A hunting friend and his friends is going to fish in Alaska next summer! He was wooried about bears around rivers, he gone have pepperspray to protect aginst bears does it work on bears? I say it is better with a pumpgun in cal 12 and slug. Is it leagal for Swedes to use such gun for protection in Alaska.

John If you are going to be on the road system or around a few other people I wouldn't even worry about a fireman. Paranoia will destroy ya!

Is your friend going to be employing the services of a guide? If so I would let the guide worry about the bears and your friends can just enjoy the fishing. Pepper spray does work on most bears but it doesn't work on every bear just like it doesn't work on every person.

Most fisherman however, never have a negative encounter with a bear. It can happen but not as frequently as some would have you believe. There is not a grizzly bear behind every bush. It pays to be careful though and carrying pepper spray is a viable option for your friend. I am not up to speed on the firearms laws for visiting guests from other countries.

Alaska is a wonderful experience. I hope your friends have a trip of a lifetime.

Mart

I would recommend that he buy a can of pepper spray once he gets here and to carry that.

I've never had any probs with bears I've encountered while fishing, or course there were other people around the creek and the bear seemed to be uninterested in the fisherman.

Most bear I see out and about take off at the whiff of man anyway.

I got a plott hound from this guy in B.C. and he had hunted brown bear in Sweden, sold dogs to Swedes, and said they have all kinds of short legged grizz in Sweden, and raved about the huge numbers of moose all over the place; no wolves to speak of. Bear in Alaska, probably no more dangerous than those in Sweden.

quote:

Originally posted by Zhurh:
Bear in Alaska, probably no more dangerous than those in Sweden.

Bears in Scandanavia are quite shy of humans--the bold ones were killed off decades ago. Grizzly bears in North America are far more aggressive toward humans.

Pepper spray is considered by the experts to be very effective in most situations. Just be sure the wind won't blow it away from the bear (or back at you). I know from personal experience it is VERY nasty stuff. You don't want even a small dose. Get the largest size you can find--genuine bear spray, not the kind for personal protection from people (it's too weak for bears). Carry it so you always have it available--not in your pack. Practice pulling out the safety tab--so you know how to do it quickly without spraying yourself.

A lot of bears in Alaska have been shot by those with limited experience around bears--who didn't know when to shoot and when not to. Pepper spray is far better to carry if your experience is limited. And, the hassle of dealing with a dead bear (DLP) is more than you want to deal with on an otherwise pleasant day of fishing.

Having said all that, your chances of having to use defensive measures against a bear while fishing are very, very small.

I don't think that the airlines will allow pepper spray even in your checked baggage. Get some here instead.

I think the guys above would agree when I say its fairly easy to at least hedge the odds in your favor against bear attacks here.

Don't fish in the dark. Easy to fish in the daylight when salmon are running. Very easy to suprise at night a bear fishing the same hole you'd like to as the both of you specifically waited 'til late night to try your luck.

Bear aware camp. Bacon cooked to perfection and then moved just outside of lantern light to cool for the evening may allow for an encounter when you head out of lantern light to pee. Keep your camp clean and un inviting to curious bears. I like campfires and big smokey ones at that.

No silent stalking. You aren't hunting so don't sneak around thru the brush. The bears would like to get a little shut eye after being up fishing all night and you waking them up isn't part of their prefered schedule.

If the bear is there and is obviously determined to take your fish, cooler, daypack, beer, whatever, back off and let it have it. If the item in question is a life or death situation it might be different but if the bear feels the same way fighting for it might be more than a vacationing fisherman wants to fool with. Letting the bear win a fight means you can not make the mistake of leaving something out for it again and therefore win the war.

The pepper spray is excellent advise but theres no reason to put yourself in the circumstances of needing it.

The bears do not bother you.. Be aware at all times..Give them space and respect. We seen alot of bears while fishing in Alaska a few years back. I took this video while standing in middle of the river..
Bear
Of couse my 500 S&W was on my side as well...

What part of the state will they be fishing ??

quote:

Pepper spray is considered by the experts to be very effective in most situations

That should be SOME experts.

Mostly pro bear, anti hunting, anti killing the bear experts, who would rather see a human mauled then a dead bear.

They are right in one respect spray is much better for the bear.

I perfer my bear protection to inclued high vel projectiles.

I will plead guilty to being pro-bear - but not anti-hunting - and I still vote for bear spray

I agree with Scott and Phil.

Pepper spray may be better than nothing . . .
But all you libs are making me sick . .
It's getting to be this brain trust is just the liberal end of the commercial services
.
..

quote:

Originally posted by gumboot458:
Pepper spray may be better than nothing . . .
But all you libs are making me sick . .
It's getting to be this brain trust is just the liberal end of the commercial services
.
..

Gumboot,

Nice to see you've improved your literacy and have backed off the ;;;;;gUmmbot,........code talking. Has the "brain trust" been rubbing off on you?

Hard to be sure given the vaugeness of your post but I'm going to assume you disagree with the assertion made by most Alaskans on this thread that pepper spray is a preferable method of bear defense to recommend to tourists. I'll ask why? Do you Gumboot have some sort of experience with pepper spray where you found it deficient? Have you been unable to preserve your health in bear country without the discharge of a firearm?

I'm getting the impression that the only ones advocating magnum firepower bear defense are the ones with no experience.

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
I will plead guilty to being pro-bear - but not anti-hunting - and I still vote for bear spray

I am pro bear also until one trys to do me harm.

So Phil when are you going to stop carring a firearm.

Many are missing the point to pepper spray - it's not necessarily about saving the bear it's about effectively DETERING them.

Anyone who thinks it's easier to get a bullet into a vital location quickly and under duress than to spray a wide stream of pepper spray into a bear's face is either delusional or one heck of a shot.

You can draw your own conclusions.

Bear attacks

My personal choice for bear defense when I'm really concerned about bears is a shotgun with buckshot followed by slugs. I often carry a pistol when fishing but then a I often carry a pistol period. But pepper spray is never a bad idea if you are at all concerned about bear attacks.

In this case, I would recommend the pepper spray. It is just more practical for visitors.

Trying not to have a cuss fit about miss information . And how in our pandering ,entertainment generated society people want everyone to agree with them .

Killing bears is great entertainment . More people should do it .
If someone wants t go fishing up here they ought to pay the $ to insure their saftey by hireing a competent guide . . If they want to do it on the cheap they need to accept they will have to do more work and have more responsibility . Like for their saftey . They stand about a hundred times greater chance of drowning than they do getting mauled .
If they want to fish somewhere that has a dense and agressive bear population they just have to accept responsibility for that decision .

As to what is more effictive . Just try cutting loose with bear mace inside a tent . .

the pepper spray the cops use is very mild compared to bear spray
i suggest someone try a shot of bear spray just a tiny whiff
maybe better than skinning a bear for ADF&G
but make no mistake its going to put you out of action too

Buy a can of bear repellent spray when you arrive in Anchorage. Combine that with a healthy dose of common sense and you'll be good to go. I've fished Alaska a number of times, and only once did we have a firearm present. That gun was a 44 mag that our guide carried, though he told us he'd never come close to having to use it. On that day of fishing, we saw about 15-18 brown bears, some within 15-20 yards of us, and not once did we have a problem. We caught a bunch of reds that day, and just by using common sense and staying where the bears could see us (Phil and others who are familiar with Cook Inlet, we were fishing the mouth of wolverine creek, on the west side) from a distance.

I think the liklihood of a problem with bears while fishing is remote, though always possible. Common sense and not pushing your luck goes a very long way toward ensuring that your encounters with bears are memorable, and for all the right reasons.

quote:

Originally posted by gumboot458:
Trying not to have a cuss fit about miss information . And how in our pandering ,entertainment generated society people want everyone to agree with them .

Killing bears is great entertainment . More people should do it .
If someone wants t go fishing up here they ought to pay the $ to insure their saftey by hireing a competent guide . . If they want to do it on the cheap they need to accept they will have to do more work and have more responsibility . Like for their saftey . They stand about a hundred times greater chance of drowning than they do getting mauled .
If they want to fish somewhere that has a dense and agressive bear population they just have to accept responsibility for that decision .

As to what is more effictive . Just try cutting loose with bear mace inside a tent . .

Its not that everyone should agree its that you're ;;;;;;; wrong//////////!

Touching off a can of pepper spray inside a tent would most likely mean you've made a series of f--k ups that have led you to need to defend yourself against an attacking bear. Howzabout not putting yourself in the position of needing defense from inside the tent?

A friend and I were discussing this issue on the phone this morning and we could recollect exactly one case of tourists doing everything right and never the less being attacked, killed and eaten. In their tent no less. Brooks Range, less than ten years ago, couple cooked dinner in one place, floated down the river to a different place to camp. Bear jumped into the middle of the tent, killed and ate them both. Marlin guide gun in the tent with them, lever rotated open but neither closed loaded or fired. 45-70 wasn't enough gun in that case, but neither would the pepper spray, grenade or stealth fighter air strike have been. In they're very rare case the odd bear was hungry and lightning did strike.

As to whats the most "effictive", brains, lots of them, the kind you use to keep yourself out of trouble.

Couple killed by bear at campsite on Alaska's Hulahula River

Two people camping along the Hulahula River in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge were killed by a grizzly bear, officials said Sunday.

By JEANNETTE J. LEE

The Associated Press



ANCHORAGE, Alaska — Two people camping along the Hulahula River in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge were killed by a grizzly bear, officials said Sunday.

Officials discovered the bodies and an unused firearm in a tent Saturday at a campsite near the river. They also shot and killed the animal.

The couple, whose names were not released, was believed to be in their late 50s or early 60s, North Slope Borough police said. They were from Anchorage and had been on a recreational rafting trip down the river, Alaska State Troopers said.

The victims were in their tent when the attack occurred, according to Tim DeSpain, spokesman for Alaska State Troopers.

The campsite was clean, with food stored in bear-proof containers.

"The initial scene indicates that it was a predatory act by the bear," DeSpain said.

A rafter had seen the animal at the site and notified authorities.

The couple's injuries were consistent with a bear attack and there were no signs of foul play, said Kelly Alzaharna, a lieutenant with the North Slope Borough Police Department.

There were no other people at the campsite, which was about 12 miles up river from Kaktovik, a community of about 300 on Barter Island and the only village in the refuge.

Officials are not sure when the couple was killed.

quote:

Originally posted by PWS:

Anyone who thinks it's easier to get a bullet into a vital location quickly and under duress than to spray a wide stream of pepper spray into a bear's face is either delusional or one heck of a shot.

This is probably the biggest factor. Spray covers a lot of area, where that one bullet, shot under severe stress, hits one spot.

Bears have one of the most sensitive noses there are in the wildlife kingdom, hence the reason that spray is effective.

Headed to Alaska for the first time in August. I'm worried about two things:

1. Bears. I'll carry some spray and do as the Guide directs.

2. Flying in a puddle jumper. Can't do anything about that but suck it up and hope if flys and floats!

Unloadng pepper spray on a bear into strong Alaska wind would seem problematic.

Just sayin'.

quote:

Originally posted by Clem:
Unloadng pepper spray on a bear into strong Alaska wind would seem problematic.

Just sayin'.

Not if they are close enough to do you harm

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:

quote:

Originally posted by Clem:
Unloadng pepper spray on a bear into strong Alaska wind would seem problematic.

Just sayin'.

Not if they are close enough to do you harm

458win correctly stated.

Folk who think a false charge is a charge might attempt to empty the can at 15-20 yds. Bear spray works mighty fine at 5yds in most wind conditions and at 10yds is still quite effective in a 15mph crosswind just by correcting aim like on a golf shot.

My thought was if the wind blows some of the pepper spray back into your face. Now you are blind and at close range to an agitated bear. Nothing is fool proof I suppose.

I knew someone would bring up the headwind issue, so your the one.

In many parts of Alaska bears are just part of the landscape. That is one of the attractions of the state.

Here I am herding kids at my daughter's wedding with a bear 40 yards behind us feeding on vegetation.




Use your head and realize you are in their territory.

Fished the Big Sus, Little Sus and Talkeetna Rivers several years back. Saw fresh bear tracks on shore every morning, in a few of the areas we stopped, but never saw a bear. Our guide was well prepared and ever on guard. Had a very enjoyable trip. Caught Silvers, Sockeyes, Dolly Varden and an Arctic Grayling.

Like mart said, if they have a guide, let him do his job. Hope they enjoy their trip as much as I did. Cannot wait to go back!

Every sailor is at heart a firefighter. You learn firefighting 101 in basic, and every pre-deployment work up period you had back to the fire school.

To me I reckon pepper spray is a lot like the carbon dioxide fire retardants.

It should work, but offers zero re-flash protection. Where if you were using water or AFFF type soap foam material you have the reflash protection.

Sound advice of a lifetime around bears mostly the Greater Yellowstone Eco-system is pepper spray should work, but offers no charge protection. Pistol is ok, shotgun is better, large caliber rifle better yet.

Put me in the firearms camp.

If I'm fishing, bowhunting or backpacking in (even black) bear country, I carry a pistol if I can.

I'm not about to start trouble with a bear when I have a puny pistol, but I want to be able to jam it against him and pull the trigger if he's chewing on my left arm. I get several close encounters a year here in CO wilderness areas - mostly because that's where they release the trouble bears. Never had to shoot one yet, but I sleep better with the pistol.

quote:

Originally posted by MOA TACTICAL:
Every sailor is at heart a firefighter. You learn firefighting 101 in basic, and every pre-deployment work up period you had back to the fire school.

To me I reckon pepper spray is a lot like the carbon dioxide fire retardants.

It should work, but offers zero re-flash protection. Where if you were using water or AFFF type soap foam material you have the reflash protection.

Sound advice of a lifetime around bears mostly the Greater Yellowstone Eco-system is pepper spray should work, but offers no charge protection. Pistol is ok, shotgun is better, large caliber rifle better yet.

I don't believe you're correct. Pepper sray is a pressurized spray and in the event its used in a charge scenario an incoming bear could or hopefully should take a mouthful, eye full, ear, nose and throat full from the pressurized stream. The idea ofcourse is that the bear is blinded, suffocated and stung in the everywhere else all at the same time and is only interested in getting away from the aweful burn from that instant on. I have not had the experience so I really can't say if it'll actually work. I think I'm right but don't know it. i've gathered from your random posts that you've spent the last several years in the military and apparently out of bear country so I'm not under the impression you've much experience either? When was the last time you camped and fished on a salmon stream in bear country MOA?

I'll write it again just for emphasis. In my experience, (see my recent post on Nushagak king fishing for a recent example of experience,)bear encounters can be avoided, (usually,) with simple, practical, logical, reasonable thinking and planning. Clean camps, bear deterents like dogs, campfires and people urine. Don't set up the camp on a fresh moose kill.

Do not! Do not do not do not do not come up here planning, fearing, sweating, wondering, cogitating, formenting or thinking about dlp'ing a bear. It will ruin your trip and you will be sorry. Come up here and use your head, make reasonable decisions about where you go and how you do it and theres an excellent chance that like me you'll have no serious bear conflicts.