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I'm a big savage fan, but have been reading about people liking CZ's. Tell me what you think about them, especially the kevlar varmint in 223. Will they shoot with the savage? I've been spoiled by their out-of-the box accuracy. How exactly does the set trigger work and how is the standard trigger pull? Easy to lighten? I need another 223 and wouldn't mind diversifying my collection a little. | ||
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I have a CZ and It will shoot three bullets Touching with any problem | |||
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My Savage .223 took a trip down the road after the first range session with my Maple stocked CZ 527. It loves 40gr vmaxs and 50gr Btips. It is one of the most accurate factory rifles that I have. The set triger is nice, you push it forward to set it. The adjustment proceedure is outlined in the manual and is also quite easy. You can adjust the regular pull down enough that the set feature goes away. | |||
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I have a Savage 110 "4x4" in .223 (old version before the short action was available) with 20-inch heavy barrel and a CZ 527 American, also in .223. The accuracy ir pretty comparable between the two, though the Savage might have a slight edge. I do not use the set trigger on the CZ - it is so light it scares me. | |||
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The CZ can be a shooter, and its set trigger is the finest invention since sex. Quite unfortunately, the CZ also has some pronounced drawbacks. Chief among them is its backwards safety, which operates the reverse of virtually every other firearm in the known world. There's no excuse for this and CZ deserves whatever it gets from the Plaintiff's Bar when the big lawsuit hits. There are other shortcomings, which would be easily solved if CZ's designers would pull their heads out of their @$$€S. One is the exceedingly thick bolt handle root, which forces the scope to be mounted extra high. The other is the protruding single-stack magazine. Simply double-stack it and make it fit flush (and give you one or two more rounds in the magazine to boot.) | |||
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I don't care what you say about the All this crap about backward safeties, boo hoo! Protruding magazines, boo hoo! Don't buy one. Many people do and seem not to be bothered. Or, they are so impressed with how well they shoot that trivial things like that don't matter. I think the last time I used a safety was 1954. I just don't chamber a round until I'm ready to fire. So they could but the safety anywhere and it wouldn't bother me. Seriously, savage shoots real well but the cz does too and looks better while doing it. | |||
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I have two CZ 527's and two 452's. The 527's are in 222, and 223. Both will shoot three shots into a 3/8" group at 100 yards, which tells me that regardless of how the safety works, and regardless of the magazine protruding, the rifles will in fact deliver excellent accuracy for factory made rifles. And, I have not had a problem remembering which way the safety works on them. I had an English made motorcycle at one time many moons ago that had the shift sequence opposite to all other motorcycles, and I never had a problem remembering which way was up and which way was down. If anyone here thinks I'm hammering my point, you are absolutely correct. After some transition training, I was able to switch from flying one airplane to another too. Oh, I really like the CZ rifles for the outstanding accuracy they deliver. Two of the four CZ's I have are the ones with the excellent Walnut stocks, which is a plus for owning them. Don | |||
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two things- I have read CZ will introduce a future 527 without the magazine issue. Calhoon makes reworked bolt handles that offer more clearance, on an exchange basis (for those unaware, the bolt handle can be removed when the bolt is stripped); he also makes single shot mag replacements that don't hang down as far as the standard magazine does. | |||
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I have 3 CZ rifles. A 550 American in 9.3x62, a 550 FS in 6.5x55 and a 527 in 221 Rem Fireball. All three of these rifles will shoot sum MOA with ease. The 527 has the backwards safety, but the 550's are normal. I luv my CZs | |||
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Anyone that makes a big issue of the CZ 527 safety, please do not ever shoot a shotgun or switch to a rifle with a tang safety, as you'd be completely lost and likely injure yourself or someone else...  | |||
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Is the 550 safety different from the 527 safety? Both of my 550s have a safety that I would consider to be normal. | |||
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I put up pics of my CZ Varmint Kevlar 223 on here, as everyone else says fantastic rifles. The kevlar is the only model with the 9" twist. Like was said already "safety?" | |||
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I floated the barrel on my 527 .223 and it's a tack driver. | |||
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I generally don't like any detachable mag on a sporting rifle. But I like ones on the CZ 527s looks cool to me. ...tj3006 freedom1st | |||
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I just shot my 527 American in .223 last night to check the zero before heading to New Mexico tomorrow, and it never fails to impress me all over again. With 26 gr of H-335, std primers and a good 50 gr bullet - Speer TNT, Ballistic Tip, V-Max, Sierra Blitzking - it never fails to group about a half-inch if I avoid called flyers. I have not played with the trigger, as it shoots so well as is. The unset trigger pull does have some creep and grittiness to it. One of these days, I 'll get brave and mess with it. All I have done is place a shim under the front lug to float the barrel. 4o gr Ballistic Tips and V-maxs also work well, but bullets heavier than 55 gr do not group well - a function of the slower rifling twist, I'm sure. | |||
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i have several cz's and all of them have required bedding, but i bed everything. accuracy wise i think savage is better. The finish on the exterior (visable) of the cz's is much better than the non visable portions. My last one was a cz royal in 223, which is not what i would call that great a shooter. Only thing it really likes are 69 gr noslers, and the est group with them is about 3/4" @100. My FS 6.5x55 does about the same, and the 17 HMR about the same. thats the best loads, many others did 2" groups I don't care for the external mag sticking out the bottom. gets in the way. you already know about the safety issue. The savage action works much smoother than the cz, all of which I've had to work over to get them down where i liked it. All that said the thing i hate about the savage is that damn barrel nut, its fugly. I do like the cz set trigger, but i also like the savage accru trigger. to set the trigger you push it forward, unset it's a bit heavy creepy, and quite a complicated piece of machinery. Hope this answers some questions for you | |||
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I do, too- that type of magazine arrangement was used on Walther and Krico rifles, also; maybe others. Must be a European thing. | |||
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I don't have a 527 but I do have a 550 in 30/06. It is, by far, my favorite rifle. It will shoot the lights out. I also have to agree about the set trigger and the "best thing since sex" comment. Buy one. | |||
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Who/where is Calhoon? NRA Life Endowment Member | |||
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I shoot a lot of sub.22 caliber wildcats. CZ's make wonderful platforms for them cause they are accurate and reasonably priced. Without trying to sound like a blow hard braggart I have about 10 or 12 of em, I like em that much. "If a man buys a rifle at a gun show and his wife doesn't know it"...Did he really buy a rifle? Firearm Philosophy 101. montdoug | |||
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Well, you lost me there, Buster. With a tang safety you push it forward to "shoot" and backward for "safe", just like every other safety in the world besides the CZ 527. Sometimes people get excited or in a hurry and operate a firearm by instict. If this happens with a CZ 527 it will result in the opposite of what the shooter intended. The safety should be no substitute for safe gun handling, and no one should ever depend on a safety to prevent a gun with a loaded chamber from firing. But safeties should all work in the same fundamental direction.
I'm a pilot, too, Don, and have flown several different makes and models of airplanes. But I never flew one that you pushed forward on the yoke when you wanted to raise the nose. And I never drove an automobile that you pressed on the right-hand floorboard pedal for an emergency stop. I suppose you could learn to do either, but wouldn't it make more sense if everybody's controls worked the same fundmental way? Particularly something as critical as a gun safety. | |||
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Stonecreek, shame you ain't a little older, you'd remember that Kawasakis used to have neutral at the bottom of the shift pattern, and that HD and Limey bikes had the shifter on the right side and the rear brake on the left. Check today with three companies that offer a 5-speed manual and you will find some have reverse up and left, and others have it far right and down. I got one of each sitting in my garage right now. Same company. Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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Exactly!! | |||
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The future is here. I saw one last week at Second Hand Rose in Tulsa, OK. They are dealers and get regular shipments through. Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | |||
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Is it a new magazine or new bottom metal? | |||
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Although I'm not a motorcycle rider, Rich, I am familiar with the variations in up-down patterns on the shifters. Similarly, for years GM auto transmissions were PNRDL, while Fords were PRNDL. And original Honda 4-wheelers used a thumb-operated throttle, while the Yamahas used a twist throttle like most motorcycles. There are lots of variations in controls on lots of kinds of products. Now, can you name me another gun besides the CZ 527 that uses a safety where the rearward position is "fire"? | |||
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Parker .45 Auto has "Fire" in the up position rather than down like most auto pistols. It is a good citizen's duty to love the country and hate the gubmint. | |||
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Marlin 22s used to have the bassackward safety but the new ones operate in the standard MO | |||
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Never ran across that before. Do you know any model numbers? I'd like to look them up.
Okay. But to get it into the "up" position (fire), don't you push forward? I'm not familiar with them. | |||
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Afraid I can't help you with the model number. Mine was stolen quite a while ago. I don't think the changeover was all that long ago though. I guess an old Marlin is the perfect companion piece to a CZ. | |||
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Yes, some of the old Marlins were this way, as well as I believe it was Mossberg 22's that had a similar arrangement. I don't remember the Mossberg #'s, but I believe it was model 60 from the early runs. I belong to a collectors group, and you would not believe the crazy controls on some guns. My old Savage 99 had the lever lock that was unlike anything I had used prior (or since) and I am now so accustomed to my CZ that I find myself pushing forward on the triggers of my other guns to "set" them... It is a matter of if you don't think you can use it safely, or don't like the design, don't buy it. Other wise no big deal. Every gun has it's little quirks. Makes life interesting. JUST A TYPICAL WHITE GUY BITTERLY CLINGING TO GUNS AND RELIGION Definition of HOPLOPHOBIA "I'm the guy that originally wrote the 'assault weapons' ban." --- Former Vice President Joe Biden | |||
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To the contrary, I'm little worried about what I can use safely, or even what you can use safely; it's the twice per year idiot at the next bench or hunting just across the fence who gets his Remington 700 and his CZ 527 mixed up, or who tests the position of the safety by pulling on the trigger to see if the safety is set. Because so many people like that exist, I would much prefer that ALL Rem 700's and CZ's have safeties that operate in the SAME direction. You can't idiot-proof a gun, but making the safeties all work alike at least somewhat reduces that inherent hazard. As it is, plenty of little old ladies gun their accelerators and jump their 10-year old Lincolns through store windows every year. Think how many more such tragedies would occur if the other car in the garage had the accelerator pedal on the left? Rationalize it any way you want. The CZ safety is just plain wrong and ought to be fixed. | |||
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The obvious answer for you is to buy every gun manufacturer and build every single gun EXACTLY THE SAME. Oh and by the way, you would also have to RECALL EVERY FIREARM IN EXISTENCE, NOT MEETING YOUR REQUIREMENTS BECAUSE YOU DON’T FEEL IT’S SAFE. Or if that is not an option, perhaps you should buy an island in the middle of the ocean where you can "feel" safe. It worked for Woody Harroldson... GOOD GRIEF!! You are about 25,000 times more likely to be killed while driving to the range than while you are AT the range. Stonecreek, I am going to let your concerns for my safe gun handling practices go, because you obviously have issues...  If you are relying on a "safety" then you are playing Russian Roulette. EVERY GUN IS ALWAYS LOADED EVERY TIME. PERIOD. And should be handled as such. People like you are why we have 500,000 trial lawyers in this country. JUST A TYPICAL WHITE GUY BITTERLY CLINGING TO GUNS AND RELIGION Definition of HOPLOPHOBIA "I'm the guy that originally wrote the 'assault weapons' ban." --- Former Vice President Joe Biden | |||
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I wished all rifles would have safties like on my CZ 527. It's like cocking a hammer as you bring the rifle up. Natural. Joe A. | |||
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I don't know that I have ever used the safety on my CZ-527. I don't usually put a round in the chamber until I am ready to shoot with this gun. I use it for varmints and paper-punching. I do not use it for jump-shooting anything, but I may start getting into coyote and other predator calling. When doing that, I could see having a round chambered and the safety on. I would still remove the round from the chamber when moving, though. For me, the safety is a non-issue as I have never trusted them. | |||
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Don't trust them too much but sometimes you have to trust them some. | |||
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Stonecreek, I re-read your post and I have to apologize for my bad reading skills. I read your post as "I'm a little worried about what I can use safely, or even what you can use safely" not "I'm little worried," as you posted it. Sorry for lambasting you or jumping in you sh**, as the case may be. I thought you were dogging my gun handling. I volunteer at a public range a few times a month, and I help people learn how to not shoot themselves and others while handling guns. 99.9% of the people take the advice and learn. The few that don't want to learn, get to leave. Simple! Sorry for being an a**. ---Mike JUST A TYPICAL WHITE GUY BITTERLY CLINGING TO GUNS AND RELIGION Definition of HOPLOPHOBIA "I'm the guy that originally wrote the 'assault weapons' ban." --- Former Vice President Joe Biden | |||
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