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http://triplecoutfittersalaska...earoverbaithunt.html I saw the ad in "Slamquest" magazine for Alaskan Brown Bear over bait and take bears the same day as airborne. Is this because there are so many bears in this area? Kathi kathi@wildtravel.net 708-425-3552 "The world is a book, and those who do not travel read only one page." | ||
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It's needed in places like 16B this is a good thing! Double Rifles, This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight. Not as clumsy or random as bolt rifle. An elegant weapon for a more civilized age. DRSS Chapuis 9.3x74R NRA Life Member | |||
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Many areas in the state are interested in reducing predator numbers in an effort to increase ungulate numbers. | |||
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I guess now the scared and the out of shape hunters can get a brown bear now. Baited hunts should be for disabled only in my opinion. Mind you sitting in a tree stand watching a feeder and callingit whitetail hunting rubs me the wrong way as well. Doug McMann www.skinnercreekhunts.com ph# 250-476-1288 Fax # 250-476-1288 PO Box 27 Tatlayoko Lake, BC Canada V0L 1W0 email skinnercreek@telus.net | |||
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Here in 20E, we now can shoot grizz that come into blk bear bait stations, but we are not allowed to specifically bait for grizz; now imagine that. Actually F&G is really a good bunch in our GMU and they are doing everything they can to bring moose & caribou numbers back up where they use to be. People eat moose & caribou (subsistence); they don't eat wolves & grizzy bear all that much. I'm glad F&G is now doing the right thing, they have a long term plan to increase caribou numbers by getting people to stop shooting cows and it's working. Good going F&G. | |||
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I'm not even comment on your first part of this because it just shows your ignorance, as Hunter I want to take the best specimen I can, I want to make sure that it's a mature breeding boar, not a juvenile or substandard more and not a sow. Over bait gives me the opportunity to sit there and watch the animal undisturbed for quite a while, to make sure that it is not sow with cubs. Also tell me what's the difference of of watching a gut pile versus watching a bait pile. There isn't any. Double Rifles, This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight. Not as clumsy or random as bolt rifle. An elegant weapon for a more civilized age. DRSS Chapuis 9.3x74R NRA Life Member | |||
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Not sure what regs you are reading or where it says you can't "specifically bait" for grizz, but in 12 and 20E you can hunt and bait for grizz. You must salvage meat off them. | |||
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I really wish fellow hunters would think twice before posting something like this. If you do not like a certain LEGAL method of hunting then don't do it. It's still hunting to someone else and they have a right to their version of enjoyment. I suspect there are some that think setting a pack of dogs on a wild cat to put it in a tree and then shoot it may not be very sporting. You do it for a living. More power to you and perhaps we may hunt together some day. It's about time hunters unite as just that - hunters. Stop trying to define hunting for anyone else. If it's legal and you don't like it then just don't do it. ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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You're not supposed to hunt brown bear over a gut pile either, so you're right not much difference Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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Chuck, better check your regs for Alaska....This is right from the regs as a definition of Bait. bait - any material, excluding scent lures, placed to attract an animal by its sense of smell or taste; bait does not include those parts of legally taken ani- mals that are not required to be salvaged as edible meat if the parts are not moved from the kill site. Double Rifles, This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight. Not as clumsy or random as bolt rifle. An elegant weapon for a more civilized age. DRSS Chapuis 9.3x74R NRA Life Member | |||
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Northway, I heard it was ok to bait grizz down your way but a few greenies here in Eagle complained so they had to make it only if they came into blk bear station. Now that could be wrong but how I heard it. I hardly read the regs anyway; usually hunt after all the urban hunters leave. Shoot em when ya see em sort of thing. Funny thing that family of greenies also stopped cell phones from coming here; they actually found a legal reason why the deal couldn't go through, had to do with contract. But ya know, when I go into Fairbanks and see all the walkin/talkin zombies going on about their simple lives and swearin out loud in public over their cell phones;;; I'm glad they ain't here. Remember back when cell phones first came out, all the contractors were awful proud of them. Now it's worked it's way down to the White trash in Wally World, ha ha. Where is the world goin? Hope ya see a bunch of grizz in the blueberries come September; I think I will this season. | |||
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Very unprofessional statement by someone who guides hunters. My opinion of you has certainly fallen by this statement. My opinion is that it is harder to stay quiet and motionless in a stand than to run a track meet brush busting behind dogs who will eventually corner an animal. I however, do not mind those who wish to hunt that way where legal. I have tried dog hunting myself as a qualifier. | |||
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It is not the baiting so much I have a problem with it is more the general attitude of hunters that has seemed to have been changing over the last 25 years. It seems now more then ever the hunting industry as a whole is aiming towards making things as easy as possible with little or no effort from the hunter. Whether it be a long range shooting setup, donuts in a barrel or timed feeders you just need to look as far as your local hunting channel to see all this for sale. To me this is a disappointment. I have fond memories as a kid stalking deer with my long bow in the woods on my family farm. The memories would be a whole lot different if I just spent my evenings sitting in a stand. Not everybody lives in an area which is great for stalking like BC and I can see some benefit to using bait in those thick bushed up areas. To me Brown bear and grizzly are North American Holy grail of big game and should be hunted as dangerous game, on foot. It would be like hunting Cape Buffalo from a tree stand , it would no longer be dangerous to the hunter providing you make a good shot. You take the danger factor out of dangerous game hunting and its just hunting. I guess I kind of over reacted and never explained myself very well in my first post. I apologize to those I offended in any way. I hope you can better understand how I see baiting for brown bear. Doug McMann www.skinnercreekhunts.com ph# 250-476-1288 Fax # 250-476-1288 PO Box 27 Tatlayoko Lake, BC Canada V0L 1W0 email skinnercreek@telus.net | |||
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I do understand what you are saying, but in most cases baiting is the only way to get rid of big numbers of bears. These are in areas where the numbers are very high and they are really hurting moose populations. It really is the only method besides aerial shooting, or foot snaring which may end up in one of our areas. | |||
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Dont forget that the area is so thick that you might as well hunt them with a bayonet then a rifle! THere is no spot in stalk! Double Rifles, This is the weapon of a Jedi Knight. Not as clumsy or random as bolt rifle. An elegant weapon for a more civilized age. DRSS Chapuis 9.3x74R NRA Life Member | |||
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Very true! Good point! Basically if you see a bear around here, it is either in a berry patch up HIGH or on a moose kill. There is just too much cover to kill enough bears needed in certain areas and access can be awfully limited in addition to that. | |||
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Sorry, what I meant to say is before baiting brown bear was legal leaving a gut pile on purpose and hunting over it wan't legal. At least that's what I was told when I hunted Togiak a few years ago. My mistake. Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | |||
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Doug, At the end of the day it's what's best for the resource. If AKF&G decides to bait for brown bears in an area or two you can damn well bet there are WAY TOO MANY brown bears. I for one will see what I can do this fall to thin the herd on the Kenai Peninsula. I'll be stalking/glassing salmon streams, but who cares. As Jim says if its legal and ok for the resource live and let live. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Understandable Brett, if this is the easiest management tool then this is what need to happen. Something like our wolves doen here. We trap, which helps but every legal method must be used to control the populations. Doug McMann www.skinnercreekhunts.com ph# 250-476-1288 Fax # 250-476-1288 PO Box 27 Tatlayoko Lake, BC Canada V0L 1W0 email skinnercreek@telus.net | |||
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I have got to apologize for this comment, after a rough week I spouted off with out thinking. I usually voice my opinion when talking polotics not hunting. I just spent the last two days in the mountains riding and gave this some thought. Management comes first and baiting is used for management in this case much like my wolf baiting here at home. As far being scared or out of shape this was a crappy thing to say. I have never sat in a stand and to be truthful don't understand the how it could be exciting, but stand hunting is not common in my part of the world and if I need to sit in a stand to be successful I would probably think different. As far as being scared hunters, I see all types when the going gets tough. Most are not scared but overly excited would be a better way to put it. One time nearly costing me my life. I once again apologize for this comment, anyone that has hunted with me knows it that it is totally out of character. Now talking politics is another story. Doug McMann www.skinnercreekhunts.com ph# 250-476-1288 Fax # 250-476-1288 PO Box 27 Tatlayoko Lake, BC Canada V0L 1W0 email skinnercreek@telus.net | |||
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Doug I suspect we would get along just fine on a hunt. Nice job of manning up. Cheers Jim ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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Very well said Jim and thank you. "If you are not working to protect hunting, then you are working to destroy it". Fred Bear | |||
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FYI.....I love to black bear hunt. I've shot two now. My favorite thing is spot and stock hunting. A couple years ago a friend invited me on a baited hunt with a friend of his who had bait stations with tree stands set up. Honestly I'd always looked down on baiting bears as a lesser hunting method when compared to spot and stock. Well I was pleasantly surprised! Viewing many bears at close quarters was a hoot! I was entertained from start to finish and got some fabulous pictures. I'm not likely to give up spot and stalk hunting, but I sure understand now why some people enjoy baiting so much. It would be an amazing experience for kids. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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I see where you apologized for this statement and walked it back. I appreciate that. However, one must realize that things are done differently in different parts of the country, or world for that matter, often for very good reasons. For instance, the spot and stalk method for whitetail in the south Texas brush country is an absolute impossibility in most of those areas. In many places, simply walking through the thick vegetation is impossible, unless you crawl on your hands and knees along a pig trail! Sitting in a stand is what works best there. Of course, it may not appeal to folks accustomed to hunting by different methods in different parts of the country, but we here in Texas love our whitetail hunting. Again, I'm only making these statements as a way of drawing attention to the need for hunters to be less divisive among ourselves. What's legal in an area is usually legal for a reason. However, there is another angle to this discussion. I certainly enjoy the thrill and challenge of a mountain hunt, during all sorts of bad weather, overcoming obstacles requiring the hunter to employ many of his bushcraft skills, call upon his physical fitness abilities, and the like, but I can't begin to describe the value of mornings and afternoons spent sitting in a deer stand with my father when I was a boy, and now as a father myself with my boys, just taking it easy, appreciating being in each other's company, hoping for the off chance a nice buck will walk into view. Yeah, it isn't the adrenalin filled event of putting the sneak on a 6x6 bull elk after a 4 hour climb in the dark to get to timberline, but there is great value in having that 5 year old boy sitting next to you in a relaxing environment, with him hoping to "spot a deer before Dad does"!! That may not be hunting by some people's standards, but I'll be able to enjoy those cold, crisp mornings, sitting with my son or hopefully one day, grandson, long past the day I can run up and down a mountain chasing a pack of dogs on a lion or bear's trail. In other words, it's all good and I hope we can learn to appreciate it all instead of dividing which activities are "hunting" and which are "not"! | |||
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Well put Todd, I am more than a little shocked by Doug's statements. Extremely unprofessional, and he came back and defended them before the apology. It's like telling your wife you think she's fat and then saying you didn't really mean it. It's the age old "holyer and than thow" problem. If you don't do it like me then you're not as good a hunter as I am, or REAL hunters don't hunt that way.  What I will never understand is how baiting isn't hunting but shooting them out of a tree is. They justify that by saying its' physically harder. I've had fun hunting both ways. One of my bait bear hunts was one of the most physical hunts I've ever been on because we had to haul 80lbs packs of bait up the mountain to the stand site. I've packed out Moose and Caribou on my back,more than once, but I don't think it's unethical to pack them out on a horse because it's easier. I'm not even gonna mention the "Scared" remark. Sheeeeez this stuff really gets old, it's nothing but arrogance.Jerry Huffaker State, National and World Champion Taxidermist | |||
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This thread brings up a couple of things for me. One is there seems to be an element in the hunting community that sees hunting as a way for a guy/gal to test their metal against the wild beast. To me hunitng has never been about that but more about outsmarting the animal in its own enviroment. Sometimes that involves a small element of danger but I don't find it necessary to create a more dangerous situation than necessary to feel I have hunted. Hunting over bait is just the most efficient way to hunt some types of game (read that as outsmarting the prey). Often these aniamls are nearly impossible to hunt by other methods. Take the African lion for instance. In most of Southern Africa you find the lion in forested areas with grassy or rocky ground. You just can't track a lion in that kind of enviroment nor are you likely to spot a lion where he can be stalked. Also in the case of the lion a baited situation ofers a much better opportuntiy to judge the lions maturity. This continuing disagreemant about what is hunting or not does nothing but cause a divide between hunters when we should be standing together against the antis. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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Also as a management tool baiting is much better than spot and stock (my preference) because it allows you a good chance to evaluate sex and age as well as verify sows don't really have a cub. Spot and stalk can be and usually is much more difficult to age, sex, and tell if their are cubs due to distance, time, and vegetation around the animal that could obscure cubs. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Brett, Didn't you say something in the past about your expensive education and spelling? Stock? Stalk I believe.  Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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You should hear him pronounce "water". ______________________ DRSS ______________________ Hunt Reports 2015 His & Her Leopards with Derek Littleton of Luwire Safaris - http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/2971090112 2015 Trophy Bull Elephant with CMS http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/1651069012 DIY Brooks Range Sheep Hunt 2013 - http://forums.accuratereloadin...901038191#9901038191 Zambia June/July 2012 with Andrew Baldry - Royal Kafue http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/7971064771 Zambia Sept 2010- Muchinga Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/4211096141 Namibia Sept 2010 - ARUB Safaris http://forums.accuratereloadin...6321043/m/6781076141 | |||
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No no Mark. There's "spot and stalk" and "spot and stock" black bear hunting. "Spot and stock" is were you spot a bear, sneak up, and then beat it in the head with your stock. Obviously you were confused. Brett DRSS Life Member SCI Life Member NRA Life Member WSF Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick. And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too. May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep. May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip. -Seth Peterson | |||
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Brett, My sincerest apologizes. I admit to being completely clueless about the "Spot and Stock" method. Now that is real DG hunting. Mark MARK H. YOUNG MARK'S EXCLUSIVE ADVENTURES 7094 Oakleigh Dr. Las Vegas, NV 89110 Office 702-848-1693 Cell, Whats App, Signal 307-250-1156 PREFERRED E-mail markttc@msn.com Website: myexclusiveadventures.com Skype: markhyhunter Check us out on https://www.facebook.com/pages...ures/627027353990716 | |||
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I've been running bait stations for black bear in unit 16B for years now. I'm also registered as a predator control hunter with ADFG. It's very expensive, time consuming, and a lot of hard work. That being said, I truly love it. We've had great success and spring black bear is one of my favorite game meats. If you've never been to the low lands of south central AK then you probably can't imagine just how dense the under brush is. I have tracked poorly shot bears through shoulder high firn and devils club so thick that when standing in it and you look down you can't see your feet. You find yourself crawling through tunnels under the foliage on your hands and knees trying to follow the blood. Hunting this way is really the most productive way to kill bears in this type of terrane. I've killed bears by other means but if you want to kill bears in 16B, you bait. Now that I've said all that my personal opinion is baiting is not "fair chase". It is a means to an end. In May of 2005 for every 100 cow moose there were 140 calves. By late July of that year there were less than 20 calves per 100 cows. Wolves and bears were taking the calves at a rate that the moose herd could not sustain its self. Now we will be allowed to take brown bear at a black bear bait sight in an attempt to bring there numbers down and to generate more participation in bear baiting. If you kill a brown bear you must follow the same harvest requirements of any black bear killed at your bait. I don't want to eat a 700 pound brown bear. Don't want it in my freezer. I won't value it as a trophy if killed over bait. But I do understand the goal and may or may not kill some this spring. Just haven't decided yet. Steve | |||
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How about this? Who thinks that if you need to hire a guide or an outfitter to hunt you're not a "real" hunter? Or this! A "real" hunter either rides his own horse into a camp he sets up himself or else backpacks in - otherwise how can it be "fair chase?" He wouldn't think of taking a charter flight when he could spend a week or more either riding or hiking into a place to hunt - right? Would a "real" hunter use dogs? Or trail cameras? He certainly wouldn't use a all-terrain vehicle or snow machine - would he? Would a "real" mountain lion hunter scout using a vehicle and communicate with a cell phone or two-way radio -- or would he get on a track and follow it on foot. No dogs - remember he's a "real" hunter who believes in "fair chase". I guess the only "real" hunter's are those who make a living baby sitting old, out-of-shape scarty-cat clients - which affords them the opportunity to make a living doing "real" hunting. Excuse me while I go hire a personal trainer and sell all my firearms and start making some spears. DB Bill aka Bill George | |||
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Just a week ago I confronted a guild who had a client and packer with him from triple c outfitters. They had set up a bait stand across the river from my cabin within 1 mile. He kept saying he didn't want any trouble. Must have known he was illegal. Tore the bait stand down the next day and moved up river. Client even had an accidental discharge while I was there. The owner of triple c was arrested for guiding without a license last year then jumped bail and the troopers are looking for him. Seems like a pretty bad bunch of guys to book with. I got all the numbers off the permit and turned them in to the troopers. Sure hope they do something about it. Steve | |||
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