We have this forum that allows outfitters to post information on hunts they are selling. What about a forum where someone interested in a hunt can solicit proposals for a hunt -- the hunter could outline dates they are interested in, 1x1 or 2x1, number of hunters, country (if important), game being sought, price level, etc. and then let the outfitters respond to the hunter with their proposals. Lots of examples of this way of allowing buyers to seek sellers, e.g., Priceline, LendingTree, etc. Let the outfitters chase the hunters instead of the other way around.

I'll second the motion.

Good idea.

I 3rd the idea......its a gooder'

Great idea. I am in.

Who takes the next step?

sounds like a fine idea. Saeed and Don, are you listening?

Ok, Two (possibly four for 2x2hunt) "Non trophy Ele" (Tuskless & PAC) for late April.
Have done this in the past via private messages.

Great idea!

It will be fun though to see what guys offer to sell hunts once the "demand" is out in the open. I have realy seen some "interesting" PG hunts advertised on AR.......

GREAT idea and how timely...as just several hours ago I sent this idea to a Namibian PG Outfitter that I'm trying to help...as in trying to refer him more business during these tough times ahead!

Let the hunters tell the Outfitters what they want/afford, then OWNERS can try to make a SPECIALTY CUSTOM PACKAGE that may benefit BOTH...

If not, nothing loss...but if ACCEPTED...GREAT!

I agree. I know I am looking for a hunt for two people for next year. Not sure if Africa is in the plans or not. Maybe South America, maybe back to Alaska.

I think you have come up with a really good idea. My only comment is please do not submit requests unless you are serious about booking a hunt. I can fore see that the outfitters and/or booking agents will get frustrated if they are continuously giving quotes for hunts that never seem to book.

Great Idea! I am interested only in culling-non-trophy stuff at this point, and would welcome such a forum. Cheers, Luke

Hmmm!

What people are actually looking for at any one time would be very interesting. I might have several ads for hunts on AR on a specific day but perhaps there are folks seriously shopping for something completley different.

Sounds interesting.

Mark

quote:

What people are actually looking for at any one time would be very interesting. I might have several ads for hunts on AR on a specific day but perhaps there are folks seriously shopping for something completley different

I think you've got a point Mark. A friend and I are in the planning stage of an African hunt next year and neither of us are really interested in trophy size or record books, and I'd say that's a little bit out of the ordinary.
I'd be perfectly happy with a battle scarred, short horned old oryx bull over a younger one that would make Rowland Ward. I don't know how many others there are with a similar point of view but it would have to take a little bit of pressure off an outfitter and perhaps result in reduced prices as a result.

It's serious food for thought tho'.

The real point would be to try to let the market work a little. E.g., someone could declare, I am interested in a lion hunt in June 2010, I would like to hunt 1x1 in either Zimbabwe or Zambia. I have 18 days to hunt and would favor proposals where daily rates are reduced in favor of an exaggerated trophy fee. I would be the only hunter. I am interested in booking in the next 45 days and am prepared to post a deposit equal to 1/3 of the daily fees upon booking. I would like to receive any proposals by the end of November. Proposals should include PH, dates available, daily rate, other charges, trophy fee. Proposals can be sent to ....

Try to get the proposals on an apples-to-apples basis and then let the best proposal win.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
The real point would be to try to let the market work a little. E.g., someone could....

I think it’s a neat idea. I may have a week early December where I can sneak away for a low-cost, low-pressure, fun hunt “somewhere”. In this case, I know most of what I want and can afford, I just don’t know where and would be looking for ideas/suggestions to consider….but I know enough to be able to sort thru the responses.

“RFP’s” are a tricky thing though, and the quality of the response is only as good as the thoroughness of the RFP. Over the years working in the IT business I’ve seen many, responded to some, won a couple, and obtained a few excellent long-term clients (who no longer bid anything). I’d hate to have to make a living out of RFP’s though!!! The main problem from my standpoint is that often the RFP is poorly written by somebody who does not really understand what their requirements actually are. This allows a seller who either does not understand the needs, or who conveniently avoids educating the buyer, to win the deal based on price. The objective for putting a system out on bid via an RFP that I often hear is to be able to “compare apples to apples”, and while legitimate, in reality the responses are usually so varied that the buyer gets more confused then they were in the beginning. Or, the RFP’s are so lengthy and restrictive that few respond given the time it takes.

Now perhaps buying a hunt does not require the depth that I am accustomed to, but I think the buyer still needs to be as specific as possible in regards to what their needs are, in order to get appropriate responses. And avoid the outfitters going on too many wild goose chases. Often I read questions where the poster wrote two lines asking a question about a broad subject, not providing necessary info needed for others to make a good suggestion, then disappears for a while - meanwhile the responders are left to speculate what was meant, perhaps answering the question, maybe not. A few more clarifications would have made all the difference. I usually don't waste my time on these posts.

So perhaps a “Saeed Read Me” stickie outlining what info should be listed would be a good idea for everybody involved.

Obviously Mike your “example” above is precisely what I am referring to in regards to a request for proposal – you are experienced and educated and know pretty much what you are looking for. Of course we already know you are going to end up hunting your hypothetical lion in Dande North!

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
The real point would be to try to let the market work a little. E.g., someone could declare, I am interested in a lion hunt in June 2010, I would like to hunt 1x1 in either Zimbabwe or Zambia. I have 18 days to hunt and would favor proposals where daily rates are reduced in favor of an exaggerated trophy fee. I would be the only hunter. I am interested in booking in the next 45 days and am prepared to post a deposit equal to 1/3 of the daily fees upon booking. I would like to receive any proposals by the end of November. Proposals should include PH, dates available, daily rate, other charges, trophy fee. Proposals can be sent to ....

Try to get the proposals on an apples-to-apples basis and then let the best proposal win.

You must be a purchasing guy. I don't sell hunts, but what I do sell (hint: it isn't related to outdoor writing) isn't sold by responding to proposals. I will leave it at that.

No, just a dumbass, reprobate lawyer.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
No, just a dumbass, reprobate lawyer.

Mike, this may come as a shock, but booking agents can't bill by the hour for filling out RFPs.

Seriously, I wouldn't waste my time if I was a booking agent. I book two kinds of hunts: little known guys where I do a lot of reference checking, and marque names where I somewhat trust the marketplace reputation.

Honestly, it is really just willing buyers looking for willing sellers. If a seller is willing to accept; then so be it. Outfitters may be looking to fill out their schedules, and if they can do it here, it is much better.

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:


Seriously, I wouldn't waste my time if I was a booking agent. I book two kinds of hunts: little known guys where I do a lot of reference checking, and marque names where I somewhat trust the marketplace reputation.

Yes, but there are plenty of small and big time PH's and Safari Operators that check out AR.
Checking out reputations is still a good Idea and where better than on AR.
I have no doubt that some AR member will get my payment.

Definantly a good idea.

I'll play devils advocate. You would still need to check out the provider as anything can be promised and not always delivered.

bringing interested buyers and interested sellers together sure seems like a good idea to me

I can't see that this could be a bad idea. I don't mind saying on the forums what we offer and how much it costs. I think it would be intereting to see multiple offers for a given hunt. So we are thinking the offers would be for public viewing on the forums? Otherwise you loose the value of letting others besides the folks putting in the inquiry see what is available.

Mark

I think this would be a great idea!

I am for it.

quote:

Originally posted by AnotherAZWriter:

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
No, just a dumbass, reprobate lawyer.

Mike, this may come as a shock, but booking agents can't bill by the hour for filling out RFPs.

Seriously, I wouldn't waste my time if I was a booking agent. I book two kinds of hunts: little known guys where I do a lot of reference checking, and marque names where I somewhat trust the marketplace reputation.

Nor do lawyers that submit proposals in response to RFPs. The time they invest in the proposal is their own time on their own nickel. Alot of law firms did not respond to RFPs years ago, they started to realize all the business they were losing to other firms that did and today virtually every law firm will submit a proposal in response to an RFP. It is an accepted way of doing business.

It is certainly any outfitters perogative to decide not to submit a proposal in response to a request. I suspect though that if the number of folks booking their hunts through RFPs increased, most outfitters would come around. The market has a way of introducing reality to folks.

I have no clue if it work but it would sure be a helluva lot easier than going out and trying to poll outfitters for what might be available and an interesting way of being able to compare offered hunts on a heads up basis.

Please forgive my 1st post being in this forum, but...

I very much like the idea of a sticky that informs me, a completely novice hunter when it come to big game, of exactly what I should be looking for in booking a hunt.

I am hoping to book my first big game hunt for American Buffalo in about a year (and maybe adding another smaller game animal into the hunt—just so it ain’t over when it’s over;-) I do not want trophy, what I want is to begin to become a well educated big game hunter (something larger than deer). So I'm interested in paying for a true "guide” if you will.

I think a forum of this nature would be a great service to individuals like me who are taking up this sport later in life, and want to learn to "do it right." Most hunts I see advertised are for trophy or meat harvest, and seem to assume the hunter (me) is well experienced. I want the experience—and thou knowledge is the most valuable commodity, it’s the cheapest in terms of the tangible supplies that go into a trophy hunt.

Just my 2 cents worth.

Ronn

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:
Nor do lawyers that submit proposals in response to RFPs. The time they invest in the proposal is their own time on their own nickel.

Most folks in business do not bill for proposal development. If they do, it is hidden in overhead or administrative costs. Early in my career I was told that proposal overtime was my investment in keeping my job.

That said - an RFP/proposal approach is only one way to obtain the information desired. Something as simple as a post that IDs #of days, time of year, trophies desired, and area or areas being considered with outfitter PM replies would be very helpful to many.

This will begin discussions, aid in the development of a short list, and lead to negotiations for development of a full quote and contract.

quote:

Originally posted by Ronn38:
Please forgive my 1st post being in this forum, but...

Ronn

Welcome--
No forgiveness needed

You are here looking to experience hunting and learn--
(as hopefully are we all)

When you contact a Guide Tell then your status as a hunter as you perceive it to be.

These forums are good places to ask for advice;
generally and specifically,
on any aspect of hunting.

Again , Welcome and ask away--