My question is pretty straight forward....which is better, Searcy or Merkel? And why?

Obviously one is American made, and one is not....but they do seem similar in design. I'm curious if one has better materials and/or construction?

For the sake of argument, let's say we are talking about .500 NE ejector guns in both brands.

I don't own a Merk but do have a Searcy; the S will have better wood than any Merkel I have ever seen and there is certainly nothing wrong with the quality and regulation of a Searcy. (PH model and above; not sure about the field grade) Bonus; it is US made and warranted. I would pick the Searcy over Merkel.

I've got three Merk's and they all have beautiful wood! The only problem I've ever had with any Merk was with a single set trigger on a 2020 chambered in 9.3x74r. I got rid of that gun and now all three of mine wear double triggers. I've not found a load that will not shoot in any of them.

Great guns that you can't go wrong with!!!

I have to admit I've been thinking of a Searcy as of late, but if I find a 140 in 450-400 for a reasonable price, it'll be mine!

That is what the wood looks like on my .500 NE.

I looked at a used Searcy that new-guy had on trade. I went with the Merkel.

I don't think you will find anything wrong with the Merkel if it fits you.

Lane, You've got a serious problem with that rifle!


The cheek piece keeps disappearing!

Not even a close call, go with the Searcy.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Brooks:
Lane, You've got a serious problem with that rifle!


The cheek piece keeps disappearing!

Well...it is a right hand stock. I guess I flipped those pic some how.

Some people... ...are prejudiced against Merkels. If you get the chance...comapre them all side by side.

A custom DR maker put a peep-sight on mine for and even he commented on what a decent rifle it was.

The action is a stout time honored design, the barrels are good, and they are well regulated.

Mine weighs 10.5 lbs which I like but others think is too light.

Negatives are that they are less 'cutomisable' than others.

My Merkel just happens to fit me well.

After holding a Searcy, Heym, and Merkel together side by side for a while...I went with the Merkel due to cost. For fit and feel...it was a tie with the Heym. If they were the same price...I would have probably bough the Heym...due to reputation.

But...you'll be hard pressed to find any flies on the Merkel.

If shootaway's recent purchase is any indication of the level of quality coming out of Butches shop now days. I might have to think long and hard about the Merkle. shootaway's new .500 is ROUGH!

Shothiswad went for the cheapest model available. Butch does great work as many other examples show including mine.

Yes, do not judge Searcy quality by that rifle; even Mr Searcy said the field grades are utilitarian rifles that have minimal finish and fit ("we just knock the rough edges off the metal and wood") (but have good grade wood), and perfect regulation. The other grades are fitted and finished as well as anything else on the market. I consider Merkel the low end of the viable DR market; not that they are at all bad; someone has to be at the bottom. Now, cost vs benefit ratio will give a nudge to the Merkel as I think the PH Searcy is now at $15.5K.

Not knocking anyone in any way.....never fooled with a Searcy or Merkel.....

But since warrenty came up ......... if something where to happen to Mr. Searcy....who would handle the warrenty?


.

I dont own a Merkel and dont pay any attention to factory rifles in double rifles but so far I have heard bad thing s about them-one from my gunsmith who says he worked on many of them and they are full of shit.BTW,he brought the subject up on doubles and Merkels not I.Then just this weekend at the range there was a fellow there that took interest to me shooting my 500 and he started talking about his Merkel 7X... He said it was full of shit and it doubles on him every time.He was standing back when I shot my 500 almost sure that it will double-that is what he told me.
I must be the only guy here who likes Searcy doubles.

Who would handle warrenty on an Alex Henry or other top of the line maker that have gone out of business?

Simple it's your choice of which `smith to send it to.

How many other makers offer a lifetime warranty? Merkle? Chapuis? Heym? Blaser?

Heym offers a lifetime warranty as well as Searcy.

I know nothing about Merkels and do think just about any of the larger name brands are finished better than Shootaways .500 NE.

However, for the $8,750 he paid for it, a .500 NE, it still is one hell of a bargin for someone wanting a functional big bore double hunting rifle. More $$$ gets you more frills not necessary a better tool.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Brooks:
Who would handle warrenty on an Alex Henry or other top of the line maker that have gone out of business?

Simple it's your choice of which `smith to send it to.

How many other makers offer a lifetime warranty? Merkle? Chapuis? Heym? Blaser?

I beleive Merkel does.

I have owned 4 Merkels and one Searcy. The Merkels fit me very well and with a trigger job from a local smith, they all shoot great. I have had no problem with them at all. My Searcy is a field grade 470NE and was built for me with my measurements. It was regulated with Hornady factory loads as well as Butch's favorite load of IMR4831. The Searcy and the Merkels will shoot groups inside a 2" circle at 50yds if I do my part. If the price is right I would buy either. If I wanted some custom work/wood, I would buy the Searcy.

The Merkel I previously owned was 100%. It never doubled with me and was a hell of a good shooter. Took 3 elephants with it and trusted it completely. It was finished pretty well also, with the exception of the engraved animals being a bit cartoonish.

It was doubled twice, but not by me. Once by an inexperienced PH who wanted to shoot it. I agreed and without paying attention, he put two fingers in the trigger guard and promptly had a double discharge. The other time was a friend who strummed the rear trigger under recoil. The gun functioned fine, just some operator error on both instances.

That said, every Searcy I've held or shot has been a much better rifle. I'd say the regulation between the two rifles are about equal, and even though the Merkel fit me well, the LOP was too short, needing an extended recoil pad to correct. Balance and feel however go hands down to the Searcy. If I were looking for a new DR in a non vintage offering, and choosing between the Merkel and Searcy, I'd go with the Searcy for the more customized fit, if nothing else.

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I dont own a Merkel and dont pay any attention to factory rifles in double rifles but so far I have heard bad thing s about them-one from my gunsmith who says he worked on many of them and they are full of shit.BTW,he brought the subject up on doubles and Merkels not I.Then just this weekend at the range there was a fellow there that took interest to me shooting my 500 and he started talking about his Merkel 7X... He said it was full of shit and it doubles on him every time.He was standing back when I shot my 500 almost sure that it will double-that is what he told me.
I must be the only guy here who likes Searcy doubles.

Many if not most of us here like both Butch and his doubles.
Many if not most of us here do not like you due to your arrogance, rudeness, and know-it-all personality.
However, at the AR dinner I will introduce myself as "Shootaway" to see what happens!
Cal

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I dont own a Merkel and dont pay any attention to factory rifles in double rifles but so far I have heard bad thing s about them-one from my gunsmith who says he worked on many of them and they are full of shit.BTW,he brought the subject up on doubles and Merkels not I.Then just this weekend at the range there was a fellow there that took interest to me shooting my 500 and he started talking about his Merkel 7X... He said it was full of shit and it doubles on him every time.He was standing back when I shot my 500 almost sure that it will double-that is what he told me.
I must be the only guy here who likes Searcy doubles.

Many if not most of us here like both Butch and his doubles.
Many if not most of us here do not like you due to your arrogance, rudeness, and know-it-all personality.
However, at the AR dinner I will introduce myself as "Shootaway" to see what happens!
Cal

Cal, do that and I'm almost positive you'll need a body guard before the night's over!

quote:

Originally posted by cal pappas:

quote:

Originally posted by shootaway:
I dont own a Merkel and dont pay any attention to factory rifles in double rifles but so far I have heard bad thing s about them-one from my gunsmith who says he worked on many of them and they are full of shit.BTW,he brought the subject up on doubles and Merkels not I.Then just this weekend at the range there was a fellow there that took interest to me shooting my 500 and he started talking about his Merkel 7X... He said it was full of shit and it doubles on him every time.He was standing back when I shot my 500 almost sure that it will double-that is what he told me.
I must be the only guy here who likes Searcy doubles.

Many if not most of us here like both Butch and his doubles.
Many if not most of us here do not like you due to your arrogance, rudeness, and know-it-all personality.
However, at the AR dinner I will introduce myself as "Shootaway" to see what happens!
Cal

Obviously planning to buy your own drinks all night.

Let me say first that I am a huge fan of Butch's DR's and have said that over and over again. For $8,750 (what Shitaway paid), the fit and finish of my Merkel's are far superior.

I'm not knocking Butch - His high end guns are as nice as any on the planet, BUT, at that price point, I'd rather have my Merkels.

If I were going to spend 15-20K, I'd be looking at a Searcy or a Heym (heavily weighted towards a Searcy). At this point in my life, I'd rather spend the extra $$$ on hunting.

Edit: If I were giving him advice (which he doesn't need), I would tell him to stay away from the lower end market. There is no way he can compete with Merkel, Chapuis, VC or any of the others. they have manufacturing scale that he'll never be able to match.

Just my opinion!

JDA

quote:

Originally posted by JDA-CO:
Let me say first that I am a huge fan of Butch's DR's and have said that over and over again. For $8,750 (what Shitaway paid), the fit and finish of my Merkel's are far superior.

I'm not knocking Butch - His high end guns are as nice as any on the planet, BUT, at that price point, I'd rather have my Merkels.

If I were going to spend 15-20K, I'd be looking at a Searcy or a Heym.

Edit: If I were giving him advice (which he doesn't need), I would tell him to stay away from the lower end market. There is no way he can compete with Merkel, Chapuis, VC or any of the others. they have manufacturing scale that he'll never be able to match.

Just my opinion!

JDA

I suppose I'll show my bias here but having owned both a Merkel, a Chapuis, and 2 VCs, I don't think I'd put the VC in the same class as Merkel and Chapuis. I'd put the VC closer in line with Hyem and Searcy's (above the field grade anyway) in terms of fit and finish.

"However, at the AR dinner I will introduce myself as "Shootaway" to see what happens!"
Cal

Are you borrowing an Alaska State Trooper's kevlar
vest for the trip to Dallas...

quote:

Originally posted by Todd Williams:

I suppose I'll show my bias here but having owned both a Merkel, a Chapuis, and 2 VCs, I don't think I'd put the VC in the same class as Merkel and Chapuis. I'd put the VC closer in line with Hyem and Searcy's (above the field grade anyway) in terms of fit and finish.

Todd: That's a fair point!

I own 3 Searcy rifles (2 doubles and one stalking rifle) and have another double on the way. They all shoot superbly and are very well made. I have read the criticisms of shootaways double, and I find them unfair. Too many folks expect best quality fit and finish from a bottom of the line rifle. You get what you pay for, and Butch is up front about that. If you want best quality, be willing to shell out $24K or so for a V-C Imperial or Searcy Deluxe, and there will be no imperfections whatsoever.

When you have a question or issue with a Searcy rifle and call the shop in Boron, you talk to Butch Searcy, the man who built your rifle. Butch's service is second to none, and in my opinion, this places the value of his rifles above the Merkels.

quote:

Originally posted by JDA-CO:
I would tell him to stay away from the lower end market.
JDA

Me too! But that would simply to keep the 'riff raff' away from this forum. No names mentioned but he's in Montreal.

I've owned two Searcy's both .470's the first was a field grade the second which I still own is a customized upgraded rifle that is very nice. Both were amazingly accurate. The field grade that shitzaway got is so far below the quality and finish of my older field grade I was shocked when I first saw it. That is what my comment above was based on.

quote:

Originally posted by surestrike:
I've owned two Searcy's both .470's the first was a field grade the second which I still own is a customized upgraded rifle that is very nice. Both were amazingly accurate. The field grade that shitzaway got is so far below the quality and finish of my older field grade I was shocked when I first saw it. That is what my comment above was based on.

Surestrike: That was my point (which you said more eloquently than I), at that price point, a Merk is a better buy...

I guess the best answer would be a Heym action with a Merkel barrel soldered to a Searcy barrel?

I bought one of the field grades when Butch advertised them here. I am definitely not unhappy with it at all. It is more accurate than I can do with it as evidenced by the final regulation target he sent but that is my fault. He also is building me a .470 that will be a bit more expensive, not just the field grade. The field grade is definitely made for hunting, and while it doesn't have the fit and finish of the more expensive Doubles, I didn't pay for the more expensive fit and finish. Completely satisfied with my Searcy and am anxiously awaiting the .470's arrival. I
also owned a Merkel in .470. I did have it double and so did nearly every one else that shot it. My fault as I was pulling the front trigger and strumming the rear one. And the Merkel wasn't long enough with the standard LOP, the Searcy, Butch took my measurements and made that Field Grade to fit me.
Searcy definitely.

This is an apples and oranges comparison. The only thing the two have in common is that both have two barrels!

I have two Merkel double rifles and they are fine WORKING double rifles, and I love mine for hunting, but they can’t compare to a Searcy in over all finish or wood even to the Searcy PH model, the fit and finish of the Merk will compare with the field grade, but only on the outside! The insides of Butches rifles are finished cleaner on the inside than the 140 grade merks.

I’ve known Butch for may years but have never owned one of his rifles. That being said I have handled and shot several of them, and I have never seen one that was not perfectly regulated and accurate. That includes the early ones built on the Browning BSS action.

In the final analysis I would take either one into the weeds with a “bite, stomp, and claw” with a perfect confidence in either’s reliability and accuracy!

Would I rather have a B. Searcy Classic than a Merkel 140-2? You bet I would, but let me say again, the two rifles are an apples and oranges comparison, in all ways! However nobody has to hold his head down in shame when hunting with either of the two brands!

The biggest practical difference is Price! You won’t go wrong either way you go! If I could afford the difference I would buy the Searcy classic, but I will not sell either of my Merkels to do so!

......................................................................Opinion! We all know what they say about opinion!

Would depend on if I felt I had to have a new gun, or bought used, and how much I was willing to spend.


New, I would absolutely buy a Merkel. Because for the Searcy I could afford today, I'm not impressed with the gun that Shootaway received.

It shoots fine, but for 8K+, I wouldn't be satisfied with the wood or fit and finish of that gun.

If I were looking at a gun in the 15K+ Range, then perhaps. I've handled a few used Searcy's and they were quite nice in that price range.

Have owned one from both makers but they where different rifles. The Searcy a classic at around $15G and the Merkel at around $10G so hard to compare. If I wanted a low priced 470NE or 500NE for chasing Jumbo in the early season Jess then I would look for a second hand Merkel with those lovely short barrels.

BOTH EXCELLENT RIFLES. I HAVE A MERKEL IN 470 AND IT HAS WORKED FOR ME ON TWO BOTSWANA ELEPHANT BULLS AND A BUFFALO IN MOZAMBIQUE. I HAVE GREAT MEMORIES WITH THIS RIFLE. IT DOUBLED ON MY VERY FIRST SHOT WHEN THE RIFLE WAS NEW (PROBABLY MY FAULT) AND NEVER HAS AGAIN. I TRUST THE RIFLE AND IT SHOOTS WELL. THAT IS WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO ME. THAT SAID BUTCH MAKES A GREAT RIFLE ALSO!
MARK

Two totally different price points. If we are talking Butch's recent field grade which looks like dog shit then I would go for the Merkel all day long. If we are talking his classic then we need to look at each individual rifle as far as fit an finish. Have handled some that are excellent for that price point of 18k and some that I honestly would not give 10k for.

Well it is a ''Field Grade '' not an ''Exhibition Grade '' rifle ,so buyers cant expect it to be a Purdy .$8750.00 for a Good working gun, is good value imo anyway you look at it ,which is what it is, not a Russian mafios gold ,diamond ,engraved abomination !that cost $250 K

for me merkel,its just personal,compare chevy and benz

quote:

Originally posted by McKay:If we are talking Butch's recent field grade which looks like dog shit

I think that is a little to strong of a statement. Does the Merkel come with the stock fitted to the customer?

quote:

Well it is a ''Field Grade '' not an ''Exhibition Grade '' rifle ,so buyers cant expect it to be a Purdy

Tank,

The point being that the current crop of Field grades is not up to even "field grade" standard.