After much thinking and reading I’m leaning towards selling off a lot of my safe queens and putting the money towards a big bore double. Being very green is there such a thing as an affordable double rifle? I am looking for at least 40cal + and would like it to cost less than 5k. I have seen the Searcy 470’s and they are great but I cans see 10k into a rifle given my current financial situation. Remington has the SPR22’s in 30-06 for $900 which look cheap but may be my only option. I really want a good SxS express Big Bore working rifle that I can shoot rather than admire in the safe,

Thanks

Brad

If I could find a good 450/400 3 inch for around 5K I'd buy it, then I'd have two!

The only quality rifle for that kind of money will be a Chapuis in 9.3X74R.

Good luck!

quote:

Originally posted by Brad aka Pill Shooter:
After much thinking and reading I’m leaning towards selling off a lot of my safe queens and putting the money towards a big bore double. Being very green is there such a thing as an affordable double rifle? I am looking for at least 40cal + and would like it to cost less than 5k. I have seen the Searcy 470’s and they are great but I cans see 10k into a rifle given my current financial situation. Remington has the SPR22’s in 30-06 for $900 which look cheap but may be my only option. I really want a good SxS express Big Bore working rifle that I can shoot rather than admire in the safe,

Thanks

Brad

LESS than $5K?? NOT anything near excellent or better condition! Except perhaps a Pedersoli Kodiak hammer gun. They are good guns, but of an older style, being an exact replica of a late 19th Century Colt double rifle: I believe these are made in .45/70 and 9.3X74R. http://www.shooterschoice.com/pedersoli/pedkodiak.htm

I have heard of a .45/70 or two being rechambered for 45/90 or .45/110, or perhaps a British .450 Express round.

I have one of the muzzleloader variety, a .54. It is very accurate for a round-ball double. This is a 4-shot pattern R-L,R-L at 100 yards.



I don't know if the rifles required re-regulation after the rechambering. But I believe you could buy a Pedersoli .45/70, rechamber & re-regulate it for $5K or less..... http://www.dixiegunworks.com/product_info.php?products_id=3516

let me know if you find one, i might be right behind you to get one ...
the pedersoli is about it, rechambered to 45/120 is the easist to do to get over .40

or build one

You should be able to find a decent hammer gun in the 450/400 range for near that money.

Never mind about 2/3 of the BS you read on chat rooms.

Start searching and ye shall find.

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
You should be able to find a decent hammer gun in the 450/400 range for near that money.

That's extremely unrealistic in today's market.
-------------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

400,
perhaps, but there is this thing that appears to be a slight recession beginning. A PH/Outfitter friend tells me that bookings for 2008-2009 are being cancelled or postponed a year.

Rich
DRSS
Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost...

400,
i speak from knowledge, not speculation.

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
400,
i speak from knowledge, not speculation.

So do I.
------------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
You should be able to find a decent hammer gun in the 450/400 range for near that money.

Never mind about 2/3 of the BS you read on chat rooms.

Start searching and ye shall find.

I'd very much like to know where I can find a good double rifle in 450/400 3 inch for 5K.
Seriously, please email me if you have a line on one. I most certainly have not seen one. That would be thrilling!

quote:

Originally posted by Idaho Sharpshooter:
400,
perhaps, but there is this thing that appears to be a slight recession beginning. A PH/Outfitter friend tells me that bookings for 2008-2009 are being cancelled or postponed a year.

Rich:

With respect to the DR market, I'm not seeing that at all. I've been tuned in to it for a long time. It's very hot right now.

Over the last 20 or so years, DR market values have steadily increased. While they've plateaued for periods, they have never declined. The DR market, especially the British sector, seems to actually attract money during periods of economic instability.
------------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

I recall seeing a Jeffery 450/400 for $5000 out of Alberta, Canada something like three years ago. It had frosted barrels, and in my interpretation from the description it sounded well used, so to speak. IIRC it sold for the asking price in less than 24 hours. I haven't seen a 450/400 NE or BPE for less than ~ $8,000 to $10,000 since, and those were all "working" guns. FWIW DuaneB

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
400,
i speak from knowledge, not speculation.

One can buy junked out doubles for $5K in any chambering, but a 450/400 3", or a 3 1/4" nitro proofed rifle, that is worth owning will set you back far more than any $5K! Of course that all depends on what you are willing to accept as acceptable! I doubt, however, you'll find more than a couple of ragged out ones in that chambering for $5K!

Why does it have to be 40 cal plus? Get a Chapuis in 9.3x74R. Very good little rifle and it'll kill anything that walks. It may not stop them from stomping your guts out but they might die later on.

quote:

It may not STOP them from stomping your guts out but they might die later on.

Bullet placement plus the needed penetration

equals a dead beast. Unless it falls on top of

you, the STOPPING part is a done deal.

Yes, i know where two are presently.
One needs new screws and if i were to buy that one i would probably restock it though it does not need that.
Barrels and regulation are fine.
Price on that gun is $4,500.
it is a 450/400

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
Yes, i know where two are presently.
One needs new screws and if i were to buy that one i would probably restock it though it does not need that.
Barrels and regulation are fine.
Price on that gun is $4,500.
it is a 450/400

Okay, show 'em to us.

This should be entertaining.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
One can buy junked out doubles for $5K in any chambering, but a 450/400 3", or a 3 1/4" nitro proofed rifle, that is worth owning will set you back far more than any $5K! Of course that all depends on what you are willing to accept as acceptable!

True. The .450/.400 Nitros are way up. Used to be able to find a few idiots around selling 'em that cheap, but not anymore. Given a well informed buyer and seller, a decent boxlock .400 will bring three times that. Good quality guns in excellent condition will bring four or five times as much. So, if the gun is fairly priced at $5000, it was either junk to begin with, or is a wreck.

Most of these $5000 British doubles are irredeemable, but a few can be worth some aggravation. A couple years ago, a good friend bought a high quality boxlock .450/.400 3" from a large dealer for $4500. Excellent bores, fine, crisp engraving and no corrosion issues. Also off face (minor issue), ruined stock (major issue), all pins buggered (major issue, believe it or not), in need of reblacking, and out of regulation (minor issues). Two years and $10,000 later, it's really coming along. Only striking off, re-regulating, and blacking the barrels remain, and that's being done now. That's why an informed seller was willing to take $4500 for it.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

Gun Toter,
If you buy it, please post some pictures. If you don't please email the contact to me so I might have a "shot" at it.

Another option are the Black powder express's in 450 and 500. I have not had a 500 but I can tell you from experience that the 450's with hard cast flat nose bullets kill with suprising effeciency. With very soft bullets they are double distilled hell on wheels for deer and such..

one can find these occationaly in good mechanical shape in the 5k range. If they are pretty or by a really well know maker you aren't going to get even a B.P. for 5k I think. I can't seem to any way.

Anyway you must be careful. A project bolt action is one thing. A double with mechanical problems can be a project that runs to years and cost 10's of thousands to fix. My 2 cents worth and even tho I'm as ignorant as the day is long I have paid for a college education on this issue.

400,
It amazes me how many experts there are on the internet and here on AR.
Just because you see dealers asking the kind of money you are referring to you believe that is what is happening everywhere.

Six months ago, i had the chance to buy a boxlock 450/400 for $6,750. i waited and sure enough, it was gone, three days later. The only reason i waited is because i tried to find out more about the gun. It was a calcutta gun and i wanted to make certain it was not a BP gun that had been converted.
It was a nitro and i knew it in the back of my mind and simply should have bought it.

I know of two, like i said above in my previous post, that the sellers simply do not get on the web and so have no idea what things are selling for, or better yet what people are asking for them.

There are deals out there you simply are looking under the wrong rocks.

I could go on and on about the double rifles i have bought and sold. And the ones i should have bought.
I have owned over 20 big nitro doubles. Still own 8. I know where good deals are and i know where people can go to get their brains blown out on prices.

Rusty,
PM me.

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
400,
It amazes me how many experts there are on the internet and here on AR.
Just because you see dealers asking the kind of money you are referring to you believe that is what is happening everywhere.

Six months ago, i had the chance to buy a boxlock 450/400 for $6,750. i waited and sure enough, it was gone, three days later. The only reason i waited is because i tried to find out more about the gun. It was a calcutta gun and i wanted to make certain it was not a BP gun that had been converted.
It was a nitro and i knew it in the back of my mind and simply should have bought it.

I know of two, like i said above in my previous post, that the sellers simply do not get on the web and so have no idea what things are selling for, or better yet what people are asking for them.

There are deals out there you simply are looking under the wrong rocks.

I could go on and on about the double rifles i have bought and sold. And the ones i should have bought.
I have owned over 20 big nitro doubles. Still own 8. I know where good deals are and i know where people can go to get their brains blown out on prices.

The wiggling is as entertaining as I thought it would be.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

if you want a powerful "working rifle" for the under $5k price consider one of the shotgun conversions.

jason simpkins has built some well regulated doubles in really powerfull nitro loadings. he's good at what he does and his prices are affordable. so are bob show's guns.

if this interests you contact me for me details and contact info for both.

there are a lot of good double rifle builders here in usa. you just have to root them out.

tom ondrus ftondrus@hotmail.com tel 814 859 0008 till midnight east coast time

quote:

Originally posted by 400 Nitro Express:

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
400,
It amazes me how many experts there are on the internet and here on AR.
Just because you see dealers asking the kind of money you are referring to you believe that is what is happening everywhere.

Six months ago, i had the chance to buy a boxlock 450/400 for $6,750. i waited and sure enough, it was gone, three days later. The only reason i waited is because i tried to find out more about the gun. It was a calcutta gun and i wanted to make certain it was not a BP gun that had been converted.
It was a nitro and i knew it in the back of my mind and simply should have bought it.

I know of two, like i said above in my previous post, that the sellers simply do not get on the web and so have no idea what things are selling for, or better yet what people are asking for them.

There are deals out there you simply are looking under the wrong rocks.

I could go on and on about the double rifles i have bought and sold. And the ones i should have bought.
I have owned over 20 big nitro doubles. Still own 8. I know where good deals are and i know where people can go to get their brains blown out on prices.

The wiggling is as entertaining as I thought it would be.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

X2. Let us see them. Packy

Tell you what.
If i pass on either of them i am going to flip them to Rusty, simply to see you eat crow.

Try A-1 sauce, it might help it go down.

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
Tell you what.
If i pass on either of them i am going to flip them to Rusty, simply to see you eat crow.

Try A-1 sauce, it might help it go down.

Imaginary crows.
-----------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burn gunpowder."

Shoooooooot....if you pass, and a 450/400 can be found for $5K in a non-fucked up condition, let me know too!

And if someone is selling a DR in good condition in that caliber for that money, than he's a retard, plain and simple.

577,
One gun is in California and the guy simply never gets on the internet, he has little knowledge of what some people are asking and selling doubleguns for. Further, that gun needs some restoration, so he thinks it is devalued.
I am presently trying to find a couple guys to do some work for me on the gun should i buy it.
It is a 450/400 nitro.

Part of my delay also stems from the fact that i have two double rifles being worked on presently.

gun toter:

no disrespect, but if you know of two such guns, and they need "some" restoration, you know what the market if getting these days, why not make an investment decision to buy now, restore soon, and resell ASAP? You know a good Brit gun will bring in a hellava lot of $$$ if done right... If the gun is not toally fucked, putting on face will be a few hundred bucks...a re-reg will be another few hundred bucks (unless the rib have to be removed). A proper re-stock will run between $5K and $9K depending on the job and reblack, re case color isn't all that bad either.

I'd love to see the guns in their current state.

I've seen redone guns from a named Brit manufacturer sell for $20K plus these days.

577NitroExpress - JJ is charging a flat $600 to re-regulate a double rifle.

I'm just an old fart up here in the Pacific Northwest, but I've been pondering just how one goes about finding double rifles that have not been advertised. I would like to have this ability and so would like to have just a few of the search secrets kinda explained to me, if you don't mind. I mean, what's the deal? Next door neighbors or something? If so, and you have purchased and sold as many as you indicated above, it must be one helluva neighborhood you're in. Lotta dumb rish people that own double rifles. Forgive me, but somehow it just doesn't compute. DuaneB

quote:

Originally posted by DuaneB:
577NitroExpress - JJ is charging a flat $600 to re-regulate a double rifle.

I'm just an old fart up here in the Pacific Northwest, but I've been pondering just how one goes about finding double rifles that have not been advertised. I would like to have this ability and so would like to have just a few of the search secrets kinda explained to me, if you don't mind. I mean, what's the deal? Next door neighbors or something? If so, and you have purchased and sold as many as you indicated above, it must be one helluva neighborhood you're in. Lotta dumb rish people that own double rifles. Forgive me, but somehow it just doesn't compute. DuaneB

JJ's flat rate is not all that flat, but is a starting point,+AMMO

quote:

Originally posted by Gun toter:
Further, that gun needs some restoration

Uh-huh. Here we go....
------------------------------------------------
"Serious rifles have two barrels, everything else just burns gunpowder."

quote:

quote:
Originally posted by Gun toter:
Further, that gun needs some restoration


Uh-huh. Here we go....
------------------------------------------------

It is an underlever hammer gun with cracked stock that has been repaired with a fiberglass boat repair kit. The barrels have traces of rifling you can see between the pits, the forearms is from a Stevens shotgun, one hammer is missing and the other is a replacement modified from a French pinfire shotgun. However, it can be restrored.

Rusty if you think they are worth the money, buy both and I will send you a $500.00 premium in addition to the purchase price for the one you don't want.

Perry

Good deals still exist! On a smaller scale, I found this nice little Frenchie...Robust No. 4 16ga for $275.00 from a private party who just wanted to get rid of some inherited guns. I was trembling to get the money in his hand and the gun in mine as quickly as possible.

Thanks PWN375, I'll pass!

Luv2safari,
Great picture! Used to own a Brittany. This reminds me, I haven't shot enough quail, yet!
Nice shotgun!

Mine fits the title to the T. Spartan 12ga double $300 with a pair of EAA Tangalo .45-70 inserts @ $150 each = a $600 double rifle. The sights came out of the parts drawer. A poor man could own this rifle. Does it shoot? I don't know. I put all the stuff together awhile back but haven't had time to play with it. The way I plan on regulating it if it doesn't regulate well enough with the supplied fittings is I'll dremmal out a little extra on the collars and put a shim in place. By moving the shim around I should be able to change the POI. When the correct POI is achieved I'll silver solder the shims in place. I have no great expectations for this rifle. If I can put bullets from both barrels into a paper plate at 50yds consistently I'll call it good. No, I would never bet my life on this rifle, it's just a fun project.

Terry

TC1

Have exact same setup, have shot it with 300 HP and 405 FN bullets over 5744 and IMR 3031, paper plate accuracy at 50 Yds is achievable.
I am still playing with loads and sights. Lots of FUN
Who fitted your tubes ?
I could not help but notice that the extractor had been split ! Is the top soldered in place ?
I went a slightly different way, I just filed the rim from the tube to allow the larger extractor to pass over the tube, I was not concerned about chamber pressure as the rim of the case is super strong.
I will let you know when I get a load developed if you are interested. I am pretty happy with my $600 DR that shoots cheap .458 bullets.
Nitro450exp

Yes, I cut the extractor on mine to fit the insert tubes. The top piece of the shotgun extractor is held in place by the insert tubes. They're flanged and hold it in place just fine. If I ever went back to a shotgun set up I would probably soilder it in but for now I see no need to.

I installed the inserts and sights myself. Seemed like a DYI job to me.

Terry

Where is Gun Toter now? Packy