I keep seeing people talk about fals and cetmes. I know these guns shoot a .308, but that is about it. Can someone tell me about these guns, Where where they made what countries used them?? where these military guns, and what are the differences between the 2 guns, Also how well made are the guns?? basically tell me about these guns as best you can

Both are military rifles. The CETME was developed in Spain after WWII. German designers fled their country and started working in Spain. After things cooled down, they returned to Germany and rolled their CETME designs into the HK rifles. It operates as a delayed blowback action with roller locks in the bolt head instead of a gas system, like the FAL and AR type rifles use.

The FAL was/is used as the standard military rifle in many countries, and the US was considering adopting it at one point - until the M16 won out in the end. It is available in many styles, depending on the country and unit that received it. Too many variants to list here.

IMHO, both are very good rifles. I picked the CETME because it doesn't have a gas system to clean the crud out of, and it's priced about $100 lower than the FALs.

There are lots of resources on the web on both rifles. I have a CETME, so my knowledge of that rifle is better. Here are my CETME links:
http://cetme.homestead.com/mbr.html
http://www.cruffler.com/review-july-00.html
http://www.geocities.com/miketheelectrician1/checklist.html?1011134301940
http://www.geocities.com/miketheelectrician1/cetme1.html?1006652443870
http://www.cruffler.com/trivia-November00.html

The best FAL site has to be:
http://www.falfiles.com/

lots of info and pics on these pages...hope this helps out. maxman

Hello:
Just a little correction here. The U. S, after ramming the 7.62 Nato round down everyone's throat, tested the Fal, wasn't satisfied with the initial design and opted instead for the M-14, which really was a slightly "improved" Garand. Harrinton and Richards manufactured some FALs, so somewhere out there, there should still be some American FALs. The M-16 snuck in the back door, by way of Viet Nam, when none of the establishment people in charge were looking and kind of worked its way up from there.
Grizz

Another very good source for cetme info is on the Cetme and FR8 message board.
http://www.gunboards.com/forums/UltraBoard.cgi

Scroll down till you see it on the list. One thing about Cetmes is that it apears parts are drying up. If you get a Cetme you should stock up on some parts. I bought a kit and am also buying some other wear items.

I love my Cetme though that is for sure.

CETME or FAL, what a question!

If you get a CETME, (originates from Spain, designed by a former Mauser Werkes employee), 9 out of 10 times it will have been assembeled by Century International Arms (CIA). Some of these rifles are POS, really. I have had to return each one I acquired for sale to the factory for rework. And, they have two different receivers, a stamped sheet metal and a vacum cast stainless steel.

Of the two, the stainless is the way to go. It is slightly stronger (albiet heavier), and has the necessary moldings to mount a H&K scope mount. I've heard that a scope creeps a lot on the sheet metal receiver. Otherwise it is a good rifle. You sort of take your chances, but the design is sound, if heavy.

Now, about the FAL(originates from Belgium, designed by Saive for Fabrique National, produced by numerous countries). Again, the most economical are the CIA FAL's. Here again you run into spoty quality. Again, I have had to return or repair half of the pieces I've had in my shop. So, you have a 50/50 chance of getting a good rifle the first time if you buy a CIA.

If, and I say if, you want a good FAL, you will have to pay at least twice as much for an Enterprise Arms or DSA rifle. I've heard both good and bad about Enterprise Arms, and nothing but good for DSA. Stay away from aluminum receivers. My opinion, no hard evidence. Just a feeling that comes from 25 years of being in the trade and a propensity to shoot the life out of my "toys."

Regards,

Eric

Go to www.falfiles.com as suggested by maxman and see what you think.

I personally own a FAL as I like my guns made out of machined steel(FAL/L1A1) not sheetmetel(cetme) you can call me old fashioned if you want! The cetme is about $100 cheaper but the FAl/L1A1 is worth the extra money.

We see a lot of FAL's up here in the north, but very few CETME's.
Since the FAL was the commonwealth rifle there are
Brits,Aussy's,Indian's and Canadian FAL's available usualy for around $400-$600can (thats equal to $16.50 US ) Up to $1200 for mint C1A1's
We do not have access to your Century rifles and I cant comment on the comparison. (Century was based in Montreal but left for the US after our gun laws became ridiculous = 1995)(They brought into Canada quite a few FAL's of all makes )
The Aussy Lithgow L1A1 & the CAL C1A1(Canadian Arsenal Limited) are very well made. (our C1A1's were never released to the Canadian market, all sold off shore=mostly Britian, then had to be shipped BACK into Canada. My C1 has brit proof stamps on brl) The Ishapore is OK,fit is average but with wood that looks like it was hand carved buy some blind guy.
Most of the Brit FN's are also well made.
We are also finding bubba'd rifles now made up of eveything. And some original Belgian ones..these are also beautiful..and Metric!
Both the FAL and the CETME are classed "prohibited" here and you had to own one prior to 1995 to be 'grandfathered' just to have.
Same as the AK family.
New shooters can have an AR(once you jump through the hoops and wait 9 months or so)
but canot buy an AK or a part of Canadian history - the FN C1A1.
These were put on the 'bad'list back then...

Hey one good thing.. all the new style rifles. Like the HK SL8 or the Robinson m96 or the AR180 are considered the same as your Mossgerg .22 !(just a tad more coin)
Thats because they came after the 'bad' list was written up.. go figure..

The question is not between the FAL and the CETME. It's the junk rifles that are currently being sold by Century Arms. The original military rifles are just fine. The FAL in all its variants is likely the absolute best combat rifle ever made. The CETME is a variant of the German H&K rifles that ain't too shabby either.
Century has a long reputation of building cheap rifles with zero regard to the safety of said rifles. When they were in Canada, they sold Lee-Enfields that were put together from bins of parts, including bolt heads and not checking the head space on them. Most were bad.
Now they make receivers for assorted rifles that are not made to military specs and they're junk too. Unreliable at the very least.
A net search for FNFAL will turn up tons of info as will a search for CETME's just remember that if it says 'Century Arms' it's a cheap unreliable copy. Mind you, a CETME ain't the rifle an FN is and I'd like to know where FALfan can get a C1A1 for $400-$600Cdn.

The CETME came well before the H&K G3. As far as junk century rifles, I have an L1A1 that has never failed to feed or fire or extract or eject and it shoots 2.5-3" groups at 100yds with issue sights(about the best I can do with out optics). I couldn't be happier with it.

and where was Mr Vorgrimmler between 1945 and 1950 ?
here you go :

http://www.gunboards.com/forums/UltraBoard.cgi?action=Read&BID=14&TID=3841&SID=28985

surprise !!

Interesting Ed. Thanks. - Dan