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I know this is the Alaskan forum but since most of the bear discussion seems to be here thought I'd post this for those who haven't seen it. https://www.foxnews.com/scienc...e-state-of-emergency Regards, Chuck "There's a saying in prize fighting, everyone's got a plan until they get hit" Michael Douglas "The Ghost And The Darkness" | ||
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by chuck375: I know this is the Alaskan forum but since most of the bear discussion seems to be here thought I'd post this for those who haven't seen it. Sounds like Barrow or what ever they call it now? Utqiavik?? Always Bears in town.   | |||
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Serfs are easier to replace than bears.  Grizz Indeed, no human being has yet lived under conditions which, considering the prevailing climates of the past, can be regarded as normal. John E Pfeiffer, The Emergence of Man Those who can't skin, can hold a leg. Abraham Lincoln Only one war at a time. Abe Again. | |||
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A couple of weeks ago a colleague of mine posted a photo of a trio of polar bears across the road from the college in Utqiagvik. Jason "You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core." _______________________ Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt. Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure. -Jason Brown | |||
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Polar bears? Here's how Denmark's soldiers of the Sledge Patrol Sirius, who camp and patrol in the arctic circle region of Greenland, deal with the friskier P-bears: each man is issued an M1917 in 30-06, and a 10mm Glock 20. Helluva combo right there, ... and you don't need to be on the receiving end of a bitch-slap from Chuke to understand it.  Enjoy: https://laststandonzombieislan...glocks-of-greenland/ All The Best ... | |||
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If the 10mm is so great, then why are they issued 30-06 Enfields ? Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Simple, Simon ...  'Cause they aren't always carrying those M1917s around when their hands are busy doing other things.  All The Best ... | |||
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Simple Simon: the question asked by the experienced proven Alaska guide who has actually killed big bears wil a wide variety of weapons including a handgun, was the reverse of what you answered. Sure sign of trolls who specialize in obfuscation. "The liberty enjoyed by the people of these states of worshiping Almighty God agreeably to their conscience, is not only among the choicest of their blessings, but also of their rights." ~George Washington - 1789 | |||
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It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power. | |||
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The difference in penetration between the 9mm and 10mm is only a few mm's Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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funny Phil. in Spitzberg they are issuing 30-06 stainless ruger rifle and no handguns for cruise ship crew going ashore. | |||
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Probably a wise choice. The caliber is adequate and shootable by most folks Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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Actually that's not true, at least to anyone who's actually done extensive penetration testing. As much as you may want to not watch them, YouTube does have vids demonstrating irrefutable evidence of just how far a 10mm projectile will penetrate, which also depends on bullet-weight. "Only accurate rifles are interesting." | |||
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Much more depends on bullet design then weight. All most all FMJ or Lead solids give around 30 inches of penetration in ballistic gel. Except for the smaller caliber slower rounds. With standard bullet weight. Then add a heavy for caliber bullet at the max velocity for that caliber can give you a bit more. But 30 inches is most likely enough. | |||
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I also have over 50 years of irrefutable proof and have thoroughly tested most of the handgun and rifle calibers commonly used in Alaska. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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A quick google search for ballistic gell penetration tests 9MM vs 10MM yielded this " It is quite possible for a strong round to travel through a body and then keep going through a wall. In ballistics gel tests a 9mm would typically travel about 13 inches after impact, while the 10mm was sometimes over 17 inches. This means that a 10mm could potentially travel through two people at center mass and still keep going. That is a huge amount of power. Of course, a lot of factors go into penetration and penetration is not the sole determinant of how effective a round is at disabling or deterring an aggressor." 13" for 9 MM sounds about right to me, apparently several more inches for 10MM. The FBI who did help develop the 10MM (after the 1986 Miami shoot out) along with Col Jeff Cooper's input, the FBI sure did not keep the 10MM in service long, they dropped it like a hot potato. Cold Zero | |||
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The 10mm Auto had to much kick for The F.B.I. That is why The 40 Smith and Wesson was born. Two Different Cartridges all together!!! | |||
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Tests like this are only meaningful if they are using the same ammo you intend to and expanding ammo for protection from human threats is entirely different than full metal jacket or hard cast bullets designed for deep penetration. My test utilized the latter as I was only interested in protection from bears. Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship Phil Shoemaker Alaska Master guide FAA Master pilot NRA Benefactor www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com | |||
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I will say it again it is more about bullet design then caliber. | |||
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I would much rather bet my ass on the 30/06 than any pistol. I would even correct that to read a 30/30 over ANY pistol. | |||
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But rifles are not as handy to have with you all the time. Plus handguns have very good record of stopping bears in self-defense situations. | |||
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Which was the point made earlier in this thread, but apparently those challenged with reading-comprehension issues missed it. Nobody has a rifle in their hands all the time when they're outdoors; but they can have a pistol or revolver holstered on their hip or in a center chest rig.
True. "Only accurate rifles are interesting." | |||
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Interesting point about this is their government has asked the patrol several times if they wanted to change to a more modern rifle and cartridge but their answer has always been - no thanks. Roger ___________________________ I'm a trophy hunter - until something better comes along. *we band of 45-70ers* | |||
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