Hello All,

Can anyone tell me of a gunsmith who is "into" building Mausers on the precise style of Pre-War Oberndorf Mauser Sporters, here in The USA? Am interested in having one done to the lines of the large drawing shown inside the cover of; Speed, Schmid and Herrmann's book: "Mauser, Original Orberndorf Sporting Rifles". The catch is that I have an unaltered Siamese Mauser action that seems to feed the .303 British shell and that is what caliber I want it done up in. (I realise the picture is of a square bridge type and the Siamese is a round top so don't anybody get their Bore-Snake in a knot).

I had a fine one built to those specs in .300 H&H, on a 1950s FN commercial Model 98 by a man Named Dave Caboth here in Alaska but he moved to Washington State and last I heard he moved again and is possibly selling insurance in Texas or some such. Dave, if you are reading this, I have gotten over my fascination with double set triggers. You were right all along man. Too many moving parts to remember when Bambi suddenly leaps from cover. (Set triggers really are the solution to a non existant problem).

I will stand by.

Cheers,
Ard.

From what I've seen and heard, Mike McCabe in Colorado could help you out.

contact tiggertate about his information on what the british did doing exactly this

Rem721, you still doing work in retirement or have you quit the business completely?

quote:

Originally posted by rem721:
From what I've seen and heard, Mike McCabe in Colorado could help you out.

Hello rem721,

Thanks for the suggestion. I looked at his web site. The rifle shown with a schnauble forend and full length rib was encouraging. His rendering of the bolt handle however was a bit different than I am looking for, although there is nothing wrong with his style.

I have a CZ .416 with that exact bolt handle welded in place of the puny original and a Model-70 safety installed. I am happy enough with it for what it is however, I wish to have this .303 project "just so" and that will have to include a proper bolt handle as shown in the mentioned drawing.

Do you suppose your Gunsmith would be able to do this up precisely my way? I have found that Gunsmiths will say "yes" to anything but when the day of reconning arrives, things are not always quite right. That is why I mentioned Mr. Caboth. He was pretty good at getting things done, mostly as requested (mostly). I have had one disaster that I had to live with for a long time because the gunsmith, who shall remain nameless, could not duplicate the photo or drawing I left with him.

I am thinking of trying JJ Perredou (SP?) at Champlin Arms. He is a double rifle guy but perhaps he will also know how to do this project as shown in the pic.

Thanks again.
Ard.

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
contact tiggertate about his information on what the british did doing exactly this

Hello jeffeosso,

Thanks for the info. I have sent him a PM. Hopefully he has some photos of his style of work I can see to get a feel for his art.

Ard.

PM returned. Unfortunately I am working with two original Rigby 303 slant-box actions so the hard work was already done in Oberndorf in 1899!

But both of mine had been converted to rimmless in bygone days and had to be modified to feed rimmed cases again. Someone had cut the rimmed bolt head off and very professionally welded a rimmless bolt head back in place. Huntingcat did the work for me to make one feed rimmed cases again but I went with 30-40 Krag on that one.

There are much more qualified folks to give advice than me but I can tell you that rimmed extractors to fit british rounds are scarce as hen's teeth. You would be money and time ahead to look for a period caliber that is a close fit to the Siamese round in rim size.

quote:

Originally posted by Ard:

quote:

Originally posted by rem721:
From what I've seen and heard, Mike McCabe in Colorado could help you out.

Hello rem721,

His rendering of the bolt handle however was a bit different than I am looking for, although there is nothing wrong with his style.

I have a CZ .416 with that exact bolt handle welded in place of the puny original and a Model-70 safety installed. I am happy enough with it for what it is however, I wish to have this .303 project "just so" and that will have to include a proper bolt handle as shown in the mentioned drawing.

Do you suppose your Gunsmith would be able to do this up precisely my way? I have found that Gunsmiths will say "yes" to anything but when the day of reconning arrives, things are not always quite right. That is why I mentioned Mr. Caboth. He was pretty good at getting things done, mostly as requested (mostly). I have had one disaster that I had to live with for a long time because the gunsmith could not duplicate the photo or drawing I left with him.

I am thinking of trying JJ Perredou (SP?) at Champlin Arms. He is a double rifle guy but perhaps he will also know how to do this project as shown in the pic.

Thanks again.
Ard.

The way to find out is to ask him. I suspect that those handles were installed per his customer's requests. I've seen pics of his work where he has done up a replica Oberndorf bolt handle in terms of looks and attachment. I'm sure he's not the only one who can and does do these installations. But, I'm sure he's one of the more affordable.

this should be a trivial bit of work, though opening the bolt face MIGHT be required. have you tried 303 dummies in the siamese?

Mike, Jim Kobe, and tooMany Tools, Malm, and a cast of thousands can do this work.

quote:

Originally posted by Ard:
Hello All,

Can anyone tell me of a gunsmith who is "into" building Mausers on the precise style of Pre-War Oberndorf Mauser Sporters, here in The USA? Am interested in having one done to the lines of the large drawing shown inside the cover of; Speed, Schmid and Herrmann's book: "Mauser, Original Orberndorf Sporting Rifles". The catch is that I have an unaltered Siamese Mauser action that seems to feed the .303 British shell and that is what caliber I want it done up in. (I realise the picture is of a square bridge type and the Siamese is a round top so don't anybody get their Bore-Snake in a knot).

I had a fine one built to those specs in .300 H&H, on a 1950s FN commercial Model 98 by a man Named Dave Caboth here in Alaska but he moved to Washington State and last I heard he moved again and is possibly selling insurance in Texas or some such. Dave, if you are reading this, I have gotten over my fascination with double set triggers. You were right all along man. Too many moving parts to remember when Bambi suddenly leaps from cover. (Set triggers really are the solution to a non existant problem).

I will stand by.

Cheers,
Ard.

Ask Duane Wiebe as I do not feel you could find any one better.

ard , this sounds like a nice project, i,m lucky enough that i own an original 303. by rigby as there are not that many of them in existince .
ive seen many siamese turneed into sporters using the 45-70 chambering , but i would rather the 303.
the important thing as to make it look like a rigby or type A would be getting the bolt handle at the right angle away from the wood , not cut into the stock , if the gun is to be an open sight gun then the shoulder of the handle will not matter i can send you some pics of what the bolt handle should look like finished , a little work on the siamese bottom metel and you should be there ...paul

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
this should be a trivial bit of work, though opening the bolt face MIGHT be required. have you tried 303 dummies in the siamese?

Mike, Jim Kobe, and tooMany Tools, Malm, and a cast of thousands can do this work.

Jeffeosso,

Yes I have run .303 rounds through it and yes they do feed. I am lucky in that regard for a change. One book I read on riflesmithing suggested Siam. Mausers usually do not feed .303 well and that the slight difference in rim dimension works better with the 30-40 Krag or 7x57R and a very few others. Otherwise a new follower or reworking the existing one via trial and error is part of the mess.

If I had a spare 10 or more grand for an original Rigby slant box Mauser in .303 (and if one could be found for sale) I would not be posting this drivel.

As it is, I know I am in for at least half the price of a Rigby but when you get up to 10 Gs and more, half price is very appealing. Especially when I can have a brand new** premium grade barrel in the deal.

Was it Townsend Whelen who said?: **"Only accurate rifles are interesting."

Thanks again.

have you considered using the saimese bottom metal on a m48, a turk 1903 or a fn intermediate action instead of the siamese action. i think it would have a better look when completed than if it was built on a siamese action.
i'm buliding a .303 brit on a 1903 turk high hump with siamese bottom metal right now. the rear action hole on the triggerguard has to be moved back to line up & if the lip on the front of the mag box is filed off flat it lines up almost perfectly with the feedramp.
i have a fn intermediate bolt thats been opened up for the .303 that i need to weld a oberndorf style handle.

Mark Silver makes perfect reproductions of Oberndort prewar sporters.

quote:

Originally posted by dirtyjim:
have you considered using the saimese bottom metal on a m48, a turk 1903 or a fn intermediate action instead of the siamese action. i think it would have a better look when completed than if it was built on a siamese action.
i'm buliding a .303 brit on a 1903 turk high hump with siamese bottom metal right now. the rear action hole on the triggerguard has to be moved back to line up & if the lip on the front of the mag box is filed off flat it lines up almost perfectly with the feedramp.
i have a fn intermediate bolt thats been opened up for the .303 that i need to weld a oberndorf style handle.

dirtyjim,
Nope, I had not thought of using the clever trick you mentioned. At the last gun show I attended though, I saw a Turkish Mauser for only $150. and almost bought it but decided against it at the last minute.

I confess that I did not think of having the two blended into one. I was just planning on removing the firing pin and leaving it so the burglars will think they made off with something. I have several similar dummy guns laying about in case they ever show up while I am at the store or whatever.

I am very fond of the FN actions, especially the 1950s vintage commercial ones. Thanks for your ideas, they are very worthy of future projects. The old Mark-X/Whitworth is sort of a quasi-copy thereof as well and can be put to good use sometimes for not to much money invested prior to the custom work needed.
Thanks again.
Ard.

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
PM returned. Unfortunately I am working with two original Rigby 303 slant-box actions so the hard work was already done in Oberndorf in 1899!

But both of mine had been converted to rimmless in bygone days and had to be modified to feed rimmed cases again. Someone had cut the rimmed bolt head off and very professionally welded a rimmless bolt head back in place. Huntingcat did the work for me to make one feed rimmed cases again but I went with 30-40 Krag on that one.

There are much more qualified folks to give advice than me but I can tell you that rimmed extractors to fit british rounds are scarce as hen's teeth. You would be money and time ahead to look for a period caliber that is a close fit to the Siamese round in rim size.

Hello Triggergate,
I am anything but qualified on gunsmithing either. But just like red wine, whereas I don't claim to know much about it however, I do know what I like to taste when I tip the glass.

Thanks for your suggestions however, I don't want to convert this rather hard to find slant box into some rimless cartridge design. Existing rimless 98 actions abound and in fact I have some in grease for a rainy day. Two of which are my favorites... the 1950s FN Commercial Mod 98. Likewise the current CZ is not too bad if you weld on a proper bolt handle and replace the existing bolt shroud with a Model-70 style one, replace the trigger possibly (I am happy enough with the factory trigger), then reshape or replace the stock. Not a horribly expensive way to get one's mits on a square bridge Mauser type sporting rifle. The ones I have fired have all been exceptionally accurate with the CZ factory barrel by the way.
I have owned a gob of Pre-64 Model 70s and still think they are pretty decent. However, I actually like the CZ a bit better. If nothing else, they have been WAY more accurate than the old Mod-70 in my personal experience. Blah, blah, blah.

I searched in the first place for a long time for an uncut slant box to have a .303 made up before finding this one. Seems like most of them were hacked up by pipe wrench and blow torch garage bench hobbyists in the 70s and 80s but this one miraculously slipped through the cracks. I am only willing to have a proper artist make it into a "replica" for lack of a better term Pre-War Rigby .303 sporter.
Thanks again for your input.
Ard

quote:

Originally posted by PAUL J.A.:
ard , this sounds like a nice project, i,m lucky enough that i own an original 303. by rigby as there are not that many of them in existince .
ive seen many siamese turneed into sporters using the 45-70 chambering , but i would rather the 303.
the important thing as to make it look like a rigby or type A would be getting the bolt handle at the right angle away from the wood , not cut into the stock , if the gun is to be an open sight gun then the shoulder of the handle will not matter i can send you some pics of what the bolt handle should look like finished , a little work on the siamese bottom metel and you should be there ...paul

Hello PAUL J.A.,
The one rifle I had done up to mirror a Pre-War Orberndorf Sporter worked perfectly with a scope in old model Talley low rings, lever type/1980s Zeiss 4x. The Smith had deepened the bolt root notch in the receiver and stock, then welded my handle on lower than rifle actions have today usually. In other words, he did his work according to the original Orberndorf specs. There was no need to grind the handle or any of that nonsense.
Whatever happened to the good old days? How did we get so far off track with these A-bolt/muzzle break and sharp shouldered cartridges and etc?
Oh well.
Ard.

quote:

Originally posted by vigillinus:
Mark Silver makes perfect reproductions of Oberndort prewar sporters.

Vigillinus,
Thanks, I will try to find him on google or some other search engine.
Cheers,
Ard.

quote:

Originally posted by SGYamagishi:

quote:

Originally posted by Ard:
Hello All,

Can anyone tell me of a gunsmith who is "into" building Mausers on the precise style of Pre-War Oberndorf Mauser Sporters, here in The USA? Am interested in having one done to the lines of the large drawing shown inside the cover of; Speed, Schmid and Herrmann's book: "Mauser, Original Orberndorf Sporting Rifles". The catch is that I have an unaltered Siamese Mauser action that seems to feed the .303 British shell and that is what caliber I want it done up in. (I realise the picture is of a square bridge type and the Siamese is a round top so don't anybody get their Bore-Snake in a knot).

I had a fine one built to those specs in .300 H&H, on a 1950s FN commercial Model 98 by a man Named Dave Caboth here in Alaska but he moved to Washington State and last I heard he moved again and is possibly selling insurance in Texas or some such. Dave, if you are reading this, I have gotten over my fascination with double set triggers. You were right all along man. Too many moving parts to remember when Bambi suddenly leaps from cover. (Set triggers really are the solution to a non existant problem).

I will stand by.

Cheers,
Ard.

Ask Duane Wiebe as I do not feel you could find any one better.

Hello SGYamagishi,
Thanks for the suggestion. I have examined Duane Wiebe's art. He is tops (under statement). However, every 98 Mauser I have seen from him has resembled a fancy Model 70 Winchester, for lack of a better term. Nothing wrong with that except this project will be a mirror of the Pre-War Rigby .303 or Orberndorf Sporter or my name isn't Rumplestilskin. Perhaps he can do it, probaly can but not sure. The very last thing I want is a custom Model-70 clone in .303 British. Might give him a call and pick his brain any way. Thanks for the suggestion.
Out,
Ard.

quote:

Originally posted by Ard:

quote:

Originally posted by vigillinus:
Mark Silver makes perfect reproductions of Oberndort prewar sporters.

Vigillinus,
Thanks, I will try to find him on google or some other search engine.
Cheers,
Ard.

Mark Silver. Work doesn't come much better than that.


- stu