40 mile herd is expanding their range it seems; a good thing and a reflection of the good job F&G in Tok is doing; kudos to F&G. Caribou were 3-5 miles outta Eagle crossing the road, haven't been seen there in large numbers for 30 years. Then even more crossed the Yukon downriver from Eagle, and then upriver a few miles. Good to see bou swimming the Yukon; hope it repeats nx fall.

I think the bull only requirement and predator control instituted by F&G is having a positive effect.

Any chance it's just animals moving over to join the herd from somewhere else? I hope you're right!

Brett

Yeah, this movement hasn't been seen from the 40 mile herd in a long time and they are thinking it is because they have over fed their range. Looking like theh 50,000 number might be about the maximum herd size that it can hold. Time will tell. Going to be some good discussion at our AC meeting I'm sure!

Couple days before, they were crossing the road 3-4 miles outta Eagle, heading southeast. We've always seen some in that area, but not in huge numbers. Those caribou crossed the river around Dog Island above the New Village. Indians got around 10 across the river. The larger part of them never crossed the road outside Eagle. They crossed the Yukon downriver from Eagle, between 25 miles clear up to a few miles downriver from town. Locals in town realized they were 40 mile caribou, but once across the river, they are considered the Porcupine Herd so they got a bunch, I figure 30 or so. Anyway you look at it, was a very good thing to see the caribou crossing the Yukon where nobody has seen them in many years.

I just hope they don't change the hunt to a draw from permit. Way it is now, everybody, rural and urban folks get to hunt and the 40 mile herd seems to be doing better. TOK F&G and everybody involved in the 40 mile herd management needs a big Thanks for a good job.

No plan on making it a draw hunt. That would just be a disaster. Just need to shut it down before they are slaughtered like this year. Frustrating to say the least and hopefully will address some of this at our next AC meeting.

Last winter, the BLM People were here in Eagle to meet some select groups (ended up being a few wolf luvers and they also went out the village). None of the hunter types got wind of the meeting which was about trails, atvs, access of course. I guess the Feds don't want hunters just riding just anywhere up on the summit, but on a few designated trails then walking & packing. Maybe that's ok for the young guys, but the older you get, the more you need atvs to get meat out. I guess the BLM People were drumming up local support for their restriction plan concerning trails. Couple of the local Indians were telling me about it and then I filled them in on
the bad side of it all. Not many of the local Indians use 4 wheelers so they were somewhat receptive to the BLM's goofy idears. You all are probably seeing the same going on down outside of Tok.

The locals like the early caribou subsistence season on federal land; always complaining about the ever increasing numbers of urban hunters showing up on the Taylor and around the Y. I look for the feds to play user groups against each other. I keep telling all the locals we all have to share the resource or in the end; we'll all get shut out. Last few years, state & feds have worked together, hope it doesn't change; hope the permit hunts continue too for everybody that wants to hunt.

Caribou from 40 mile herd migrating back into Alaska from Canada last week or so. Good to see, the young bulls & so many calves had made it, like old friends. AKF&G and people involved with growing that herd are doing a good job with management. I've been seeing groups in woods behind the house, tracks in my yard from during the night. Rode 4 wheeler down to the river and caught 20-30 bedded on the ice, enjoying the morning sunshine. Stopped about 100 yards from them so they didn't spook and looked them over.

Pretty wide migration, as they work their way down all the creeks that feed the Yukon. Maybe we'll see over 100,000 in the herd in a few years.

good news for sure - how's ice out looking up there, herein mn the southern part is open the the northern part is still getting snow -looks like it will be at least 3 weeks yet for them

Going down to 25 every night, up to 50 during the day here along the upper Yukon. Some creeks running and water on Yukon, but ice out is probably 3 weeks away unless we get real warm spell & rain. I propped up the Skandic for summer other day, guess winter is over. We don't have much of a Spring, usually plant taters May 12th just in case we have July frost; at least then I'll have some medium potatoes.

The animals know the seasons better than we do. I've watched moose single file it across the river (10 of them) when I wouldn't get near the ice; old bull out in front. I have even seen tape of caribou on ice flows floating by during ice out; I bet they didn't make it though.

If I can get some picts of caribou, I'll post.

I watched this show about Mule Deer on PBS channel last week. This Hutto guy was friends with the herd, walked around with them. I've seen certain Indians that were close to local animals, but not many (they eat everything), other than talking to the bears; which most Indians I know do. Crazy ain't it? I shoot most very bear I can; dangerous pests.

well old puxwanny phil - that groundhog that predicted winter would be over already was found dead of a self inflected gunshot wound
serves the lynin little bastard right

quote:

Maybe we'll see over 100,000 in the herd in a few years.

Let's hope not! The last time there were that many in the Fortymile herd it crashed. The Nelchina Herd crashed from 80,000 to 8000, 1966-1972. Tanana Flats moose went from 23,000 to 2800, 1965-1975. Too much of a good thing is not good. Overuse of the range takes years to recover.

The intensive management advocates weren't around to see the crashes in the 1970s that followed the highs of the 1960s. They ignore history. Intensive management unless carefully regulated just sets up crashes when bad winters hit. In Alaska, we've had low moose and caribou in recent years and don't realize that too many animals is as bad as too few. Some always use the "good old days' as a goal to get back to. Big mistake.

quote:

Originally posted by vicvanb:

quote:

Maybe we'll see over 100,000 in the herd in a few years.

Let's hope not! The last time there were that many in the Fortymile herd it crashed. The Nelchina Herd crashed from 80,000 to 8000, 1966-1972. Tanana Flats moose went from 23,000 to 2800, 1965-1975. Too much of a good thing is not good. Overuse of the range takes years to recover.

The intensive management advocates weren't around to see the crashes in the 1970s that followed the highs of the 1960s. They ignore history. Intensive management unless carefully regulated just sets up crashes when bad winters hit. In Alaska, we've had low moose and caribou in recent years and don't realize that too many animals is as bad as too few. Some always use the "good old days' as a goal to get back to. Big mistake.

Mulchatna Herd is another good example.

Butch, you are a funny boy!

You can thank the Yukon too as they have chosen a "0" harvest level although they are entitled to a quota in the management scheme. Thanks to Alaska for getting things going.

There once was a time, boat traffic was stopped for days as the caribou swam the Yukon in Dawson. The caribou that crossed around Eagle is due to herd expansion. They haven't crossed in Eagle for 30 years; it's a good thing. In 1920's there were 425,000 caribou in the 40 mile herd; how was it they didn't crash back then? The biggest threat to the 40 mile herd is wolves and to lesser extent bear. I bet there isn't 1500-2000 taken by man legally and illegally a year. Wolves really hammer them, no joke.

Lots of Canadians are related to people in Eagle. Often, Dawson folks come down here to hunt & fish when it's restricted in Canada. Sharing is a good thing.

Forty mile went out a day back. Caribou are still out on the ice every afternoon. A few bands up new village too, they are still coming back into Alaska from Canada.

quote:

Originally posted by Zhurh:
In 1920's there were 425,000 caribou in the 40 mile herd; how was it they didn't crash back then?

Read the Fortymile Herd Harvest Management Plan. In the 1920s there may have been 250,000 to 300,000 in the herd (no one really knows as no reliable census data are available). By the 1950s the estimate was 46,000 to 60,000. I'd call that a crash. None of these herds can sustain peak populations very long. Managers should try to prevent herds from reaching unsustainable peaks.

ADF&G did the right thing with the Nelchina Herd in 1996 when 50,000 caribou were present. The Game Board authorized a harvest of 15,000 in one year to bring the herd back to sustainable numbers. They knew that when the herd was 80,000 in the 1960s it was not sustainable and a crash followed. Since 1996, the Nelchina Herd has been kept at about 35,000 which appears sustainable.

Those who think we should manage for the "good old days" of 80,000 Nelchina caribou need to rethink the situation.

35,000? Won't be any Anch, Fairbanks, or outsiders shooting any caribou if that's the case; no joke. Way it is now, locals can start hunting Aug 10th, caribou show up a few days before the hordes of non-subsistence hunters show up around the 25th of August. AKF&G wants 3-4 hundred shot and in two days you have close to 800-1000 shot off; and the locals shoot what they want too, that will never be stopped or controlled. F&G can't keep the harvest down under 300-400 without making it a draw hunt & nobody wants that. I'm glad to see all the outsiders get a chance to shoot one, but without increasing the numbers the 40 mile hunt can't continue where anybody can pick up a permit and the outsiders will be the first to get restricted.

Vic, I know you know some of what you speak, but no joke, I believe there is room for expansion of the herd. Just like this fall, caribou moved 50 miles north and came through; crossed down river in Eagle. Locals shot maybe 50 on the river and out village. Bou haven't been seen in same area in 30 years; so how can they starve themselves out?

I've had all around the house last week or so, nice seeing them in the yard. I do believe the wolves hammer the heck outta them too. Anybody ever wants to shoot a wolf, just wait until caribou are migrating across the Taylor, sit down a good crossing and every few hours, you'll see wolves.

Also remember what occurred to all the caribou out Eureka in 1980s with the advent of 3 & 4 wheelers and a liberal hunting policy.

Also the cow moose hunts in the MatSu cause F&G is in terror of a winter kill, people demand cow tags, got to shoot all the cows. Then you have outsiders shooting cows in your driveway and no spikes a year or so later.

I'm just happy to see the old friends coming back in from Canada.

River went out on Thursday. Bou have been bedding on ice last few weeks. So we were heading to our place tonight, and I saw 6-7 caribou go floating by on ice block about the size of a truck. They looked scared but weren't about to leap in the ice & water, so I took picts and will post on Sunday. First time I have personally seen caribou go floating by on an ice flow.

They look like they know what their doing too.

Zhurh,

That's a great photo. I saw it in the Fairbanks Daily News Miner the other day. I hope they float close to shore at some point and get off the ice pack rather than float downstream into the jaws of some hungry wolves or bears.

Speaking of wolves, I'd love to shoot one. Are there really that many around when the caribou are migrating over the Taylor Highway? All these years I've hunted the state I've only seen a wolf twice, although I have heard them howling on many nights. If the Taylor is a good bet I may just have to give it a try this fall.

I emailed it to Tok F&G and they asked if they could use it, I said ok with me, probably how it got into the Miner.

I have buddies that live out Chena Road and they get wolves just driving up haul road and other rural highways. Whenever they see places where caribou are crossing, also rabbit tracks, and food supply; they park and wait. The wolves follow the caribou. Last winter, they were sitting outside their truck and 9 wolves crossed road not 100 yards from where they were parked, they got 3 of them.

Jack Wade area is good area to see wolves when caribou are coming through. Before caribou season, when caribou are already migrating, you'll see wolves cross. Just have to set down and wait, or drive slow & glass.

You'd be surprised though, I heard there were wolves right around North Pole, killing dogs and such.

Zhurh,

Once I saw your photos I figured the pic came from you. That's a once in a lifetime series of shots.

I appreciate the tip on the Jack Wade area. In the past, there has been some wolf activity where I live but nothing you can really count on.

Since my only hunt this year will be Prince of Wales for blacktails, I think I'll make it a point to go out and specifically look for a good wolf. Thanks again for the info.

My nephew got a couple goats on Kodiac in October, then got skunked on deer on Prince of Wales, he was shocked to say the least. Told me he heard people shooting after dark, saw lights; so figured they do it different down there.

People shooting after dark? That doesn't sound good to me.

This will be my first trip there and I'm goin in 4 days early to make sure I have plenty of time to scout and hunt. I'd rather hunt Montague Island but the deer got hammered with extreme snowfall a couple years back and I don't think they have recovered yet.

ADFG does pellet counts in the spring on Montague so that should give us some idea of how the deer population is recovering.

ADFG didn't allow the hunting of does on Montague last year so hopefully that will also help speed up their recovery.