 seems a good donor. Sorry, how do I remove both posts. --- John303.