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I'm looking to have a custom 7x57 made, and naturally want to do it right the first time. My question is which action to go with? I'm looking to match the action size to the cartridge, thus ruling out all "long action" variants such as the pre-64 M-70, the G33/40, the CZ 550, etc....

Which action is "ideal" for the 7mm Mauser?


Doug
 
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If you want to go all-out, I'd find a clean 1909 Peruvian. A G.33/40 would be just fine. It's long enough for an '06-length cartridge but the scale is just perfect for a 7X57 also. Also, I wouldn't pass on a good BRNO 21 action for the project either.


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or a brazialian 1908, or argentine 1909 ...

if you can find a GREAT 1936 mexican mauser...


opinions vary band of bubbas and STC hunting Club

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Posts: 40229 | Location: Conroe, TX | Registered: 01 June 2002Reply With Quote
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Almost any small ring 98 Mauser style would be appropriate, however my first choice would be a 21H action - small ring double square bridge. --- John303.
 
Posts: 288 | Registered: 26 January 2008Reply With Quote
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g33/40 is ideal for 7x57.
 
Posts: 415 | Location: no-central wisconsin | Registered: 21 October 2008Reply With Quote
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G33/40 and the BRNO 21 are both '06 length actions, so have been eliminated from consideration.

What size actions are the brazialian 1908, the argentine 1909 and the 1936 mexican mauser?

Where's Duane Wiebe when I need him? Big Grin


Doug
 
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The '08 Brazilian and '09 Argentine are standard 98s', the '36 Mex is intermediate.
 
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24/47 or m48 both yugo's will work and both are intermediate size action like the mex.
 
Posts: 130 | Location: Floresville,TX. | Registered: 12 June 2008Reply With Quote
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Some of the "intermediate" actions are complete junk compared to a G.33/40 or a BRNO 21. If you're going to spend what it takes to build a high quality custom on a Mauser action, don't let 1/4" of high quality steel deter you from doing it right.

The "standard-length" M98s were designed for X57 cartridges, I think Paul Mauser himself would tell you they would be eminently suitable for your stated purpose.

quote:
Originally posted by ForrestB:
I happened across this informative post on another site:

http://p223.ezboard.com/fcurioandrelicfirearmsforumfrm4...sage?topicID=1.topic

quote:

M98 STANDARD LENGTH ACTIONS

I am going to group different actions by length, ring diameter, and barrel shank diameter. The first group will be Type I, these are the "most standard" Mausers. Probably 75% or more of all Mausers produced after 1898 will fall into this category. I am not going to list every model, that would take a book of it's own, but if your particular model is not listed, comparing the dimensions will place it into the correct category. So here are the dimensions for

Type I:
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.370
Magazine length: 3.315
Recvr ring dia: 1.410 large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100 large shank

Some of the models that fall into Type I are:
Chilean M1912, Steyr
GEW 98, various mfr's
Brazilian M1908/34, Brno
VZ24, 98/22, 98/29, Brno
M1908 Brazilian, DWM
M1909 Argentine, DWM
M24/30 Venezuelan, FN
M1935 Peruvian, FN
Standard Modell, Mauser Oberndorf
K98k, various mfr's

Remember that the above list is not all-inclusive, the truth is, MOST M98 Mausers fall into this category.


Type II, standard length, small ring, small shank
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.370
Magazine length: 3.315
Recvr ring dia: 1.300 small ring
Barrel shank dia: .980 small shank

This is pretty much a Czechoslovakian design, the main members of this group are the VZ33 and the G33-40, a commercial version is the VZ47.


Type III, standard length, small ring, large shank
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7,835
Bolt body length: 6.370
Magazine length: 3.315
Recvr ring dia: 1.300 small ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100 large shank

As you can see by comparing the receiver ring diameter and the barrel shank diameter, there is not a lot of meat left in this receiver! The main example is the Kar98, and for obvious reasons, it is not wise to rechamber these to a high pressure cartridge.


Type IV, standard length, small ring, small shank, long magazine.
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.370
Magazine length: 3.400
Recvr ring dia: 1.300 small ring
Barrel shank dia: .980 small shank

These are mainly commercial models, they are identical to Type II, with the exception of a longer magazine to handle 30-06 length cartridges. Main examples are the Husqvarna commercial action, and the Brno ZG47.


Type V, standard length, large ring, large shank, long magazine.
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.370
Magazine length: 3.400
Recvr ring dia: 1.410 large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100 large shank

This is a beefier version of the Type IV. It is typified by the late FN commercial actions.


M98 INTERMEDIATE LENGTH ACTIONS

This is actually a fairly small group of models, the amount of headaches these cause (when trying to find a part or stock) is way out of proportion to the number of models. Most of these will have some part of the action shortened to save weight. Starting off with Type VI:

Type VI, Oberndorf intermediate action
Action OAL: 8.750
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.165
Magazine length: 3.115
Receiver ring dia: 1.410, large ring
Barrel shank dia: .980, small shank

I call this the Oberndorf intermediate action, as they are the only ones who produced it. Commonly encountered models include:
1903 Turk
1909 Peruvian
1935 Argentine
Oberndorf Commercial

The 1903 Turk and the 1909 Peruvian also share some other qualities. They both have a very high clip bridge, and a long curved arm on the ejector box that puts pressure on a stripper clip loaded into the receiver, holding it in place. The 1935 Argentine and the Oberndorf commercial action do not have this.
This type has a longer than normal receiver ring, and a longer than normal cocking piece, with a shorter than normal bolt body, hard to figure where the weight savings come in!
The Oberndorf commercial action was also available in a small ring version, all other dimensions identical.


Type VII, FN24 and Yugo actions
Action OAL: 8.500
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.620
Bolt body length: 6.115
Magazine length: 3.232
Recvr ring dia: 1.410, large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100, large shank

This is the FN M24 action, and the Yugoslavian M48 series. I call this group the Yugoslavian intermediate action. There is also a Type VIIA, FN24 Mexican, see below.


Type VIIA, FN24 Mexican
Action OAL: 8.500
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.620
Bolt body length: 6.165
Magazine length: 3.232
Recvr ring dia: 1.410, large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100, large shank

I call the Type VIIA the Mexican large ring action. The only difference between the Type VII and VIIA is the length of the bolt body (0.050 difference).


Type VIII, small ring Mexican
Action OAL: 8.500
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.620
Bolt body length: 6.080
Magazine length: 3.118
Recvr ring dia: 1.300, small ring
Barrel shank dia: .980, small shank

The Type VIII has the shortest bolt body in this group. Common models are the Mexican M1910, and M1936. Either one can be found manufactured by FN or Fabrica de Armas in Mexico City.

LONG AND SHORT ACTIONS

Now we are into the expensive stuff! The long actions and short actions are commercial only. The long actions are divided into 2 types, the "British" type and the French type. The British type are not necessarily made in England, but are usually chambered for British cartridges, such as the .416 Rigby or .404 Jeffery. The French type is even longer than the British type, but the French type is actually made in France.

Type IX, British Type, aka M98 long, aka Commercial Magnum
Action OAL: 9.150
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.835
Bolt body length: 6.770
Magazine length: 3.640/3.840
Recvr ring dia: 1.410, large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.100, large shank


Type X, French Type, aka French Magnum, aka Brevex Magnum
Action OAL: 9.240
Recvr screws, center to center: 8.207
Bolt body length: 6.740
Magazine length: 3.900
Recvr ring dia: 1.500, X-large ring
Barrel shank dia: 1.141, X-large shank.

Notice that the French magnum is larger in every dimension than the British magnum, but the French bolt is shorter by .030"



Type XI, "True" short action, aka Commercial Kurz
Action OAL: 8.125
Recvr screws, center to center: 7.225
Bolt body length: 5.760
Magazine length: 2.725
Recvr ring dia: 1.300, small ring
Barrel shank dia: .980, small shank

These are very rare and expensive, and a collector's item on their own. Chambered for short cartridges such as the .250 Savage, they are so hard to come by that they are often made by cutting down a standard Type I M98 action. If you suspect you have one, look for a welded receiver just forward of the thumb cut. Bolts are usually welded just behind the aft end of the guide rib.


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Posts: 5053 | Location: Muletown | Registered: 07 September 2001Reply With Quote
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If ForrestB suggests a 33/40, well... I'd be inclined to believe him.

He only has the best collection of custom Mausers so far posted on this site.

Personally, I don't expect to ever be able to afford a 33/40.

I do know I'd prefer many other actions to the Yugos.

While the '09 was originally a 7.65x53, shorter than the 8mm, the '08 was 7x57.

Both of these are "standard" length receivers.

But many, many custom 7x57s have been built from these--particularly the '09--which is to say, any rifle built with one would be part of a proud Mauser tradition.

If you're looking for a target rifle, you're not looking for a Mauser.

I believe you've been misled.

flaco

Edited to elaborate:

The 33/40 is a small ring standard length 98 action, which means it's a little lighter than the rest.

These were built at Brno, to a quality arguably as good as Oberndorf.

Guild members have been using 1909s for a coon's age.

Because of the bottom metal, the action of choice.
 
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start here.

CD 308

sell the bbl, the bottom metal and shroud.
 
Posts: 6551 | Location: NY, NY | Registered: 28 November 2005Reply With Quote
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The irony is that those in the know were tickled pink when Mauser offered the 7x57 on a standard length action.

What excatly is it about the standard length action you don't like.

Going with a nice intermediate like a Peruvian makes no sense other than that the magazine length is more in line with those that intermediate 7x57 actions came with. The action itself is as long as a standard 98. The Yufo and FN intermediates are too bulky with their large ring diameters. The Mexican small ring 98's were designed for the 7x57. they would be my first choice if I were not building on a standard length action.

Still, if I had a G33/40, you can bet I'd use it instead.




Aut vincere aut mori
 
Posts: 4869 | Location: Lakewood, CO | Registered: 07 February 2002Reply With Quote
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NYRFlman,
I do understand your desire for an dedicated length receiver.
Kurz length for 250sav and 308win based rounds, have their rightful place as do Intermediate length 7x57 recievers...and make really sweet rigs....thankfully we have the luxury of choice.
I guess Mauser thought Intermediates were a good idea or they would not have created them.
This std.length Brno 21 7x57 you see, I suspect will be redone in an std. length case if I decide to retube.
I have an 7x57/8x57 in the pipeline...based around an dedicated length small ring intermediate.
...'owever, if the lads here convince you into an std length, I have another B21-7x57 that I could offer you....... rotflmo

 
Posts: 9434 | Location: Here & There- | Registered: 14 May 2008Reply With Quote
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Trax, there's no need in forcing someone to do something they don't want to do. NY Rifleman is going to be better off with a Yugo 48, so why don't you send me a PM regarding the B21 you're interested in selling.


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Posts: 5053 | Location: Muletown | Registered: 07 September 2001Reply With Quote
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Gentlemen, thanks for the input. Forrest, thanks for the education, I've saved that to my computer.

If I was to build on an '06 action, I'd build a .280 or 7x64, and already have a custom built by Dennis Erhardt on a 21H in the classic .30-06.

So how does one recognize a "good" Mexican Mauser?


Doug
 
Posts: 862 | Registered: 18 January 2005Reply With Quote
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to eliminate the g33/40 or 1909 from consideration because of it's length is, no flames intended,..... foolish..... you can only benefit from having a little extra mag length with the heavier rounds.
 
Posts: 415 | Location: no-central wisconsin | Registered: 21 October 2008Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by thirdbite:
I've been ignoring what I think is incorrect info for a long time, but unless I'm misreading the action types or have a unique Brno ZG47, they are not small ring actions.


There are several typos or errors in the table. I found the info posted on another site and pasted it verbatim. We could probably all get together and come up with a more accurate table. Would you be willing to give it a start in another thread? I'll bet you get a lot of help. I got a few PMs after the first posting but I didn't make any corrections because it wasn't my table and it was largely accurate.

Thanks for speaking up.


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thirdbite---the 21 is small ring and zg47 large ring of the same vintage of Brnos
 
Posts: 337 | Registered: 23 December 2006Reply With Quote
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Ralf Martini has a G33/40 action for sale on his website. Filed, Talley bases installed and ready to build a 7x57. $2500 as I recall. I have been sorely tempted many times to have him start work on it. The only thing stopping me is the single shot 7x57 on the website that is headed my way in a week or so.

josh
 
Posts: 304 | Location: West Texas | Registered: 01 April 2006Reply With Quote
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I've built 7x57s on both the std and intermediate 98 actions, many rifles in both lengths in many calibers.

If I had a G33/40 action for my next 7x57 then I'd be tickled pink and NEVER look back!

But I'd cut my own throat before paying $2500 for the basic action unless it came with at least one French Maid. Basic action = ~$700-1000 at most, Talley bases = $300 at most, 'filing'(?) is unclear but certainly not worth $1200-$1500. Well, maybe it had some bottom metal, add another $200-$400 or so. Bolt handle and 3-position safety, another $500-$600 or so. I guess a completely finished G33/40 action ready to barrel could be worth that much but IMO it would hafta be finished and complete, needing no further alterations, in order to be worth $2500. Maybe the price was in Canadian $?
Regards, Joe


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Posts: 2756 | Location: deep South | Registered: 09 December 2008Reply With Quote
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2500 Canadian is still around 2300+ US.

What do you guys know about Mexican Mausers?


Doug
 
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I know that one of my mex's is reserved for 7x57....
 
Posts: 1077 | Registered: 04 January 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by nyrifleman:
2500 Canadian is still around 2300+ US.

What do you guys know about Mexican Mausers?


Inquire of TC1. He has had extensive work done on two of them recently. Here are photos of one of them.

http://forums.accuratereloadin...043/m/8401021611/p/1
 
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