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From a friend.  Subject: Promised Land Somewhere between the 23rd. & the 24th ! . . . . Paul Martin is my shepherd I shall soon want He leadeth me beside still factories and abandoned farms He restores my doubt about the Grits He anointed my wages with taxes and inflation, so my expenses runneth over my income. Surely, poverty and hard living shall follow the Grits and I shall work on a rented farm, and live in a rented house forever Five thousand years ago Moses said: "Pick up your shovel, mount your ass, and I will lead you to the promised land". Five thousand years later, Trudeau said: "Lay down your shovel and sit on your ass, light up a camel; this is the promised land". This year Paul Martin will take your shovel, sell your camel, kick your ass, and tell you he gave away the promised land. I am glad I am a Canadian, I am glad I am free But I wish I were a dog, and Paul was a tree ! | ||
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In this morning's "Vancouver Sun", the traitor Martin and his Minister of Immigration, etc., some non-entity with a foreign accent,like so many of the Liberal MPs, Cabinet Ministers and senior bureaucraps, were quoted as telling us that immigration will increase by 40% over the coming five years. Oh, goodie, more riff-raff from the far corners of the Earth for us to pay "multicultural" grants to, suffer from crime at the hands of and pay to have "educated" in our socialist school systems. This is evidently in aid of the terrible shortage of skilled workers in Canada; what horseshit, the fact is that HRDC will NOT re-train real Canadians, but, uses our tax dollars to train various foreigners who will vote Liberal to take Canadian jobs. Godam all traitors who spread the lie of "multiculturalism" and support the systematic rape of the Canadian wilderness for the profit of foreign based corporations. This does not apply to good immigrants like Frans and some of the others on this section of the forum; I am generally in favour of carefully chosen immigrants from north-western European countries who come here to be CANADIANS first and their original nationality second. Nationalistic???....damned right!!! | |||
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I wish we had more immigrants like Mickey.  ------------------------------- Too many people........ | |||
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Kutenay, I enjoy reading your posts, like your knowledge and most of the time I agree with you on your stand against Lieberals. However be careful with saying from north-western European countries. I came here in 1990 and I am not from above mentioned places and I feel strongly about being Canadian and trying to mesh in to true Canadian mainstream based on loyalty, truth and God. Pillars on which this country was build over hundred years ago. I wasn’t born here, but my children were, so I ‘brain wash’ my two kids about this culture, about these values, not those which were implanted under my skin back somewhere in Europe. It happens that where I live, there is a number of immigrants from UK. They wave British, Scottish, Welsh or Irish flags outside their homes, and there is not a complain, because we were part of them for time and served under Brits sometimes as slaves thrown to worst fights during I and II WW. SHAME, I say, hypocrisy. Makes me puke when I see them fine, because they speak English, it doesn't matter, that is their English, with heavy accent, not ours, me not, me half Canadian. I work with one Scotsman, very fine man indeed. He came here around the time I was born, sometimes in ‘60s. Understanding him is a challenged. Kutenay, think twice about who make a good Canadian and don't write such a bull. Tell me what have you done in '70s, when your democratically elected PM was parting with communists and was selling this country away. I bet, then you were young and vibrant, busy working and making money, what have you done, tell me. Who is to blame, us --> me or immigrants who abuse this beautiful country or those who allow that be the truth??? Peter | |||
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This post is incoherent and difficult to reply to, however, I will try. I might start by saying that I first encountered this immigrant on CGN, where he PM'ed me one evening DEMANDING my assistance with a rifle purchase BEFORE the following morning because he wanted to get the best possible deal. It evidently did not occur to him that peremptory demands made upon a complete stranger are generally not considered very polite in Canadian society, but, what would I know, my family initially came to Canada in 1627 and he has been here for, WOW, 15 whole years. Given his arrogant tone in this post, is it any wonder why more and more Canadians are becoming opposed to immigration? The comments about immigrants from the U.K. are rather ironic as the very flags they dare to fly were a part of the CANADIAN FLAG, the Red Ensign; you know, the flag under which we fought in the two World Wars he refers to. As to fighting under the "British", my family members were among the CANADIAN volunteers in BOTH those tragedies; six served and four were injured. I also find the comments about the British to be somewhat ironic, coming from a Pole, considering that, in 1939, the British went to war against the Nazis, although they did not have to as Hitler clearly stated, because they honoured a treaty with POLAND and we lost over 300,000 of our boys killed throughout the Commonwealth as a result. But, Peterpan has the fucking gall to badmouth Britsh immigrants to Canada, a nation which was largely founded by the British....what a bunch of HYPOCRISY! As to Scotsmen being difficult to understand, so what, this country was largely FOUNDED by Scotsmen and their lovely burr is a fundamental part of our cultural heritage. If, this is not acceptable to some immigrant, let him go back whence he came. I could go on about "accents" and "understanding", however, I think the point is obvious. Now, as to what I was doing in the 1970s, actually, it is none of your godam business, this is my native land and what I choose to do is not open to question, period. As it happens, I was (a) putting myself through college, (b) working in resource management, (c) operating my own small business and paying taxes as I have been doing since 1965. I also was extremely active in the environmental conservation movement, on a volunteer basis and was involved in my community in several service organizations. Concerning Pierre Elliot Trudeau, first of all, he was not a Communist as he was a Roman Catholic educated by Jesuits and although I did not ever support him, he was preferable to what we have now and have had since he retired. The single worst error of Trudeau's administration was that he opened up immigration to the riff-raff of the world and then enshrined the disgusting lie of "multiculturalism" in Canadian life in order to bring more undesirables here; late in life, he admitted that this had been an error. Oddly enough, this ignorant, bigoted poster would probably not have been allowed entry to Canada except for Trudeau's foolish changes to Canadian immigration standards. Do not dare to tell me that I post ...bull..., you idiot, this is MY country, get it!? I will comment as I think fit and will not take any crap from some loudmouth who is no more a Canadian than I am the "Man in the Moon". BTW, I have relatives in Ontario, around Campbellford and they have been in Canada since the 1700's; they are of SCOTTISH extraction and sometimes may show the "Cross of St. Andrew" in their windows and you, an immigrant, don't like this????? Who fucking cares, go back where you came from, it is up to CANADIANS like me to decide who should come here, not you. Now, I have to go Elk hunting, so, why don't you shut the fuck up and learn to speak and write English before you shoot your stupid mouth off about the accents of people whom we Canadians want here! | |||
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I am very much amazed with your reply. I have not called you any of names and don’t know if I deserve all this impolite tone of yours. 1. I see just to proof your own point; you go as far as lying. I have never demand anything from you and if I send you an email was because I admired your knowledge and liked you as a person, never demand anything. And please don’t teach me about Canadian society and what is polite or not. 2. Yes I know under what flag people of Canada were fighting during Great World War and II WW, and I know even more then average person born in this great land, I know about Dieppe and what happen there, and why Candian were send for slaughter, however I see you will need some education or maybe you don’t want to see the truth. Now, don’t you ever say that British went to war in 1939, declaring a war and going to war is two totally different things, don’t you think so. (Sort of P. Martin, promising more money for Canadian Forces to get re-elected) I bet you know who was Chamberlain, who British Royal family was siding with and so on. Neville Chamberlain was just making a statements, he and French did nothing when Wermacht marched to Czechoslovakia in Fall of 1938. Again, when Wermacht were invading Poland in Sept 1939, what Brits and French had done? Tell me body. My friend, Britain was not ready to any war, they barely could defend themselves. If wouldn’t be for American help, God knows what would happen with London. From what I know, Canada lost was 37,000 soldiers, UK, 242,000 including civilians, Poland just bit over 6mln. So you body don’t lie and stop changing facts. So where you getting 300,000? 3. I have never question a role of funding fathers of this great nation and those who worked hard so I can enjoy my good life. I respect all those who die, who were logging this country, building cities and hospitals. But don’t make me blind and don’t tell me that is OK, when someone no matter where is from worship more the land he came from then Canada. I came here to be Canadian, maybe not in your eyes, but I feel strongly about it, and make me laugh when guy like you defend some group of guys who you have not even met. I know those guys, and I know where their loyalty is. 4. ….Pierre Elliot Trudeau, first of all, he was not a Communist as he was a Roman Catholic educated by Jesuits and although I did not ever support him, he was preferable to what we have now and have had since he retired…. Yes he was not communist, however he sympathized with them, he was the one who went to Cuba, Moscow and other states were people lived under regimes you have not even a clue. When you were enjoying your freedom in ’50-‘60s, many people died in gulags, were tortured, and guess what some of them were fighting for freedom of Commonwealth Countries but they have made mistake going back to their country, which was not their anymore. And your playboy PM was just visiting those land and was dealing with Cuba, yes Americans loved that. …Do not dare to tell me that I post ...bull..., you idiot, this is MY country, get it!?... I like this sentence. :-)) … Who fucking cares, go back where you came from, it is up to CANADIANS like me to decide who should come here, not you… This one is not bad either :-)) To conclude it, Sad part is, when people get older the are more bitter and are become blinded, and as much as I used to respect you I see old useless man who likes bashing everyone who dares to see things different and don’t agree with you. Have a safe hunt. | |||
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I am not going to argue with you as you quite obviously are a rather disturbed individual. However, I will not tolerate being called a liar or a useless old man and so, I will point out a few things. The Commonwealth War Dead in WWII totalled just about exactly 344,000 plus about 60,000 civilians killed by Nazi bombs in Britain. Canada lost over 40,000 military personnel killed in WWII, not 37,000. We were NOT sent as ...slaves...to Dieppe, the Canadian soldiers, public and government eagerly WANTED to go, as many of my personal friends who were actually there told me many times. Your comments about the British Commonwealth are highly offensive to me and the Polish dead to whom you refer have nothing to do with this point. The majority of the Polish dead were actually Jews who were victimized by the Nazis with the eager assistence of the Polish people; this is historical reality and lies from you or any other ignorant immigrant cannot change this. Your dislike of the British is not shared by the vast majority of REAL Canadians and your comments about the efforts of the Americans overlook the fact that we of the British Commonwealth stood ALONE from Sept. 1939 to Dec. 1941 while the USA remained neutral. During this time, we won the Battle of Britain and were fighting the Battle of the Atlantic and keeping the fight against Nazi and Communist tyranny going. So, piss off you prick, you don't know shit about Canada, history or anything else other than being a loudmouth jerk. As to being a liar, you PMed me on CanadianGunnutz almost two years ago, demanding assistance with a rifle purchase and now you deny this, so, it is pretty obvious who is a liar. Who the fuck are you to complain about British accents in Canada, you cannot even be bothered to learn to write English correctly.Now, go take your Prozac and eat your kielbasa like a good boy. | |||
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Kutenay, I can't believe how one post can turn so ugly. What can I say... Maybe it is a time to find good specialist for state of your mind, I think you are very lonely and you sound like a life time looser. You make me laugh again confirming that you are old ignrant type, also uneducated man who breathe nothing but anger, hate and is a racist. Also, changes facts and truths, which classify you only as a liar. Information you provide are all taken from gutter papers so I don’t even want to respond to lies, you have produced. Where all that hate comes from??? Get lost old man | |||
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PeterPan, As I see it, you're the one who picked the fight back in the fifth thread. Then you wonder where all the hate came from? Don't dig a hole if you don't want to deal with the muck on the bottom. | |||
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Oh God, what have i let myself in for??? I'm qualified with both a degree and masters degree, currently employed as a senior teacher, but can also teach University grade. I'm currently in the process of completing immigration papers for Canada. My intention is to find a job first and then come over. The wife is also degree qualified and also intends to work, pay taxes, etc. So if my main motivations are freedom, quality of living and the ability to hunt and shoot without being branded a muderer, gun nut etc....should i be looking for another country? | |||
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No, just come to Alberta. We,ve always got opportunities for people like you, and I'm sure you'll like our attitude. Grizz Indeed, no human being has yet lived under conditions which, considering the prevailing climates of the past, can be regarded as normal. John E Pfeiffer, The Emergence of Man Those who can't skin, can hold a leg. Abraham Lincoln Only one war at a time. Abe Again. | |||
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ScotsGun, I'll second what Grizz said: come to Alberta, you'll like us. (AND we're desperate for good teachers!) | |||
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Grizz and Habcan, Important questions answered first please: what's the hunting like in Alberta? possible to own and shoot handguns (as a range of course)? Best areas in Alberta to look for employment (ideally near decent population but possible to commute from outside of town)? Marc | |||
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Scottie, since you asked a question and did not receive a reply, I will try to acquaint you with the situation here as it now stands. I would not be worried about coming here as the Scots are generally well received here and only those British immigrants who forget that Canada is a unique, independent country with it's own cultural mores and traditions find ANY resentment from Canadians, at all. In short, people from anywhere who continually talk about how much better things were "in the old country" are frequently and rather bluntly told to go back, but, that applies to only a minority of immigrants from the U.K. Most Canadians have at least some Scots blood and the Highland regalia, skirling pipes and all of the mystique of the kilted regiments whose valour won on so many broken and bloodied fields is as strong here as in the land of the thistle itself. If, there is/was one single country that could be said to be the founding nation of Canada, that would be Scotland and real Canucks know this and honour our ancestors by producing very fine pipe bands....but no "uesqebaugh" worthy of the name! As to problems of the sort you see here, this sort of thing is becoming more prevalent in Canada. It is due to the fact that treacherous governments have deliberately skewed our immigration policies from our traditional sources to other groups from cultures where individual freedoms are not as important as they are for us.....or, they expect others to preserve freedom for them, something we Commonwealth types are rather used to........ The first Prime Minister of Canada, his immediate successor and a number of others ALL spoke with Scot's accents as did the major builders of the CPR, most of our major explorers and other prominent pioneers. I hardly think that a Scotsman should worry about his reception in Canada....unless he is a gun hating, liberal, socialist, multiculter! Even the guys who founded our "socialist" party, the N.D.P. were Scots! Handguns are no problem, permits are easy to get and carry permits can be obtained under certain circumstances; most of my friends have these for bush work, I don't bother as I am retired young and prefer to pack a carbine over my .44 Mag. Hunting is generally good here, on public land and B.C. is the best, but, Alberta is also very good. Alberta has just fantastic people in the smaller towns and the "livin' is easy"; crime is relatively low and the lifestyle is pretty easygoing. It's cold in AB in the winter, but, the East Slopes of the Rockies are simply gorgeous on a cold, clear day at sunset, so, you just ignore -30F. If, you come over, I will wager that you will be glad that you did and you will feel at home very quickly. As I said, check into the Yukon-N.W.T concerning job opportunities as there are some interesting situations up there. | |||
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Scotsgun, Hi! Sorry it took so long to get back to you. First, all that Kutenay said about Scottish Traditions and your reception here is true. Second, in Alberta, Calgary and area would be the best "commuting" location for a new teacher who wants to hunt/camp/fish, but it would be a LOT easier to find employment out here in East Central on the not-so-flat prairies where we ALSO have good hunting! Cost-of-living would be away down in comparison also. PM me an eMail address, and we can get into it further? (I can send pictures.) Good luck!! | |||
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Don't belive a thing them Flatlander Albertans tell you Scot!  Grande Prairie in Alberta or even Dawson Creek,BC would be the place to settle and are great places to work,live and hunt out of. Nope, I don't live there but have visited and hunted up there and really think the world of it. derfQuando Omni Flunkus Moritati | |||
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From Kutenay
'Aint that the truth....spent a month travelling in western Canada 3 years back,warm friendly reception where ever I went. Most definately would have considered moving there had I been younger. Regards Roebuck222 | |||
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Cheers guys......please feel free to keep the info coming. marcgcallaghan@btinternet.com A bit about me.....ex army officer, qualifies (1st degree) in aeronautical engineering, then gained qualification (my 2nd degree) in teaching. Lastly, recently obtained masters degree in educational management. Currently working as a Head of Department for a Technology College. The plan is to emmigrate to a country where the pace isn't so quick, i need not keep my daughter locked away for fear of constant scum and where the wife and i can have another addition to the family. Ideally, i shall gain employment before coming over and the wife shall seek employment upon coming over (she's also degree qualified and presently employed as a financial auditor). Anyway, my short list of countries were: 1. America - can't agree with alot of their politics and could never swear allegience to their flag. 2. New Zealand - their economy is screwed (high inflation, etc) and very much a back water. 3. Australia - Similar economy to NZ and there's a rule that emmigarating teachers must work in the outback for 5yrs upon entry! 4. Canada - ideal. Hunting, fishing, a bit of cold weather doesn't worry me (i'm Scottish) and i've done some travelling there before. I would gladly apply for citizenship and would gladly consider myself then canadian. Marc | |||
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Definitely Dawson Creek Marc. Excellent opportunities for emploment and housing is still relatively cheap although it is rising. derf Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati | |||
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Hello; They need aeronautical engineers in Dawson Creek? Alberta has the strongest economy in Canada. Hell, our transfer payments keep the rest of the country going. Our government doesn't even know what they are going to do with all the money they've collected from oil revenues. High energy prices are good for us. The latest angle is that they are going to send every man, woman, and child in Alberta 400., kind of like the Alaska thing. They don't call us the blue eyed sheiks for nothing.The hunting is great here, no matter where you go. In terms of topography, we have every thing from desert to mountains. Within a few hours, you can hunt Antelope or Bighorn sheep. Gun Laws on the whole aren't too stringent, compared to the European models, except Handguns. You could live in Calgary, or Edmonton, but it wouldn't be much different than living in Britain. We've got lots of smaller population centres, generally more easy going, and there is lots of space in between, so much that I've known it to scare recent immigrants. Grizz Indeed, no human being has yet lived under conditions which, considering the prevailing climates of the past, can be regarded as normal. John E Pfeiffer, The Emergence of Man Those who can't skin, can hold a leg. Abraham Lincoln Only one war at a time. Abe Again. | |||
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Shucks, you flatland Albertans are forever bragging on that province, maybe too much? With Marc's qualifications maybe he could become Airport Manager in Dawson. From what I have read they could use someone with fresh ideas who isn't afraid to think!  derfQuando Omni Flunkus Moritati | |||
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Yes many wanted to do their duty and fight for their country but then again,they did not know what they were up against like the british generals did.
Where do you get your figures?When you consider the french canadians,those with scandinavian, ukrainian,or other parts of europe ancestry and the other british people with no scottish background,the total is quite high.For the record,I do not in any way support the scottish heritage or the british royalty system.In fact I find the arrogance of many british immigrants and their attitudes to be insulting to canada as a country.Many still consider canada to be a colony and think that canada owes britain in some way. However,I do agree that our current immigration policies stink.We are allowing large numbers of criminals or people with questional backgrounds into our country.We are also allowing large numbers of unskilled people into our country that contribute nothing to our economy and in fact burden it.Yes we do have a shortage of skilled labor in our country,but we need to adjust our immigration policies to help the situation not make it worse. And in case you are wondering,I am a third generation canadian whose ancestors settled and played a role in developing western canada. | |||
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They knew perfectly well what they were getting into as French Maquis and British spies had given the planners a very clear picture, relative to the technology of the time, what was happening. The fact that the convoy bringing the Second Canadian Division ashore encountered an unexpected German E boat squadron was simply bad luck, this alerted the Germans who already KNEW the the raid was coming. The popular, leftist attitude in Canada that our soldiers were used as "cannon fodder" along with the ANZACS in both World Wars is just bullshit; almost EVERY action that we were involved in was actively sought by our people and this is certainly true of Dieppe. I have known a number of veterans of Dieppe very well, a good friend of mine was a senior officer under Col. Cec. Merritt at Green Beach and I discussed the situation with him many times. The Canadian people wanted our boys to get into the fight as we knew the Yanks were coming into it and we wanted to beat them into the fray as Gen. A.G.L. MacNaughton made clear. A very good friend of mine's grandfather, a highly decorated WWI veteran as mine was, was actually Col. Merritt's law partner and close friend here in Vancouver and my friend, a history grad. from U.B.C. was raised at Merritt's knee, so to speak, and his opinions match mine. The fact is that, even at Passchendaele, our most terrible "trial by arms", the entire affair was held up at the insistence of the G.O.C. Canadian Corps with the complete support of the Canadian Government; a British Corps Commander would have been court-martialed for even daring to suggest that Haig should not go into Ypres a third time. My great-grandmother was Annie Hughes, of the Belleville, Ont. area, her first cousin was Major-General Sir Samuel Hughes and her son, my grandfather, served under Hughe's brother who was a Brigadier, IIRRC. I do NOT tolerate any anti-Canadian or anti-British remarks from non-traditional immigrants to this country and I have encountered this bullshit from various eastern European and southern Europeans since I was a boy in the '50s. I have dealt with it forcefully and am perfectly prepared to do so again and with the utmost vigour. There are legitimate criticisms of the Dieppe raid that can be made, Pound's refusal to have a R.N. heavy cruiser in the channel to bombard the German positions and Harris's refusal to give heavy bomber support to the landings; BUT, the British DID NOT send Canadian boys to be slaughtered, we went because we wanted to go and we performed superbly, as we British Commonwealth troops have always done and will be doing for centuries to come, period. I have known too many men who fought under British Generals and admired them to be sucked into the old BS about them. Certainly, Gough in WWI and Leese in Italy in WWII pushed our boys hard, but, they were fighting Germans, among the finest soldiers on Earth and not simply playing Cricket, wot? War is hell, said a famous Yank and the British Commonwealth officers and other ranks are first and foremost among heros who fought for others at the expense of our own blood...isn't it odd that these various types who dislike us so intensely are so EAGER to immigrate to our nations, wonder why? | |||
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As I said in my post,the generals and brass certainly knew,but then they didn't have to take the risks of getting killed unnecessarily did they?But do you suppose that the privates and other low ranks were told that they were going to get slaughtered or killed simply as a gesture with no military significance? As for soldiers being slaughtered unnecessarily.During the first world war,our spineless canadian government let some of our soldiers be murdered by firing squad to appease some generals that were upset that their offensives went badly.These soldiers were selected at random then murdered to set an example and to supposedly make the remaining troops fight harder.At least the Australians had the sense to not allow their own troops to be murdered in this way. | |||
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Stubbie, I honestly don't understand what point you are trying to make here, the Dieppe Raid has usually been considered of considerable military significance relative to the D-Day invasion as divers historians have written. Of course the soldiers were not privy to every scrap of information that the CIGS was, but, "Operation Rutter" and "Operation Jubilee" were very well known to the average serviceman/woman....TOO well, as subsequent interviews with captured Germans shows. It is very easy, after 63+ years to pass judgement on what was done, but, the fact remains that almost ALL of the senior Canadian officers went ASHORE AHEAD of their troops and some of these were ENGLISH and SCOTTISH, the Commando Beachmaster and the Lord Lovat, being only the best known. Most of these guys were killed and no sniveling about it has emanated from their families, regiments or nations......typical of British courage and honour. Now, you may not like the Scottish share in Canadian history or the Monarchy; the first attitude is rather ridiculous in that it ignores historical reality and I agree about the Monarchy and have been opposed to it since I was a kid. The fact remains that Canadians have had Scottish blood since the Vikings "discovered" this country as a perusal of a number of general history texts will show you, you can't really do much about that. My comments were based on the fact that for many years after WWII, the Dominion Bureau of Statistics would report national census figures as showing the English, Scottish and French peoples were the most numerous in this country and in that order, next were Germans, but, now may be Chinese. Given inter-breeding among Canucks, I think that most Canadians today do, in fact, have some Scots blood and our traditions reflect that. Simon Fraser University, for example, frequently has the World Champion bagpipe band and that is no mean feat. You may well be a third-generation Canuck, but, your seeming antipathy to a nationality that largely built this nation is rather foolish; the Ukrainians you mentioned would not even BE HERE if it were not for politicians of Scots/English extraction, circa 1911. Sir Clifford Sifton was not exactly non-British.... You are right about some Brit. immigrants re: their attitude to this country and some Yanks and other immigrants and foreigners also tend to patronize us and treat us as their possessions. I have been rather forceful in my denunciation of those types and their attitudes on this very forum and quite recently. My attitude is very plain, Canada, my country and your country....love it or leave it! Stubbie, you keep making a post and then adding to it while I am replying to you, why is that? The comments about WWI soldiers are something one would expect from the C.B.C., who were they and when and where did this take place? The Canadians executed in WWI were deserters whose cowardice in the face of the enemy both endangered and disgraced their comrades. When you mention WWI, am I to assume that members of your immediate family participated as volunteers in Canadian uniform or are you simply spewing leftist, baseless rhetoric? | |||
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The murder of innocent soldiers wrongly executed as cowards has been well documented and exposed.It is no secret that after several attempts to advance failed miserably, the allied generals decided that the soldiers were not fighting hard emough and that an example had to be made.Several soldiers including canadians,british and french were selected at random and were executed as cowards.There was a very in depth documentary on this issue where even some of the officers admitted that they were given orders to select troops at random to be shot as an example and to try to force the other troops to fight harder.You can stick your head in the sand if you wish but the evidence was quite convincing. And yes,several of my ancestors did fight and die in both world wars although mostly in the second. | |||
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Interestingly, you have NOT answered my questions and seem to be making this discussion into some sort of personal contest. So, again, who were these soldiers, where did this happen, when did it happen and what was the title of this documentary. These are simple questions, but, they are fundamental to presenting the ...evidence...you mention. Can you actually give specific references to the documentation you refer to as this is customary in historical debate. I asked if any of your family had served in CANADIAN uniform in WWI, not if some of them had fought in both World Wars. Why are you not specific in your replies to my precise questions, I am always interested in learning more about all aspects of Canadian history. My head is not ...in the sand..., you may know something I do not, but, you have not, thus far, given any actual references and just have indulged in vague slurs upon dead veterans unable to defend themselves....and I find this rather curious for a ...third generation Canadian... So, give me some facts, Stubbie, or I may wonder about your knowledge and even your veracity. | |||
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Although,I do not recall the exact name of the documentary,I do find the following links of interest.Though none speak of any particular incident they do admit just how these men did not get fair trials and were presumed guilty unless they could prove their innocence which was virtually impossible under the conditions even if a person was innocent..They also indicate how our goverment did nothing to prevent these atrocities.It also becomes apparent that officers were not subjected to the same injustices.Another sign of the british class system. http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~dccfarr/sad.htm http://home.cogeco.ca/~cdnsad/ http://www.cbc.ca/news/viewpoint/vp_storring/20041105.html http://www.wsws.org/articles/1999/nov1999/shot-n16.shtml As to you wondering about me and my knowledge,I certainly do not wonder about you as you are showing the arrogance and holier than though attitude toward non british people that I spoke about in my previous post.As such,I have no desire to listen to any more of your superiority nonsense and take my leave from this thread. | |||
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What I see here is the ignorance of someone who is NOT quite what he says he is and is full of antagonism towards others, in this instance Canadians of British ancestry. As it happens, I am a CANADIAN and am of only PARTIAL British extraction, but, I am very well aware of what is going on here. I thought that a discussion might be possible, but, evidently not. I would think that anyone whose ancestors fought in Canadian uniform in the World Wars would not be quite so reticent about it, but, then there are those whose ancestors were not in Canadian uniforms, yet, they claim that said ancestors ...developed...Canada???? Arrogance??? The links provided simply detail what was standard practice in ALL armies during the era in question and had been for centuries. Those who were found guilty of desertion or cowardice were harshly punished and judging this by today's rather ambiguous standards of "morality' is both ridiculous and non-productive. This is the type of thing being used to promote "multiculturalism" and the "new world order", often by those whose Canadian antecedents are dubious, to say the least. An example is the whining from Ukrainians on the Prairies about the detention in "enemy alien" camps during WWI, they got off lucky as they did not have to endure the Somme, Passchendaele, Canal du Nord or the gas at 2nd Ypres. But, they have equal "rights" by god, to anyone whose ancestors actually served THIS country. The antagonism toward the ...british class system...is actually funny at least to anyone who knows how Canadian officers were selected (and treated by their men) in WWI. The fact is that men of all social ranks became officers and much of the criteria for selection was based on casualty figures, not one's family status. As to the Royal Army itself, it was led by Lord Kitchener, who rose from being a drummer boy and a number of it's major leaders had also risen from humble beginnings in the ranks due to ability and performance, i.e., Sir William "Wully" Robertson, the C.I.G.S. It is always revealing when someone allows their personal hatred to become so obvious and I wonder, should those of us of British ancestry, fully and partially, be somehow ashamed of our ancestors who built this country starting when our Viking ancestors began to remain on their Norwegian/Icelandic holdings and not make the voyage west to what became Canada? Maybe the non-British peoples in Canada are somehow better than we are....although most of them came here for the freedom and opportunity we created. Some chicken...some neck! | |||
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Go for it Kute!!  Anyone who knows anything about the Dieppe debacle knows it was in a good cause and the Canadians BEGGED to be chosen to be the ones to go. I have talked to many who were in 'positions of decision' at the time, and many rankers who participated, and they ALL agree with the statements you have posted. Let no one decry our heroes! Thank you. | |||
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You guys are both right Kute You bet the Canadains were begging to kick some German butt. But lets face it they were slaughtered. It should have never happened. The good thing about it was that they used what they learnt from it an applied it to D-Day. Stubble I remember a year or 2 ago where the government added the names of those executed to the list of names of those KIA. As I recall they came too the conclusion that they-(those executed) were suffering from post tramatic syndrome or something like that. Hunting isn't a mater of life and death......it's more important than that | |||
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You may as well stop complaiing about Paul Martin. The man is a politician and good at being one. However, he is not a leader, not even close. He's in good company. Look at the question and answer session on TV from Ottawa. Are you impressed? Well, that's the best we have so don't expect too much. It's just not there, a damn pity too. Best wishes. Cal - Montreal Cal Sibley | |||
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I think we all love this country; otherwise we would not learn about a history and tradition of this great nation or participate in building this nation. No matter where we came from or I believe when, as long as we want to be Canadian, and raise our kids to be loyal to this country. Funny thing, I, myself like Scottish, always did, was amazed with their culture and struggle against English (who settled there in 5th century). Also, I cheer for Rangers, when they battled Celtics, and my dream is to attend at least one game at Ibrox Stadium, against their archrivals. Another funny story, in my church we got pastor, fresh from Scotland, what great lad, highly educated in Greek and Latin. So we should stop bashing each other, especially during the long reign of Lieberals with their policies to make us gunless UN society. On positive note, I have just returned from Northern Ontario moose hunting, and was lucky to shoot moose-calf at 480 yards with Rem700/.300RUM -200gr ABond bullet. One shot-one drop. Only problem was retrieving the animals, which was shot past little river, where we had to build a temporary bridge to go to other side. Greetings, Peter | |||
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ScotsGun, If those are the only things putting you off about America, don't worry about it. The country is full of people who don't agree with our policies and would never swear allegience to our flag. Most of them work in our academia, too, so you'd fit right in. Just don't let on you own guns or go hunting, though. | |||
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Thing about Canada that pisse me off is that it is not even a shadow of what Canada was and is getting farther from it every day. It will never be what it was, we have gone beyond the point of no return and we have lost our identity. Thats why many Albertans want to seperate, because it is still pretty rural and Canadian tradition is still popular. We would like to keep it that way and the only way we can protect our heritage it is to seperate from the other parts of Canada that is bent on legislating it to the history books. In other words the only way we can save our selves from loosing our heritage and traditions is by seperating. All Alberta is doing by remaining in Canada is financing our own demise. aka. bushrat | |||
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+1 Oscar. It really is time to go. - dan "Intellectual truth is eternally one: moral or sentimental truth is a geographic and chronological accident that varies with the individual" R.F. Burton | |||
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+2.Yep. | |||
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+3. Been advocating it for years! | |||
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I wonder how many of the native-born Albertans who died in WWI, WWII and Korea would agree with this sentiment? What is different about Alberta separating from Canada and Quebec doing so; both actions will destroy the very Canada that you say you are concerned about. Frankly, I think that breaking up Canada would be the single most idiotic action that we could possibly do. This is, even with it's problems, the best country on Earth. I find it a very sad state of affairs that a recent, non-traditional immigrant like PeterP has more love for Canada than you guys do. The real problem is, as he alluded to, that people here, since the end of WWII, have had it so good compared with the rest of the world, that they are spoiled and think that they are hard done by. If, Canada is so shitty, how come people from all over are begging to come here? I favour "one Canada, my country and your country"as "The Chief" put it so well. Many of my close relatives bled and died for Canada and I will not stand by and watch it destroyed without taking action. What are these ...traditions...that are being destroyed, I don't see that happening. We need to tighten our immigration controls to keep out terrorists, drugdealers, criminals and perverts (like Svend) and get rid of bullshit policies like "multiculturalism", but, we must keep Canada united and free. So, forget separatism and get involved in keeping Canada together. (And don't forget to wear your turbans!!!) | |||
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The fact is that Alberta is putting more finances into this country than they receive from this country.With Quebec the situation is the opposite.Albertans are sick and tired of making the money and having Ontario and Quebec spending it on stupidity like C-68.If Alberta separated we would be a wealthy province.If Quebec separated,they would soon be broke without all the handouts given to them by the federal government. | |||
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