60 rounds and 40 cases, here's the specs for the curious guys..

475 NE
70gr IMR 3031
Fed 215 primer
2 gr Poly
H&H brass
Woodleigh 480 gr softs
crimped in the cannalure

now when I get the extra stuff from JudgeG, I should be able to keep my shooting habit going for a while...

any opinions on the use of the filler, or how to use it when I start reloading myself..

Glad you finaly got your reloading stuff. NE450#2 and Judge G, both left for their safaris today. NE, will not be back untill April 1. So those sources of info are out of pocket for the time being.

You could have come up here to shoot with the "Band of Bubbas" this afternoon. But I suspect that after the B-B-Q cookoff and party the last two nights, you may not have been up for shooting big bores this afternoon.

Hog Killer

If I'd known it was going to arrive today I'd have stayed in Houston a couple of more days and helped you try it out.

quote:

Originally posted by 470CapstickA2:

any opinions on the use of the filler, or how to use it when I start reloading myself..

Be very careful. There are lots of reports of chambering being ringed due to pressure spikes caused by fillers. I am no expert on fillers, so you may want to consult with people who have done more work with them, such as the person who posts here as 450NENo.2.

i have agree with 500 grains. fillers in my experience are no no's.

quote:

Originally posted by butchloc:
i have agree with 500 grains. fillers in my experience are no no's.

Well i have my .450 NE 3 1/4 only for two weeks but i read a lot of fillers and have to say, i prefer a little bit more of slow burning powder...

I shot 10 shots with loads that where with filler but the waste after shooting in the barrels is unbelieveable.

When I had my .450-400 I found no difference in accuracy (4 shots inside an inch at 50 yards) with and without filler using RL-15, but there sure was a lot of crud with the filler. My understanding was that the filler was used to improve consistency of the loads, but my rifle sure was consistent without filler. I was more concerned with the reports of ringed chambers with filler.

Dave

I have only shot a couple of rounds through my 465 H&H with dacron pillow filler and that load didn't meet velocity specs for me so I didn't go any further with it. But I didn't notice a white cloud after the shots or residue in the barrel or chambers. Were the problems of ringed barrels occuring with dacron fillers or cork wads?

A bit of trivia for all you double rifle reloaders follows. In the early 70's I lived in Salmon ID and got to be friends with Elmer Keith. He helped get into double rifles in a big way and was my mentor on this subject. He recommended using cork wads to hold the powder back against the primer. For awhile there were reports of ringed barrels and pressure spikes using cork gasket material in large bore bottlenecked cartridges. He reasoned that the problems occured when using modern gasket material that has a rubber binding agent to hold the cork together. I have always used cork poster board material that doesn't have a rubber binder in it. Been using them in my 465H&H for over 20 years with out any problem.

465H&H

Ok, as I inspected some of my ammo... since UPS crushed the box, I noticed the bullets were driven back into the cases on a few past the cannelure. Not so far as to compress the powder, but definitely noticeable. Also, the rounds seem to fit pretty loose inside the chamber, is this normal on the old/new doubles?

BTW.... now I know what you guys mean by the cool sound a round makes when you drop it in a double rifle.

Several years (?) ago, reloader magazine had an article about reloading the NE cartridge. If someone still has the magazine they can freshen my memory.

As I recall two recomendations were front and center. 3031 was suspect about pressure spikes and Rel 15 with a filler was a recomended safe method.

When using dacron filler 3-5 grains is required to fill the void and is not solid, some powder migration may be possilbe. The number 2 Kynoch foam wad weighs 1 grain and totally fills the void.

Graeme Wright in "Shooting the British Double Rifle" discusses different powders in chapter 5. 4831 and Rel 15 seem to be the favored propellant. He goes on to say that Federal Factory loads use Rel 15 without fillers. They do use a proprietary Primer (216). He also seems to find 3031 suspect......

For the record, I use 88 grains of Rel 15, Kynock wads, Bell Cases, and Federal 215 primers pushing 500 grain Woodleigh softs and solids.

470CAP

I just noticed the load ypu posted as 70 gr of IMR3031 for the 475 3 1/4". JJ re-regulated my 465H&H for me and used 78 gr. IMR3031 with 480 gr Woodleighs. It shoots well and I get 2098 fps. on a cold day. Are you sure the 70 gr is correct? That seems like an awfully light load.

465H&H

I'm surprised both ways. 70 3031 sounds low in a .475 3 1/4".

.465, I'm very surprised at the velocity you gave. My friend CFA recently got his Holland Dominion .465. J. J. fired two rounds with 77 grains 3031 and 480 Woodleigh softs for regulation and sent it on. Fred want to try that so we loaded eight rounds of that load in Horneber brass. On a cold day, it didn't break 2000 fps. Extraction was very hard, but this was due to bad brass. Factory Cordite Kynoch loaded in 1966 gave, IIRC, 2090 fps with perfect extraction and ejection. New Kynoch loaded in 2002 gave almost exactly the same velocity and also perfect function. Fred is working up with RL 15 now, in new Bell brass.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

Jboutfishn:

When Dacron is used in the proper quantity, powder migration isn't possible. I've pulled bullets from stuff that has bounced around in hunting cars a lot. It stays put.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

quote:

Originally posted by 400 Nitro Express:
Jboutfishn:

When Dacron is used in the proper quantity, powder migration isn't possible. I've pulled bullets from stuff that has bounced around in hunting cars a lot. It stays put.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

OK. I have used Dacron, did not like the "snow storm". How much dacron do you use over how much powder? Have you tried the Kynock Wads? Very light. #2 (470) is 1 grain.

400 Nitro

I'll check again. It is possible that my chrono was acting up as it is want to do occasionaly on sunny days. Searcy sent me some 470 ammo to try in my new 470. He loaded them with 106 gr of IMR4831 in Norma cases and topped them with 500 gr Woodleigh solids. The average velocity was 2187 fps. I loaded the exact same load also in new Norma brass and got 2079 fps. This was on the same day one after the other. It seems that powder lot may have a lot to do with it as it is the only possible variable that I couldn't account for. (except for temperature)

465H&H

I use 1.5 to 2 grains in .400 Jeffery, depending on the load. The last time I loaded .470 I used 4 grains. That amount in those cases compresses enough to prevent migration. I was initially worried about that possibility myself years ago. I played around with it enough then to stop worrying about it.


.465:

The difference in powder lots can be amazing sometimes. In my .400/.360 double, I initially got perfect regulation with 51.5 grain IMR 4350 and 300 grain bullets. I ran out of that lot just before a bear hunt and bought three more cans. With the new lot, 51.5 grains shot 4 inches wide and 200 fps slower. I had to go to 56.3 grains to get back to where I was.
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"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."