Wife and I just got our certificates of training from the State Police. Now we just have to go down to the sheriff's office, pay the extortion fees, and liscines will arrive in mail.

I much prefer constitutional carry but only 12 states have that.

I agree 100%. However just to stay out of the limelight, you must follow local laws.

Gentleman: Fees and paperwork done. Now I just have to wait the 60 days for them to send approval to Sheriff who will then issue license.

I go back and forth on Constitutional carry. If a particular state legislature wants to enact it, then I am not going to write any letters.

However, in KY the only onerous issue the wait. You take a five hour class designed to introduce new shooters to basic handgun safety, a in depth look (as much as these things can be)at carry and self defense statutes in KY. Then from 7 yards put 15 out of 21 scoreable shots on FBI silhouette. Basic stuff that if you cannot do, you really, really do not need to be carrying a gun.

All of that goes to Frankfort who background checks you. Then the sheriff must issue/make you out a permit.

My wife picked her liscense yesterday. Mine is still being processed by State Police.

quote:

you really, really do not need to be carrying a gun.

But, "constitutional carry" says you can! Doesn't even matter if you are a looney tune!
BTW, in some states, you don't even have to fire a firearm! But, when some states refuse reciprocity with them,folks get upset!
Peter.

quote:

But, "constitutional carry" says you can! Doesn't even matter if you are a looney tune!BTW, in some states, you don't even have to fire a firearm! But, when some states refuse reciprocity with them,folks get upset!Peter

The constitution also allows one to write nonsense and report it as news.

I well never understand people who do not want to give themselves more freedom.

I agree with p dog on this. There is no reason that EVERYONE should not be allowed to carry a gun, any time and anywhere, whether or not it is concealed. The first thing they used to give people back when they got out of prison was their guns as part of their belongings.

The police CAN NOT protect anyone. They are a reactionary force. It is up to each individual to defend themselves on a day-to-day basis and they should be allowed to do so.

I am a member, not life, of the NRA and love all guns. But, I do believe all rights carry responsibility and no right is absolute.

If a state passes constitutional carry, I will write no letters in opposition. However, if you can not pass a 20 question test and at 7 yards put 15 out of 21 shots on a static big FBI silhouette in a safe manner you really, really, really do not need to be carrying a gun. It is the very basic lowest common denominator requirement. My state, at least, is not taking away the right. It is a base line reasonable reg to try insure safety/ base line level of skill.

What I find a more interesting debate is no S. Ct decision has come out and called voting a fundamental right. While still being debated and fleshed out Heller did call firearm ownership a fundamental right. The left gets all upset over proof of Id laws for voting. In part they say such laws are designed to disenfranchise the poor (often people of color). Back foot poll TSX if you will.

Why does no one including the NRA not care that the fees associated with CCW often mandated by statute are preventing poor folks (people of color often)from exercising a fundamental right. Part of the answer is how far or narrow you Heller and the Chicago case (McDonald).

Part of the answer is overwhelming it is white folks getting CCWs and the fees are not onerous. A final observation is that a 20 dollar state ID to vote should not be construed as an unreasonable or unimportant government limitation on the right to vote when compared to the legitimate or important evil the gov is trying to legislate against being voter fraud. However, critics will point to studies that voter fraud is a made up boogie man. Thus, such legislation is unreasonable and fraudulent.

My final thought is use the model the left has provided for attacking voter ID laws with success to attack the fees associated with exercising an arguable fundamental right.

Another crazy idea I have had that no one caries about is to use the preemption doctrine and commerce analysis to attack all these crazy new state semi auto assualt, private transfer, and pistol bans. The Fed has 3 major acts stating what a firearm is in this nation state, what can be owned by civilians in this nation state, how they can be transferred in this nation state. Therefore, the Fed has completely regulated the field and states cannot regulate in the field.

quote:

If a state passes constitutional carry, I will write no letters in opposition

Well you support it in your state here is your chance.

http://vb.opencarry.org/forums...-Legislative-Session

Again I ask why would you not allow yourself to have more freedom.

Respectfully, I do not support constitutional carry. I do not feel in the slightest that one should be allowed to carry a firearm without demonstrating a baseline level of safe firearm handling. Nor do I feel in the slightest that the 2nd amendment has been infringed by such a low standard. I will not write for or against it. If I were in the KY legislature I would vote against it. No right is absolute.

The requirements for CCW here are about eqal to what I had to do to get my Hunters Saftey card at 12 years old. Actually, the written test was easier.

In practice we would also lose reciprocity with other states. This would be harmful to CCW holders.

On another practical note: our legislature has bigger things/ problems than someone having to put 15 out of 21 shots on an FBI shilloute at 7 yards stationary.

I respectfully disagree. It is not about less freedom. It is about an appropriate amount of responsibility we owe each other in the political unit. The amendments seek to limit state regulation, but not destroy the state's power to regulate entirely.

Now as I write and think through this I will grant KY is not having us engage in in depth firearms training. So, why do it at all if it is so easy. Ok good rebuttal. I can only stand by what I have previously typed. That observation simply does not sway me. If it does you I am ok with that. Unlike no one in particular I do not like political defeats, but I do try to accept them.

At the end of the day California is a anti freedom state bc more Californians than not want it that way and vote for folks to keep it that way. Not saying they are right, but we do get what we ask for.

John Lott just wrote an interesting piece, suggesting that voters pass the same background test as those for buying a gun... Makes sense to me.. interesting read.....

http://johnrlott.blogspot.com/

Name one State where Constitutional Carry has been a problem?
We just got it here, 1-1-17, and no problems.

There has been no need for a state issued permit here in Alaska for years. LOTS of people carry guns. We don't have a problem with law abiding citizen shootin up the state just because they have'nt passed some so-called "common sense gun safety law". What gives anyone the right to tell me or anyone else how or when I can protect myself and my family?

Having said that, Alaska does issue CC Permits if one so desires. I chose to take the 2 day NRA course, get fingerprinted, pay the bucks and get my CC Permit. There are quite a few states that require a CC permit that have reciprocity with Alaska. Plus Alaska CC permits are stamped NICS Exempt so no need to fill out a 4473 when doing an FFL transfer.

What we need is a Federal law that allows carry without a permit (which I think we already have, the 2nd Ammendent)or, we need a Federal law that requires every state to accept every other states permit.

quote:

My final thought is use the model the left has provided for attacking voter ID laws with success to attack the fees associated with exercising an arguable fundamental right.

Agreed 100%

Both are fundamental rights!

.

Well, today is a good start. House passed the state reciprocity law. The anti-gunners are freaking out as to be expected. They figure a licensed concealed carry user in one state will step across a state line and start killing children. The insanity never stops.

Here in Ohio you take a class and range time. Your local Sheriff does your license.
With a CCW you no longer have to have a back ground check for buying a firearm. They photo copy your CCW, do your 4473 and go home with your firearm. It isn't the best but not the worst.

quote:

Originally posted by Snyd:
Well, today is a good start. House passed the state reciprocity law. The anti-gunners are freaking out as to be expected. They figure a licensed concealed carry user in one state will step across a state line and start killing children. The insanity never stops.

Snyd:
Welcome to AR.
I live at mile 87 of the Parks.
I've a table at the Palmer Lions gun snow March 3&4. If you go, stop by my table and say "Hi." My table will be the one with a few cased double rifles on it.
Cal

Snyd,
Correction to your statement of NOT filling out a BATFE 4473 form to purchase/transfer a firearm is WRONG w/ AK CCW w/ NICS wavier.

You still fill out the 4473 but it is not called into the FBI as you elected to provide fingerprints & the $100 fee so the background has already been done.

Get your facts straight!!

Constitutional Carry presents a dilemma to me regarding rights vs responsibility. Nothing scares me more than an untrained person with a gun. As Jeff Cooper said " buying a gun no more makes you armed than buying a guitar makes you a musician".

I don't have an issue with mandatory competence testing for CCWs. Of course, I believe that we should have intelligence testing to vote.

I have an LTC (License to Carry a concealed weapon) in California and I have seen people at the training classes who should not have been allowed to own weapons much less carry one.