Who builds the best custom rifle for hunting, nothing that has wooden stocks and all that engraving, but a rifle that is tough and can handle the elements.

There are TONS, all of varying price.

Depends how much you wanna spend.
I have around 10 customs. Of which 2 are made by Mark Bansner (circa. 2000, Both on Rem 700 actions), his prices are upwards of $5000. I have a couple other "Customized" Rem 700's that were only half that price.
Personally, I cannot really see the difference in price between the 4 in accuracy, or function. So what did I pay for? his name?

IMO Builder/maker/srew a gun togetherer, that has a reputable name, isnt necessarily always better than your run of the mill, gunsmith.
Putting a functional, LW, Accurate Glass/SS gun isnt rocket science.

With that being said, if I won the lotto tomorrow, I might very well make a call to D'arcy Echols....see if he could help me out.

quote:

Originally posted by jcjr:
Who builds the best custom rifle for hunting, nothing that has wooden stocks and all that engraving, but a rifle that is tough and can handle the elements.

I'd bet there's a dozen folks that post here that could build such a rifle for you.....and few if anyone could tell the difference in the performance of the rifles.

How about American Precision Arms any news on them.

I've never heard of them....but that dont mean a whole bunch

What exactly are you looking for?

The Economy has flooded the market with "used" customs, I'm betting you could find what you want for a fraction of what you'd pay someone to build, or put together.

I would recomend Mark Penrod. He built me a .300 win mag model 70 classic stainless. He is one of the best builders for a "black rifle" IMHO.

DEFINE "BEST"

I have owned several Bansners including 22-250, 308 Warbird, 300 UM, 300 SAUM, 416 REM. ALL wonderful rifles. All but the 416 shot sub minute groups easily with factory ammo. With reloads even better. Now let me ask this.

A previous posting said it depends on what you want to spend. There has never been a more accurate statement. I would add to that by asking "what is a custom gun?" Is Jarrett a custom gun because they make most of there parts ? Actions, barrells, etc ? Or, are the companies that purchase a smattering of parts and assemble them a custom rifle ? Are Jarretts worth the price because they make most parts or is a MG Arms better ? They both shoot sub-moa ! In my opinion this is the bottom line. The more money you have the more exspensive rifle you can afford. If both rifles shoot sub moa who cares who's name is stamped on it. I will assure you the critter that just got slammed does not.

quote:

Originally posted by jcjr:
Who builds the best custom rifle for hunting, nothing that has wooden stocks and all that engraving, but a rifle that is tough and can handle the elements.

There are many 'component parts gun' builders out there. They are NOT custom rifles.

I thought best quality rifles had thin shelled walnut stocks, rust blued steel & a little engraving to go with it.

There's lots of smiths who can build high precision utility rifles that use "other" materials.

If your looking for 'accurate' I would go with one of Kenny Jarrett's bean field rifles. But there are hundreds of builders out there that do their own signature rifles. You need to first define just what you want in a rifle, and find out who does what you want. If you just want a durable all weather, accurate enough rifle; then you don't need a gunsmith, and can just buy something off the rack with styling you like. The question is too inspecific to answer.

DW, just beat me to it. Anotehr vote for Kenny Jarrett and his prices are not cheap either.

Pick a guy that is hopefully in your town. If not...........

http://scorehi.com/

Lots of folks out there that can build rifles as accurate as Mr. Jarrett and a lot cheaper. Excess money doesn't necessarily mean more accuracy.
Butch

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Lots of folks out there that can build rifles as accurate as Mr. Jarrett and a lot cheaper. Excess money doesn't necessarily mean more accuracy.
Butch

Amen to that Brother Butch. My builder is on a little higher level than the above and are a little less expensive if compared feature to feature. When you start adding everything I do it gets ugly fast but every thing shoots a ragged hole.

quote:

Originally posted by gunmaker:
I thought best quality rifles had thin shelled walnut stocks, rust blued steel & a little engraving to go with it.

There's lots of smiths who can build high precision utility rifles that use "other" materials.

I'm glad you "broke the ice" on this. the guy's looking for a functional shovel...no less no more!

quote:

Originally posted by Duane Wiebe:

quote:

Originally posted by gunmaker:
I thought best quality rifles had thin shelled walnut stocks, rust blued steel & a little engraving to go with it.

There's lots of smiths who can build high precision utility rifles that use "other" materials.

I'm glad you "broke the ice" on this. the guy's looking for a functional shovel...no less no more!

Love it! Am having a my first stock built for one of my Speedy rifles out of a pretty sick blank from Luxus.

If your builder knows what he's doing you can take a wooden stocked rifle into the elements.

quote:

Originally posted by gunmaker:
I thought best quality rifles had thin shelled walnut stocks, rust blued steel & a little engraving to go with it.

There's lots of smiths who can build high precision utility rifles that use "other" materials.

Mr. Anderson has it right, thats how I define "best custom".

Like I said, my Bansners are over twice as much as my other "Customized" 700's, and in one case over 3x as much $$$ and they do dont shoot or function better than the other.

Sure Jarrett, Echols, etc etc will fuction properly, be accurate and all that, but not neccessarily better than one thats $1500.

For my money (took me awhile to realize this), if I am dumping big dough on a rifle, it will be like Anderson spoke of.

Lots of stuff hits the public thats considered a "Custom"......that are merely "put together".

I do.....I pick the action, wood, barrel, style, caliber, sights, scope, engraving and the Gunsmith. The end product "is" what I want, but it doesn't mean that someone else will want or like it.

I have seen different guns made by the same gunsmith that I have used, that I don't like. That isn't a reflection on the "gunsmith's" ability, but my taste (or maybe lack of).

quote:

Originally posted by FMC:
If your builder knows what he's doing you can take a wooden stocked rifle into the elements.

My .375 is about eighty-five years young. It has a walnut stock and is blued but it still goes everywhere.



Here it is with me in Alaska where it remained wet for eight straight days. Note the leather pad cover. I had the stock re-oiled when I returned but it needed it done anyway. Rust blue (black) didn't rust.



I have rifles made of plastic and aluminum but for "best" +1 for Wood and Steel

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
Lots of folks out there that can build rifles as accurate as Mr. Jarrett and a lot cheaper. Excess money doesn't necessarily mean more accuracy.
Butch

You are correct. However the problem is finding a smith that actually does consistantly good work, in a smith that is not well known.
We have a couple of so-called gun-smiths here in our area. The problem is that their work is hit and miss. All our good or great smiths have passed on in the last few years.
If I'm going to spend my hard earned money to build a rifle, I want to know for sure how it will turn out. The good smiths did not get their notariaty by turning out bad ones now and then. I'd rather spend more money with a great smith and know ahead of time what I'm getting. That's why 'Turnbull' and 'Bowen' command top dollar. They are good!

1+ Butch!

Hype sells for higher prices!! For~3500USD Don Geraci will "put together" a rifle up to 30 cal&guarantee HE can get 3/8"3 shot 100yd groups but he not splashed all over every sporting magazine,SHOT show,blah,blah.Hype costs money&the customer pays for it.if hes lucky he may recognize the quality or lack thereof for the "buyers premium".

While talking about price I think it would be wise for everyone to remember that a top smith has the same amount of hours in a day as everyone else and that he should be able to charge enough to earn a descent living. A full blown custom rifle is going to have between 125 to 250 or more hours in it if it were you trying to provide for your family what would you be willing to work for. And don't forget you have to pay for the shop and all that equipement. I don't believe it is just hype a Hugo and a Mercedes will both get you where you are going are they priced on hype or proven reliability?

quote:

Originally posted by Grenadier:

Holy Crap that's a nice rifle!

michaelj,
I think we are talking 2 different types rifles. A top of the line glass stocked rifle with a custom Remington clone receiver, Jewell trigger, McMillan stock?, Kreiger barrel, with smithing and stock bedding will be less than $3000 from the top accuracy smiths. You can start at double that for a wood stocked mauser, pre64 Mod 70. 2 completely different ballgames.
Butch

Butch,
You are right I went back to the original post and he is indeed talking about rifles such as you said.
My mistake

quote:

Originally posted by butchlambert:
michaelj,
I think we are talking 2 different types rifles. A top of the line glass stocked rifle with a custom Remington clone receiver, Jewell trigger, McMillan stock?, Kreiger barrel, with smithing and stock bedding will be less than $3000 from the top accuracy smiths. You can start at double that for a wood stocked mauser, pre64 Mod 70. 2 completely different ballgames.
Butch

I agree. That's strange!

What everybody thinks "the best" is is quite different. I shoot a 1000$ retail auto-loading shotgun in competition. Others spend as much as 40,000$ for a competition gun. The same can be said for rifles. I'd rather have a custom "utility hunting rifle" that is a reliable one-holer that gets used than a museum piece that is for show in the safe. Then again, I'm poor

comeon RC,
I heard you haunt the public shotgun ranges and hustle the locals.
Butch

A very refined version of the type of rifle you outlined is an D'arcy Echols legend. I think this is as close to the 'BEST' in this class of rifle as you could get--I don't have one, but have shot them, and I know several folks that owned or own one, and they would argue you to death that D'arcy's rifles are the pinnacle of this type of rifle.

I personally think you could get what you want from a lot of different channels as others have mentioned, maybe even in a line I would call semi-custon, like a Surgeon, an Ed Brown, Kilamanjaro Jaguar or even an Accuflite SAKO. These rifles are all typically comprised of a certain set of high end components, and they will build to your lenght of pull, set up the trigger like you want, barrel length of your choice and so forth, so custom or semi-custom to me....

Lots of U.S gun smiths build reliable rifles. Some are better businessmen then others and manage to get their rifles featured in the popular gun mags many read. Defining a true custom rifle is a matter of personal choice. I believe a reliable rifle has to go bang when you press the trigger. It also has to extract, eject and feed a new round every time you run the action, whether you run the action fast or slow, upside down or inside out the rifle has to work as designed. It also has to have "more then enough" accuracy to consistently put the bullet where it should go if the shooter does their part. Whether it is blue steel and walnut or stainless and synthetic does not matter. Both styles are proven performers. Look at what type of action the old pros favored here in the U.S. and abroad and go from there according to your personal choice. Spend time thinking your project through and and decide on your components. Then talk to 3 guns smiths with a good reputation. Find one that wants to build your rifle, be open to his ideas but don't let him talk you out of what you want. One thing I believe is a reliable big game hunting rifle has a reliable trigger, there is none better then those found on the older Mod. 70's, Dakota's and like triggers.

This is what David Miller says about "best" quality firearms.

"Often it is said that form follows function. To that extent, present day "best quality" sporting firearms represent the combined thought, genius, and labor of the ages, but the final result is more than simply a compilation of segmented elements that are screwed, glued, soldered and welded into a shooting iron. The result is also much more than just another pretty gun. Its beauty, indeed, goes all the way to the core.

Pick up a best quality rifle, and it comes alive in your hands. It literally wants to shoot and functions flawlessly. The entire package, in its own right a throoughbred, ready to excel as an instrument of the hunt. . . .

Art in any form is obvious in its presence, but eludes any form of simplistic quantification. It is valid in its own right, whether it performs any other function. Hence, best quality rifles must be high art and be able to stand on their own merits in that arena to satisfy a key element of their definition. Unlike static art, however, such as a painting or sculpture, best quality rifles also must embody the beauty and efficiency of design coupled with flawless function and handling characteristics."

In essence, Miller defines best quality as
"functional art".

As has been shown by all of the previous posts on this thread, it is hard to define to someone else, but you will know it when you see it and feel it.

Except for the "high art" part Ole Ugly should qualify under those guidelines

Goggle "Dave Tooley Rifles", Gastonia, NC.

Patrick Holehan does a great job. I have a 416 Rigby, which is based on a Dakota action. The others he makes:

(From his website)
◊ Built Primarily on a Winchester M-70 controlled round feed claw extract action.
All actions are double square bridged offering and accurate return to zero scope mounting.
One set of Talley allen cap head or double lever rings are supplied with each rifle.
We strengthen the exposed ring lug surface by adapting an underlug to each ring.


The original factory interrupted thread is reamed out and recut on center to 1 1/16" x 16 TPI.
The lug surface is recut. The receiver ring is trued, the bolt face is recut and trued on center.
The lugs are then hand lapped and the working surfaces are honed and polished.
The bolt release pad is built up and checkered. The bolt assembly is jeweled.
The trigger is done to the customer's requested weight of pull.

◊The action is assembled with Grizzel style one piece bottom metal by Sunny Hill Enterprises.
It includes a metal hinged floor plate.

◊ Premium Grade, Krieger Cut Rifled Barrels are cryo treated.
Chambers can be cut in all standard or wildcat cartridges the actions will accept.


◊ The metal is finished in a satin blue.

◊ When you select one of our premium stocks blanks we include the turning cost or you can furnish your own blank.
You can also choose one of our laminated stock woods.

◊ An ebony forend tip is installed. Cross bolts and ebony plugs are installed when necessary.
A 6/10" or 1" Pachmeyer decelerator pad is installed at customer's desired length of pull.
The stock is pillar bedded and fiberglass reinforced.
◊ A 2 screw machined metal grip cap and a 2 screw front and rear metal sling swivel studs are installed.

◊ The stock is finished in satin Oil and then checkered in a standard point pattern,
with a wrap around forearm and a 3 panel grip at 24 lines per inch.


Here's a pick of the Rigby:

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
Except for the "high art" part Ole Ugly should qualify under those guidelines

Now here is a true custom rifle! That's what I'm talkin bout!

Ole Ugly just might be the most famous working rifle in the world.

I wonder how much Phil could get if he put it up for auction. My guess is that he could fund a pretty nice custom with the proceeds.

I know two kids ( actually they are both grown adults, who also guide bear hunters ) who plan on keeping Ole Ugly in action long after I am gone.

Maybe long term reliability should be included in the term "best"

quote:

Originally posted by 458Win:
I know two kids ( actually they are both grown adults, who also guide bear hunters ) who plan on keeping Ole Ugly in action long after I am gone.

Maybe long term reliability should be included in the term "best"