Polar bears

11 February 2019, 07:44

tsturm

[QUOTE]Originally posted by chuck375:
I know this is the Alaskan forum but since most of the bear discussion seems to be here thought I'd post this for those who haven't seen it.

Sounds like Barrow or what ever they call it now? Utqiavik?? Always Bears in town.

11 February 2019, 23:45

Grizzly Adams

Serfs are easier to replace than bears.

Grizz

Indeed, no human being has yet lived under conditions which, considering the prevailing climates of the past, can be regarded as normal. John E Pfeiffer, The Emergence of Man

Those who can't skin, can hold a leg. Abraham Lincoln

Only one war at a time. Abe Again.

12 February 2019, 12:58

JBrown

quote:
Originally posted by tsturm:
Sounds like Barrow or what ever they call it now? Utqiavik?? Always Bears in town.

A couple of weeks ago a colleague of mine posted a photo of a trio of polar bears across the road from the college in Utqiagvik.

Jason

"You're not hard-core, unless you live hard-core."
_______________________

Hunting in Africa is an adventure. The number of variables involved preclude the possibility of a perfect hunt. Some problems will arise. How you decide to handle them will determine how much you enjoy your hunt.

Just tell yourself, "it's all part of the adventure." Remember, if Robert Ruark had gotten upset every time problems with Harry
Selby's flat bed truck delayed the safari, Horn of the Hunter would have read like an indictment of Selby. But Ruark rolled with the punches, poured some gin, and enjoyed the adventure.

-Jason Brown

17 February 2019, 03:36

A.J. Hydell

quote:
Originally posted by JBrown:
quote:
Originally posted by tsturm:
Sounds like Barrow or what ever they call it now? Utqiavik?? Always Bears in town.

A couple of weeks ago a colleague of mine posted a photo of a trio of polar bears across the road from the college in Utqiagvik.

Polar bears?

Here's how Denmark's soldiers of the Sledge Patrol Sirius, who camp and patrol in the arctic circle region of Greenland, deal with the friskier P-bears: each man is issued an M1917 in 30-06, and a 10mm Glock 20.

Helluva combo right there, ... and you don't need to be on the receiving end of a bitch-slap from Chuke to understand it.

Enjoy:

https://laststandonzombieislan...glocks-of-greenland/

17 February 2019, 03:49

458Win

If the 10mm is so great, then why are they issued 30-06 Enfields ?

17 February 2019, 04:07

A.J. Hydell

quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
If the 10mm is so great, then why are they issued 30-06 Enfields ?

Simple, Simon ...

'Cause they aren't always carrying those M1917s around when their hands are busy doing other things.

21 February 2019, 17:13

Fury01

Simple Simon: the question asked by the experienced proven Alaska guide who has actually killed big bears wil a wide variety of weapons including a handgun, was the reverse of what you answered.
Sure sign of trolls who specialize in obfuscation.

21 February 2019, 22:36

Slider

It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power.

21 February 2019, 23:01

458Win

quote:
Originally posted by Slider:
It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power.

The difference in penetration between the 9mm and 10mm is only a few mm's

22 February 2019, 01:09

medved

quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
If the 10mm is so great, then why are they issued 30-06 Enfields ?

funny Phil. in Spitzberg they are issuing 30-06 stainless ruger rifle and no handguns for cruise ship crew going ashore.

22 February 2019, 02:55

458Win

Probably a wise choice. The caliber is adequate and shootable by most folks

22 February 2019, 03:35

Nick Adams

quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
quote:
Originally posted by Slider:
It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power.

The difference in penetration between the 9mm and 10mm is only a few mm's

Actually that's not true, at least to anyone who's actually done extensive penetration testing.

As much as you may want to not watch them, YouTube does have vids demonstrating irrefutable evidence of just how far a 10mm projectile will penetrate, which also depends on bullet-weight.

22 February 2019, 06:23

p dog shooter

quote:
Actually that's not true, at least to anyone who's actually done extensive penetration testing. As much as you may want to not watch them, YouTube does have vids demonstrating irrefutable evidence of just how far a 10mm projectile will penetrate, which also depends on bullet-weight.

Much more depends on bullet design then weight.

All most all FMJ or Lead solids give around 30 inches of penetration in ballistic gel.

Except for the smaller caliber slower rounds.

With standard bullet weight.

Then add a heavy for caliber bullet at the max velocity for that caliber can give you a bit more.

But 30 inches is most likely enough.

22 February 2019, 10:33

458Win

quote:
Originally posted by Nick Adams:
quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
quote:
Originally posted by Slider:
It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power.

The difference in penetration between the 9mm and 10mm is only a few mm's

Actually that's not true, at least to anyone who's actually done extensive penetration testing.

As much as you may want to not watch them, YouTube does have vids demonstrating irrefutable evidence of just how far a 10mm projectile will penetrate, which also depends on bullet-weight.

I also have over 50 years of irrefutable proof and have thoroughly tested most of the handgun and rifle calibers commonly used in Alaska.

23 February 2019, 04:18

Cold Zero

A quick google search for ballistic gell penetration tests 9MM vs 10MM yielded this

" It is quite possible for a strong round to travel through a body and then keep going through a wall. In ballistics gel tests a 9mm would typically travel about 13 inches after impact, while the 10mm was sometimes over 17 inches. This means that a 10mm could potentially travel through two people at center mass and still keep going. That is a huge amount of power. Of course, a lot of factors go into penetration and penetration is not the sole determinant of how effective a round is at disabling or deterring an aggressor."

13" for 9 MM sounds about right to me, apparently several more inches for 10MM.

The FBI who did help develop the 10MM (after the 1986 Miami shoot out) along with Col Jeff Cooper's input, the FBI sure did not keep the 10MM in service long, they dropped it like a hot potato.

23 February 2019, 22:12

Slider

The 10mm Auto had to much kick for The F.B.I. That is why The 40 Smith and Wesson was born. Two Different Cartridges all together!!!

24 February 2019, 19:03

458Win

quote:
Originally posted by Cold Zero:
A quick google search for ballistic gell penetration tests 9MM vs 10MM yielded this

" It is quite possible for a strong round to travel through a body and then keep going through a wall. In ballistics gel tests a 9mm would typically travel about 13 inches after impact, while the 10mm was sometimes over 17 inches. This means that a 10mm could potentially travel through two people at center mass and still keep going. That is a huge amount of power. Of course, a lot of factors go into penetration and penetration is not the sole determinant of how effective a round is at disabling or deterring an aggressor."

13" for 9 MM sounds about right to me, apparently several more inches for 10MM.

The FBI who did help develop the 10MM (after the 1986 Miami shoot out) along with Col Jeff Cooper's input, the FBI sure did not keep the 10MM in service long, they dropped it like a hot potato.

Tests like this are only meaningful if they are using the same ammo you intend to and expanding ammo for protection from human threats is entirely different than full metal jacket or hard cast bullets designed for deep penetration.

My test utilized the latter as I was only interested in protection from bears.

24 February 2019, 19:37

p dog shooter

quote:
13" for 9 MM sounds about right to me, apparently several more inches for 10MM.

I will say it again it is more about bullet design then caliber.

25 February 2019, 07:27

Snellstrom

quote:
Originally posted by Nick Adams:
quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
quote:
Originally posted by Slider:
It is hard to Argue the 10mm's Penetration and the Glocks Fire Power.

The difference in penetration between the 9mm and 10mm is only a few mm's

Actually that's not true, at least to anyone who's actually done extensive penetration testing.

As much as you may want to not watch them, YouTube does have vids demonstrating irrefutable evidence of just how far a 10mm projectile will penetrate, which also depends on bullet-weight.

I would much rather bet my ass on the 30/06 than any pistol.
I would even correct that to read a 30/30 over ANY pistol.

25 February 2019, 16:24

p dog shooter

quote:
I would much rather bet my ass on the 30/06 than any pistol.I would even correct that to read a 30/30 over ANY pistol.

But rifles are not as handy to have with you all the time.

Plus handguns have very good record of stopping bears in self-defense situations.

04 March 2019, 05:52

Nick Adams

quote:
Originally posted by p dog shooter:
quote:
I would much rather bet my ass on the 30/06 than any pistol.I would even correct that to read a 30/30 over ANY pistol.

But rifles are not as handy to have with you all the time.

Which was the point made earlier in this thread, but apparently those challenged with reading-comprehension issues missed it.

Nobody has a rifle in their hands all the time when they're outdoors; but they can have a pistol or revolver holstered on their hip or in a center chest rig.

quote:
Plus handguns have very good record of stopping bears in self-defense situations.

True.

04 March 2019, 09:15

Cougarz

quote:
Originally posted by 458Win:
If the 10mm is so great, then why are they issued 30-06 Enfields ?

Interesting point about this is their government has asked the patrol several times if they wanted to change to a more modern rifle and cartridge but their answer has always been - no thanks.