I'm always tinkering with something strange. Let me tell you what I'm trying to end up with and then I'll ask the question.

One of my granddad's unfinished projects was a '94 Swede with good rifling, but a dark bore. Might shoot fine the way it is, but I don't want to do a bunch of stock work to find out that it won't shoot and I have to find a barrel. Been looking for a different carbine barrel with no luck. He had purchased a mannlicher style tiger stripe maple partially inletted stock, complete with a rollover comb and wundhammer swell. (don't know if I'll keep the mannlicher part though) He had added a Timney trigger and I'll add a cock on open kit and probably a 1.5-5X scope. I want a light-weight, accurate, fun plinker with deep blue metal and a scorched finish on the wood. Something pretty racey looking that can be used occassionally on the local Columbia Blacktail deer population around here along with the occassional dumb coyote. Something a kid will ENJOY shooting (along with this 47 yr. old kid!)

Now for the crazy question part...how 'bout a Remington 700 take-off barrel with no sights in 7mm-08. Cut the breech end off a little, turn the breech OD to m94 specs, rethread and chamber to 7BR (or maybe 7 IHMSA?). Should end up with a 20" or so barrel. I'm thinking of fluting it...partially to remove weight and partially to try to remove most of the Remington lingo. Perhaps the barrel OD can be turned slightly to clean the wording also. If I keep the Mannlicher style stock, I can just turn the barrel upside down and hide the wording that way. I'm hoping for around 2700 fps with a 120 gr. bullet in a 20" barrel. Any thoughts? Go ahead and tell me I'm crazy!

The thought of a pocketful of 7BR ammo and a lightweight, ZERO recoil rifle sounds pretty fun to me!

If I wanted a 7mm I think I'd stick with 7x57. But the 6,5x55 is a natural in that action.

quote:

Originally posted by 6.5Gibbs:
I'm always tinkering with something strange. Let me tell you what I'm trying to end up with and then I'll ask the question.

One of my granddad's unfinished projects was a '94 Swede with good rifling, but a dark bore. Might shoot fine the way it is, but I don't want to do a bunch of stock work to find out that it won't shoot and I have to find a barrel. Been looking for a different carbine barrel with no luck. He had purchased a mannlicher style tiger stripe maple partially inletted stock, complete with a rollover comb and wundhammer swell. (don't know if I'll keep the mannlicher part though) He had added a Timney trigger and I'll add a cock on open kit and probably a 1.5-5X scope. I want a light-weight, accurate, fun plinker with deep blue metal a scorched finish on the wood. Something pretty racey looking that can be used occassionally on the local Columbia Blacktail deer population around here along with the occassional dumb coyote. Something a kid will ENJOY shooting (along with this 47 yr. old kid!)

Now for the crazy question part...how 'bout a Remington 700 take-off barrel with no sights in 7mm-08. Cut the breech end off a little, turn the breech OD to m94 specs, rethread and chamber to 7BR (or maybe 7 IHMSA?). Should end up with a 20" or so barrel. I'm thinking of fluting it...partially to remove weight and partially to try to remove most of the Remington lingo. Perhaps the barrel OD can be turned slightly to clean the wording also. If I keep the Mannlicher style stock, I can just turn the barrel upside down and hide the wording that way. I'm hoping for around 2700 fps with a 120 gr. bullet in a 20" barrel. Any thoughts? Go ahead and tell me I'm crazy!

The thought of a pocketful of 7BR ammo and a lightweight, ZERO recoil rifle sounds pretty fun to me!

Often times we find our real goal isn't to make a "certain" rifle...it's just to be unique!!

We really need to think about what the real goal is .....and then pursue it to the extent our time and pocketbook allows.

From your post, it seems uniqueness is the goal.

If I'm right...pursue it.....if you truly want a deer rifle a handloaded 7-08 will do what you want!

Yep, you're crazy. It's kind of like putting a Hemi in a VW Bug. You'll never realize the power plant's true performance in that chassis.

quote:

From your post, it seems uniqueness is the goal.

You're 95% right about the uniqueness factor. I don't need a "deer gun". Already got a bunch of 'em. Most of my "shooters" are either SS or matte finished with plastic wood. I keep looking at that tiger striped maple stock and want to build something unique. 6.5x55 would be unique enough and I've already got a 7X57. 7mm-08 would be simpler, but I was shying away from a factory high pressure cartridge even though I reload everything and would keep it safe. (Might keep the "next guy" out of trouble.)(The "next guy" might be a grandson way down the road.) I've got a .300 WBY and .338 Win. for hammers. Guess I was looking for something "cute". (Can't believe I just said that!?)

I was wondering about a cartridge that short in that long of an action. I'm assuming the case will "pop" out of the feed rails pretty easily and will have to slide along for a quite a distance before entering the chamber. Don't know if that will cause a feed problem if it wants to go into the chamber crooked? I might have to load up some dummy rounds and tinker with it first.

6.5

No, you're not crazy. No more so than any of us nuts on this Forum.

One word of caution. The 7BR (and all BRs for that matter) are high-pressure rounds. That's where the performance from such a small case comes from. The 94 Swede is not noted for it's strength. Put the two together and you maight want to reconsider.
JMHO
Ray

Guess what I meant by saying I didn't want to use a "high pressure round" was the possibility of someone down the road buying ammo at Wallyworld for "grandpa's gun". And if they are going to shoot a 7BR they'll have to reload for it and hopefully keep the pressure in check. I assume that the 7BR is pretty efficient, but what velocity could I expect with a 20" barrel and safe m94 pressures? Was thinking that the 7 IHMSA might make more sense here as I have a bigger case to play with, but then I'm headed back to where I started. (larger case) Was trying to come up with something cheap, half way simple and fun in the end.

Also, I know my "chassis" isn't giving the 7BR the best chance to perform up to it's capabilities, but I'm assuming the inherent accuracy and efficiency of the round will still allow it to be a reasonably accurate lil' rifle. (Lot's of .222s and .223s out there with cheapo actions and barrels that shoot reasonably well. Perhaps not as accurate as a .222 is capable of, but better than some other calibers.)

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
Yep, you're crazy. It's kind of like putting a Hemi in a VW Bug. You'll never realize the power plant's true performance in that chassis.

And you'll never finish the day with anything but a big... wide... grin

quote:

It's kind of like putting a Hemi in a VW Bug. You'll never realize the power plant's true performance in that chassis.

Actually I was thinking of it more as putting a 2.0 litre counter-balanced DOHC SPFI 4 cyl. engine in a "slightly" modified VW bug chassis. Let's call it a hi-tech Herbie with a racey paint job! Not quite a '70 Hemi Cuda, but a lot less money.

Yep, I'm probably crazy. I made some dummy cases with 120 gr. V-Max bullets and played with them in the action. Let's just say the action "as is" is long enough to stack them one in front of the other. Could probably put 10 of them in there! I'm not saying 100% no to this, but it would require totally rethinking the bottom metal, spring, follower, etc. Would probably be smarter to find a Rem. Model 7 action or something similar.

I had always thought of a wildcat .22 on the .30 Remington case. Ackley refers to a couple in his volumes I & II. Was thinking the smaller OD of the case might allow one more case in some magazines compared to a 22-250. Make the wildcat case size big enough to simply rechamber a .223 and modify the bolt face. Kind of like a .223 on steroids. Next thing I know I see the Remington 6.8 SPC! Now there's an idea...

I kind of thought about the same sort of thing for a while (and still do). I think you would do better with a model 7 base, or Browning Micro-hunter if someone will do it for you. My idea was a 6.5BR in a very light configuration. Medium range deer loads and some hotter varmint rounds with 85-100 grain bullets.

I know this is convincing only to me, but it is something to think about...

How many "Cherry" 6.5 Swede M94 carbines do you run across at the ranges where you shoot these days? Not many, I'd bet.

If you want something really unique and which will perform perfectly for you, why don't you do a really nice semi-restoration/semi-custom job on that carbine? A nice new stock from your grand-dad's wood, a nice new barrel in the original chambering, a good rust blue job, maybe a Lyman or Redfield receiver sight.... Well, it wouldn't be "original" but it sure would be sweet...and pretty much one-of-a-kind these days.

I had a '94 Swede once with about half that done to it, and even though I've owned guns worth many thousands of dollars each since then, it is one of my previous guns I miss the very most....

Put it in the context of your grandfather about 20 years from now. That original barrel might not be so bad. You can always make up something "unique"
with a gun show acquisition.
I wish I had something like that from my granddad.

Thanks to all that told me I was crazy &/or gave me other input on this. Right now I'm leaning towards leaving it a 6.5 X 55 with the original barrel. Get the stock inletted, but not finished and see how it shoots. If it shoots decent, I'll just leave it. If it doesn't then I might just put an A&B F14 barrel on it and re-inlet the barrel channel. I think the F14 taper will let me do this. I've read varying reports of accuracy capability with the A&B barrels, but I would hope it would still shoot MOA or better.

quote:

I wish I had something like that from my granddad

I'll be a little sentimental here and say my Granddad would have loved this site. He was a bonafide gun/reloading/woodworking nut. Just some of the toys I ended up from him:

03 Springfield with an awesome walnut rollover comb stock he did, Canjar trigger, etc. Still in 30-06, but the barrel has been changed. He used to shoot High Power with it. Later he removed the receiver site and put a scope on it for hunting. Did the barrel and stockwork at that time too.

98 Mauser with a fluted #6 Douglas barrel in 6.5 Gibbs. Again with a wonderful hunk of walnut he worked over.

93 Mauser 7X57, nice trigger, Mannlicher walnut stock with Zebra wood end cap and pistol grip cap. This was supposedly for my daughters, but I always thought that was just an excuse for him to use Grandma's credit card.

93 Mauser in 257 Roberts, again with a decent stock job he did.

He started reloading in 1947 and I've got his original 1947 B&M straightline loading tool w/dies. Also tons of loading and gunsmith manuals, dies, bullets, powder, etc. from the 40s through 80s. He died a couple of years ago at 86 with several unfinished projects. Just trying to finish them the way he would have wanted them.

Funny little side story about him...a few days before he died, I visited him in the nursing home. He had advanced Alzheimers at that stage...he recognized me though and had these questions..."Goin' elk huntin' this year?" (yep) "What weapon you shootin'?" (300 WBY) "Gaads!! That otta be a deadly as hell on elk!" (yep) "What load you shootin'? (180 Barnes TSX BT w/83 gr. of 7828) "Man, that otta turn 'em inside out!" (yep) Then his mind wandered off for a few minutes with a bunch of nonsensical comments and then he asked (again) "Goin' elk hunting this year?!"...had to repeat the story 4 or 5 times. He couldn't remember his butt from a hole in the ground, but he still knew his "weapons". (Comes from that military background...retired USAF Colonel)

Thanks for letting me ramble...

I'd stick with the 6.5x55. Wonderful cartridge and will easily and accurately do all your listed requirements for this rifle. Getting a custom barrel or finding one for that action should not be that hard.

quote:

Originally posted by Cheechako:

One word of caution. The 7BR (and all BRs for that matter) are high-pressure rounds. That's where the performance from such a small case comes from. The 94 Swede is not noted for it's strength. Put the two together and you maight want to reconsider.
JMHO
Ray

HM, well, yes, it is not NOTED, but actual testing have showed very good numbers for those 94's. The chance of spotting a rotten action is always there, but just as likely as with a M98.
From the factory, those 94's have very good steel. I would not worry about preassure of a 7BR.

Bent, Yes the steel is good no doubt but the gas handling of the 96 does not compare to the 98. That is the reason I limit chamberings in 96's to less than 46,000 psi. Not because I'm worried the action will fly apart but because I like my eyes and pretty face, lol. I don't want either messed up if a case head lets go. I have had it happen and have been very happy that the case was a low pressure case vs. 60,000 psi.

Whatever I do with it (same applies to reloads for the 2 M93s I got from him) will be modestly loaded. I wouldn't have considered the 7BR for the m93s, but thought the better steel in the M94 might give me a little more insurance...even though I intend to keep the pressures low. My granddad had a 6.5X55 back in the early 60s and always regretted getting rid of it...thus this project. I've got a couple of boxes of "Match Grade" Norma 6.5X55 brass from him with some reloading data from 1964 written on the box. Kinda curious if his loads from 42 yrs. ago will be decent if I ever get this thing done???

Here's a pic of the two of us in 1987. I took him bear hunting in Montana for his 70th birthday. A special memory...

quote:

but the gas handling of the 96 does not compare to the 98

Not to be a smart ass but I have seen one guy gassed by a 98 and it is nothing to brag about.

6.5 Gibbs, your making the right choice, stay with the 6.5x55. I have one that I have sporterized and it shoots right with my 223 bull barrel and outshoots everything else I own. Course, we will need pics when you get finished.

As to "das handling", the 03 Springfield, and the mod 70 Winchester have identical charistice. Nobody warns about them. Actually you have to work at it to get a case headvto fail.
Good Luck!

That was "Gas Handling" not das handling. My german bloodv crops up from time to time.
Good Luck!

Here are some pics of the "pieces". Gotta change that bolt handle. Any thoughts on ditching the Mannlicher vs. keeping it? Also, I'm not sure what I want to do about the forearm tip (if any) and especially the grip cap. (leave it vs. grip cap vs. flared as is vs. rounded and more squared) Also, I haven't decided on a butt plate/pad. I posted earlier about something "racey". I need to clarify...the maple stock is plenty racey for me. I don't want something gaudy looking. Clean lines, craftsmanship and unique. I'm listening! Thanks

PS My apologies to the guys w/dialup.
PSS I'll be sure to sand off the fly specs!

quote:

Originally posted by hawkins:
As to "gas handling", the 03 Springfield, and the mod 70 Winchester have identical charistice. Nobody warns about them. Actually you have to work at it to get a case headvto fail.
Good Luck!

My point exactly.

6.5 Gibbs: I sent a private message to you but heard nothing back, so am trying this out too. I have a Model 94 Swede that is all matching numbers. Got it as a gift, but before I got it, someone cut the last eight or so inches off the mannlicher stock, got rid of the wood and endcap metal and then painted a damn black forend tip on the bastardized stock. I want to put this little rifle back into original military configuration. If you have the original stock from your Model 94 and wish to sell it I may be interested. Please e-mail me at tom.purdom@sbcglobal.net and I will get back to you. Thanks ... Tom

Oops...sorry 7x57...missed the little blinking blue light thingy. Sorry, but I don't have the original stock. Don't have a clue what happened to it.

Numerich Gun Parts lists barrels for the Model 94 in 6.5x55, 7.62x39, .257 Roberts, 7x57mm. I don't think they have the step in them. All are either 21 inch long or 24 inches long. I think they go for about $125 in the white. I don't know about chambering or any other details. Tom Purdom

Thanks for the info 7X57. I've already looked at them though and they are Adams and Bennett...same as midway sells. I've been told by quite a few people that I need to just try mine and see how it shoots.

I'm getting excited about getting busy on this thing. Thinking about inletting that hard/soft/hard maple is keeping me awake at night though. Guess I better get my tools sharpened...

Okay, you are nuts...

But that is not a bad idea at all!
I like your way of thinking...

257 roberts.

Nice piece of maple, btw
jeffe

quote:

257 roberts.

Got one of those...and a 6mm Rem. on a Mexican Mauser...and a 7X57. See why I was feeling the 6.5X55 might be a little redundant? But I think this 6.5 Swede will still be pretty sweet and different from the others.

Now I'm off to a gun show in Eugene OR to see what other projects I can stir up! Still would like a 7BR someday, but I think only on a super short action with a high quality barrel. Also would like to have a .250 Savage somewhere along the line. Oh so many ideas and so little time or $$$...

The 7mmBR with small primer pocket is capable if very high pressure, depending on how you load it.

If you get bolt lug set back in the 94, you will be sorry.

It's a crap shoot.

A 7x57 could get you the same velocity.
The large primer will fall out before you get the pressure too high.
That should keep you from putting too much force on the old '94 bolt face.