Just how many setups are needed on a 4 axis CNC mill to machine a one piece bottm metal?

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Just how many setups are needed on a 4 axis CNC mill to machine a one piece bottm metal?

Rusty

You are the expert on this. Why don't you tell us? What do you think you could make a one piece Mauser bottom metal for on your machines?

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 22WRF:
Woodjack....I am looking and looking and looking at that Fisher "Mauser" and finally I figured out what I wasn't seeing was the bolt handle. Left Handed Military Mauser?????? ....Also, correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't that Echols rifle have Thomas Burgess bottom metal on it????[QUOTE]

Fisher LH mauser ? I strongly suspect its just a mirror image of an RH rifle.
next part of your enquiry about the BMetal; [URL=http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i312/snapbox/img004Small-1.jpg ..That could well be TomBurgess BM, obtained through Mr.Echols,the rifle itself aint an Echols creation, but certainly of equal standing.

it is a left handed commerical mauser, top rifle..
you can read the scope name, and no thumbcut

not a mirror image of anything, not a military mauser .. this collage pic is of 2 very different rifles.. the lower is a leupold scope, the upper a sworvski (sp) ... the upper rifle is a flor dles ribbon pattern checkering, the lower a jagged point pattern

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Just how many setups are needed on a 4 axis CNC mill to machine a one piece bottm metal?

It depends on the configuration of the mill and how much you want to spend on the tooling.

Other than broaching or wire EDM of the magazine opening corners a multiaxis mill can be tooled with a pallet or tombstone that only requires the initial set up. After that it requires no setup if you have a pallet storage and retrieval system.
Milling the magazine box portion of Mauser bottom metal is a huge waste of time and materials when a well made sheet metal box can be perfectly functional and more versatile.

One company whose name I cannot remember had 15 wire EDMs used as production machines. Along with the multi-axis mills they had they could flood the planet with bottom metal.

Woodjack
Is that rifle you posted a picture of one that Jerry stocked? Or was just the metalwork done by him. The stock doesn't look anything like any Fisher stock I've ever seen. There are too many parts of that rifle stock that don't look like a Fisher stock. From pitch, detail around the bolt stop, big radius behind the grip cap, nose of the comb in a different spot, forend tip a little long, to the cheekpiece riding a little high???? Even the layout of the wood doesn't match anything I've ever seen from him. (diver) I was thinking it could be an older Fisher, but not with that action.

Any thoughts?

GunMaker,
unfortunately I do not recall/didnt record the full details of that rifles build history.
now a throw back question,
who ever produced LH small ring std.m98 actions?.

While still on the subject of Bottom metals, it seems Brno saw fit to cut costs several yrs ago,... If one was planning on screwing in a decent barrel together with a bit of handsome walnut, such metal improprietry that compromises the bastion of true mauser construction ethics, would need to be be soundly rectified.

quote:

If one was planning on screwing in a decent barrel together with a bit of handsome walnut, such metal improprietry that compromises the bastion of true mauser construction ethics, would need to be be soundly rectified. Big Grin

Woodjack,
In the end you can get anything you want. It is only money.

I could be wrong but I be believe left hand Mauser shown above was stocked by Winston Churchill and the barreled action came out of Fred Wells shop. If it is the same rifle Winston stocked it for David Petal. It is shown in detail in the book Contemporary American Stock-makers.

quote:

Originally posted by DArcy_Echols_Co:
I could be wrong but I be believe left hand Mauser shown above was stocked by Winston Churchill and the barreled action came out of Fred Wells shop. If it is the same rifle Winston stocked it for David Petal. It is shown in detail in the book Contemporary American Stock-makers.

You are correct, D'Arcy. That rifle is indeed the 7x57 in Ron Toews' Contemporary American Stockmakers, pages 46-49. It wore a Leupold at the time the pictures were taken for the book. Origins of components and owner were as you described.

Thanks Mr.Echols for the enlightenment. Its apparent I was grossly missinformed in the past.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by ireload2:
Woodjack,
In the end you can get anything you want. It is only money.[QUOTE]

I agree, and when I consider the sometimes large amounts of money spent(and often large proportions of it lost) on the many other of lifes consumables that pass through our hands, a decent one piece bottom metal that one may have for many years seems very reasonable...even when I only consider the money Ive lost on trading numerous factory rifles yrs back,I realized, had I just grabbed a mauser,a Mcmillan,a Blackburn bottom & a quality new tube,Id have had a decent sound rig first up and be no worse off finacially.

22WRF,
Sorry, I've never made one. Just asking. I thought someone might have the knowledge.

quote:

Originally posted by Rusty:
Just how many setups are needed on a 4 axis CNC mill to machine a one piece bottm metal?

3 operations for the guard and 3 for the floorplate. One 3axis op for the guard and 2 4th axis ops. One 3axis for the floorplate and 2 4th axis ops.

The latch takes two setups that are both 3axis.

The hinge pins of course require only a lathe op.

Then there is hand-fitting, polishing, vibratory tumblers, sanding, and final assembly.
If it's not right, it gets worked over again, until it is.

To do it right, it's a lot of work, which is why you don't see very many in the business and only one that brings a high quality part at a price an average guy can afford.

quote:

Then there is hand-fitting, polishing, vibratory tumblers, sanding, and final assembly.
If it's not right, it gets worked over again, until it is.

I always thought it would be a good idea to let the programmer do the deburring, hand finishing and hand fitting until he gets the program right...hehe.

He does...........


For some reason, folks frown on chamfers and radiuses around their bottom metal where it meets the wood.

quote:

GunMaker,
unfortunately I do not recall/didnt record the full details of that rifles build history.
now a throw back question,
who ever produced LH small ring std.m98 actions?.

If I remember correctly, Robert West, who used to work for P.O.Ackley, said that P.O. contracted with some outfit in China for left hand Mauser acctions and had a number of them imported. I saw one on Robert's table at the ACGG expo a few years ago.

Matt,
Thank you!

quote:

Originally posted by Jim Kobe:

quote:

GunMaker,
unfortunately I do not recall/didnt record the full details of that rifles build history.
now a throw back question,
who ever produced LH small ring std.m98 actions?.

If I remember correctly, Robert West, who used to work for P.O.Ackley, said that P.O. contracted with some outfit in China for left hand Mauser acctions and had a number of them imported. I saw one on Robert's table at the ACGG expo a few years ago.

Jim,
I remember that Ackley imported some Mausers from Japan. At that time Ackley had been writing in Guns & Ammo. I am pretty sure that is where I saw the info. I have been hitting guns shows for 30 years but I have never seen one.

quote:

Originally posted by triggerguard1:
He does...........


For some reason, folks frown on chamfers and radiuses around their bottom metal where it meets the wood.

I understand that. I deburred my own parts for 5+ years in the days before CNC. Did my own setup measuring and inspection too. If we made and sent bad parts out we were gone....

D'Arcy is correct. The Winston Churchiill rifle is indeed a 7 X 57 on a Fred Wells action. The stock was a stunning piece of New Zealland walnut (much nicer than the photo indicates) that was more of a caramel color that the pics show. I saw the rifle on display at Joe Oakley's booth at the 1978 NRA Convention in Salt Lake City.