As to the .260 Remington..........IMO it's the best short action cartridge one can buy for deer and Pronghorns and big game to about 400 pounds.

To get something better one will have to move to a long action and the gains will be small indeed.

Gidday Vapodog,

Once again you are right on the money.

The 260 had a slow start but it is now starting to hit the straps and get the recognition it so rightly deserves.

It is the most efficient cartridge available for the game in this category. Some have yet to acknowledge this but with time the facts will become obvious to them.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

Id prefer a .308win for game up to 400lbs.

Do some simple calcs, and you will find a .264-140NPspitzer has 3% less energy300yd, than .308-150IB when lauched at same speed.
You could use a boattail 140-6.5 biggame bullet for fairer/better comparison, but I cannot find one!
150mrx308win and you have notably bigger frontal and all the famed penetration of the typical premium cupcore 140-6.5mm pills.
308-165 boattail2550fps, outguns the 140-6.5mm-2700fps with about same recoil.
If I had to slip a pill into any animal between 200-400lb or more, Id much rather have a mdweight 30cal tsx/mrx.
Sorry folks, I believe 260rem is at its best with pills like a slick 130AB,IB,SS for sheep class game.

3% energy difference?

I'd say "trivial", but "trivial" implies significance beyond it's reality.

Then you cite a contradiction of bigger frontal area AND greater penetration in the same sentance describing the same bullet.

Make up your mind.

The 260Rem is ballistically indestinguishable from the 6.5x55 that everyone loves, though some silly thinking ballisticans are prone to whining about needing to seat bullets into propellant space that generally isn't used ANYWAY, then contradictorially comment in another post about the superiority of compressed propellant charges
in accuracy and hunting loads...

AllanD

Gidday Woodjack,

You are not wron with the 130 AB being a great bullet in this calibre. I personally prefer 130 or lighter in the 260 with 120 being the go to especially for longer range hunting in the Southern Alps where shots can be pretty long.

My set up is going to be a Sako Finlite 260 for the longer range stuff loaded with 130 ABs or 120 hotcores and the model7 which I already have loaded with 140 Partitions for bush shooting.

Much more efficient than the 308 with less recoil. Neat eh!

Happy Hunting

Hamish

I must jump into this an add the comment that there is more to killing power than simple energy calculations, 3% or 30% it's about the bullets construction and the terminal ballistic's it will yield. While I am personally hot for a .260, I still have never seen the case where smaller diameter bullets killed better than larger ones of comparable paper energies.

260 Rem's are excellent. I have built three of them. 2 for me and one for Wife. I would have no problem shooting a elk with one what so ever. Colorado big game regulations only require 90 gr. bullet in 25 cal and larger. I know several colorado natives who have killed lots of bulls with 243 win over the years. The .264 bullet is hard hitting and deep penetrating. check out the S.D.'s of 120 gr 264 vs. 165 gr 30 cal
And the accuracy is amazing in ours

Allan,
I didnt say 3% was a big deal. I was just showing how there aint much difference between them in numbers.
lets Keep it simple for U.
.264-140np & .308-150monmetal both leave muzzle at 2700.
Both Pills arrive at 300yd with very near same vel./energy
.308-150monometal penetrates as good as 6.5-140np,but .308 offers larger wound channel.

If theres a(good)reason you believe one should stick to 6.5mm and avoid larger 308win for game toward the 400lb class, please enlighten me to what it is.

What kind of barrel life can I expect from a .260? I would like to see at least 3,000 rounds.

Gidday Rowdy,

Barrel life will to a large extent be determined by the barrell steel. However if I didn't get 3000 rounds out of it with a good cleaning regime I would be having serious word with the supplier. You should get that easy.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

quote:

His latest thing is to rechamber the Remington to 6.5x284 and load it short to fit the .260 box magazine. I fail to see any advantage to this endeavor

He should be able to get an extra 10 grains of powder space, now I see that as an advantage!!

I did that with my 7mm-08, short action, had it reamed to 284 Win and got a genuine 10 grains of extra powder space.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
The 260Rem is ballistically indestinguishable from the 6.5x55 that everyone loves,Allan, if this is true than why even come up with a .260? I don't buy it for a moment , nor the rational that it is better because it can be used in a short action though some silly thinking ballisticans are prone to whining about needing to seat bullets into propellant space that generally isn't used ANYWAY, DRIBBLE

The .260 brings nothing new to the table. It is a ride along on the coat tails of the sad .308 and a marketeers hype tool to insnare gun nuts looking for new toys.Maybe I'm gullible enough and immature enough to buy into this hype once in a while. HOWEVER, you got to draw a line in the sand some time in life to this marketing CON GAME!!! It's a little different and not better!!!

In the absence of reality,however, you just might want to have this toy. Back to my lonely cell. "Oh Nurse" roger

Gidday Roger,

Face it mate the 260 works, bugger it all it works and as time goes on more and more people realise it becoming converts.

Sure it is so similar to the 6.5x55 and cartridges of that ilk but then is not the 270 similar to the 30-06 and as such just another marketing scam.

It is variety which makes the world so interesting just like a 6mmx270IMP don't you think.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
The 260Rem is ballistically indestinguishable from the 6.5x55 that everyone loves,Allan, if this is true than why even come up with a .260? I don't buy it for a moment , nor the rational that it is better because it can be used in a short action though some silly thinking ballisticans are prone to whining about needing to seat bullets into propellant space that generally isn't used ANYWAY, DRIBBLE

The .260 brings nothing new to the table. It is a ride along on the coat tails of the sad .308 and a marketeers hype tool to insnare gun nuts looking for new toys.Maybe I'm gullible enough and immature enough to buy into this hype once in a while. HOWEVER, you got to draw a line in the sand some time in life to this marketing CON GAME!!! It's a little different and not better!!!

In the absence of reality,however, you just might want to have this toy. Back to my lonely cell. "Oh Nurse" roger

If you are using "brings nothing new to the table" then you can indeed scratch out 97% of all the cartridges ever marketed as "useless" for the same reason.

But the 260Rem has a few minor advantages, one is that it does indeed fit in the short action that many shooters insist on (though I don't know why they think shortening their rifle by ~5/8" matters that much)

The 260Rem uses a standard .473 case head dimension which the 6.5x55 most definatly
DOES NOT. (though the US mfg's "cheat" on
their 6.5x55 brass)

And the 260rem doesn't have that rediculously long throat that most 6.5x55's do that make shooging the lightest bullets problematic
in most swedes

Lastly the 260rem is SAAMI spec'd for greater pressure in both factory ammo and reloading manuals, because there aren't a large herd of lawyers afraid that someone is going to stick one of those hot loaded 6.5x55 cartridges in a norwegian krag.

No the 260Rem doesn't do anything that the 6.5x55 doesn't already do, presuming you are comparing the 260rem to a 6.5x55 loaded with factory Norma ammunition (at ~$3/round)

But I can say the same thing about literally hundreds of cartridges that re-invented the wheel.

shall we start naming them?

I'll start with the 338Federal "bringing nothing new to the table" as compared to the 358Win.

BTW, I already own TWO 6.5x55's, and a hefty supply of brass (mostly Norma) but I won't buy another one unless I stumble across a winchester M70Classic CRF rifle for a price approaching theft.

Not sure I really want a 260Rem, but I can see the advantages over the swede

Frankly I think the 260rem does a better job of fitting in between the 25-06 and the 270Win
than several other cartridges do (infact a comparison between those three might get you buying a 260rem), but if you want to babble about the 260Rem "Not bringing anything new to the table" the cartridge to compare it to isn't the 6.5x55, but rather the 7mm-08.

and that comparison is one I must say the
260rem would lose if it wasn't for one tiny thing... the 125grain Nosler Partition.
If Nosler ever came out with a 125 or 130gr .284 partition I'd be the first to sign the 260's death warrant.

The 260rem's greatest advantage is that it isn't a 243Win.
I consistantly steer people away froma 243win as a "first deer rifle for my ____"
It isn't that I think the 243 is bad, I just think the 260Rem and the 7mm-08 are so much better choices...

If there is anything a 100 or 105gr bullet in a 243 can do that a 120-125gr in a 260 or 7-08 can't do better I'd like someone to tell me what that might be...

What you need to remember is that there are atleast TWO distinctly different classes of rifle buyers who look at this class of cartridges, the ones we are both poking insults at are the ones that have cartridge "A"
when cartridge "B" is introduced, this rifleman then promptly trots to the gunshop and trads in "A" for "B" because of some imagined difference.

Then there is the second type of rifleman, the one that has decided grandpa's 30-06 is just a bit too heavy to lug around and makes something of a mess of small whitetails and so looks for something a little more "user friendly"

And for this second group the 260Rem makes more sense than the 243win for ballistics reasons
and the 6.5x55 for availability reasons (DOMESTICALLY produced rifles and ammo)


So what the 260Rem "brings to the table"
depends greatly on what is already ON the table you are bringing it to.... if the table is essentially empty it brings quite a bit.

If I lived in scandanavia I certainly wouldn't buy a 260rem...

Though a 260Rem would be LEGAL for hunting in several countries where military calibers are ILLEGAL and thus bringing something very important "to the table", NOT going to jail.


AD

Wow a lot of good points, counter points here on the pro's and con's of the 260 Rem from personal perspectives. It took me 9 years to clue in and finally get one. I have never owned or shot a 6.5x55, I don't think I have ever seen factory ammo for it either in my backwater part of the world. Factory ammo for the 260 is ok but what a cartridge for a reloader. I have found it to be very easy to load for with various powders and bullet weights from 100-129. Powders that worked from the start H-380 H-414 H-4350 H-4831 varget RL-19 RL-22.

With H-414 and the 100 BT Or the 100 Partition it is so close to the 25-06 ( my rifle anyway) it is an eye opener.

With H-4831 and the 120 BT or 125 Partition you can get 2900-3000 fps depending on the rifle.

I took 4 animals last year with the .260 and 125 partitions. 2 Whitetail does 1 Muley buck and a black bear I never got to fill my whitetail buck tag but that was my fault.
Deer dropped at the shot at various yardages Bear made abot 10 feet from 100 yard shoulder shot. I would have prefered one of my 06's for the bear but I had a tag in my pocket and a .260 in my hands and it all worked out.

I have no doubt there are cartridges that will do it better, but the 260 has become my fav med game rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Hipster:
I have found it to be very easy to load for with various powders and bullet weights from 100-129. Powders that worked from the start H-380 H-414 H-4350 H-4831 varget RL-19 RL-22.



With H-4831 and the 120 BT or 125 Partition you can get 2900-3000 fps depending on the rifle.

I took 4 animals last year with the .260 and 125 partitions. 2 Whitetail does 1 Muley buck and a black bear I never got to fill my whitetail buck tag but that was my fault.
Deer dropped at the shot at various yardages Bear made abot 10 feet from 100 yard shoulder shot.

And that is what the .260 is good for,using bullets in the 110 to 129 gr. class. With todays premium bullets it makes a fine deer slayer. The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x55 can do that and also out shine the .260 when loaded with heavier bullets and have been around and doing it for a long long time.

I hope I haven't been too wordy! roger

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:
And that is what the .260 is good for,using bullets in the 110 to 129 gr. class. With todays premium bullets it makes a fine deer slayer. The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x55 can do that and also out shine the .260 when loaded with heavier bullets and have been around and doing it for a long long time.

I hope I haven't been too wordy! roger

Hey, hold on a second, a 6.5x55 or a 6.5x57 can't throw the 140's anyfaster or more accurately than the 260rem can, and I've already slain the "powder intrusion arguement (But I'm sure it'll grow a new talking head soon enough) So the "PROBLEMS" with the 6.5x55 are still there.

As for the two european 6.5 twins being able to toss the 160's? sorry, but who gives a crap?
really 160 is just too heavy for a 6.5bore
and there is no 6.5 that can toss them as well as ANY 7mm rifle....

IF you think you really NEED a 160grain bullet you need either a 7mm or a 30cal to toss it.

And hey, I'm perfectly willing to have the same exact arguement over the 7x57 Vs the 7mm-08rem and the plain and simple fact is that 95% of people out there, even enthusiasts simply don't know where to get 7x57 hunting loads any more than they know that cabela's carries 6.5x55 ammo...

though granted it's Norma ammo and ranges from $48-$67 for a box of 20.. gee that alone sounds like a damned good reason to buy a 260Rem instead of a 6.5x55

Hey, atleast Fedremchester makes ammo for the 260rem (Yeah, I know they make 6.5x55 too but try finding it at Bill & Bob's bait and ammo on a saturday morning....)
but I'll still say the best bullet for any 6.5mm endevour is the 125gr partition.

I have a 7mm to launch my 140's and a 30cal to launch 165's and 180's, so my 6.5 simply doesn't need to...

AD

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
I hope I haven't been too wordy! roger

Hey, hold on a second, a 6.5x55 or a 6.5x57 can't throw the 140's anyfaster or more accurately than the 260rem can,
AD[/QUOTE]

We can stay on the 6.5 DISCUSSION. No need to talk 6mm vs.243 or 7-08 vs. 7mmx57. What is TRUE for one will hold true for all.

The .260 Rem has a useable capacity around 3.3 cc. The 6.5x55 has a uaeable capacity of 3.7cc about 12% difference. If we hand loaded each chartridge with the same 140 gr. bullet to the same pressure level in identical modern rifles which one would put the bullet out barrel at the greatest velocity. This is 2007 and we can forget about the Norweigen Krag. Now unless you intend to write a change notice to the laws of physics I am certain you will come up with the right answer. See what you do when you provoke my thinking cells?

Oh! evidence is evidence whither you think you've cut off it's head or not.What is , is. Keep- roger

quote:

Originally posted by sierra2:
Also, keep your eyes open for a Steyr SBS in .260, they are out there too

LLS

cant go wrong there.

quote:

And that is what the .260 is good for,using bullets in the 110 to 129 gr. class. With todays premium bullets it makes a fine deer slayer. The 6.5x57 and the 6.5x55 can do that and also out shine the .260 when loaded with heavier bullets and have been around and doing it for a long long time.

Roger I have to agree in my case as my rifle is a 9 twist and with the excellent results I am getting between 100-129 grain bullets. I bought the rifle as a light carry rifle for deer, sheep and caribou sized animals and in this area to this point it has excelled.

Above that size of game I look to an 06 or my 35 Whelen.

I would be just as happy I think with a 6.5 x 55 or 57 and would use either in the same role I am using the .260 for. A flat shooting light recoiling carry rifle that lays out medium game with a minimum of fuss or mess.

Let me go at this from a different angle. I had a 7-08 made up back when it was still a wildcat. I got so sick and tire of the know-nothings screaming that the 7-08 wasn't $.10 next to a dollar compared to a (real rifle) 7x57 that I ought to be ashamed to own one. Forget the dead animals, forget the little, biddy groups, the 7x57 was bigger, faster, killed better, Hell, Mojo Bell stacked up elephants like cord wood with one. There was no comparison. So I went out and bought a 7x57 and shot them side by side. Surprise, surprise. There's no difference.
I now own a .260. I hear the same crap about the swede. If you like the swede, go buy one but be honest. Any difference is strictly smoke and mirrors.

I have both a .260 Rem (Kimber 84M) and a 6.5x55 (CZ 550FS). In my rifles, the 6.5 Swede handles 140gr cup&core loads well and the 260 is better suited to 129gr cup&core projectiles due to the twist rate of the individual rifles. Both drop deer DRT. Both are accurate. Neither kick appreciably. When it comes to the comparing these two cartridges, as far as I'm concerned, they are ballistic twins (but I wouldn't part with either rifle because both rifles have their niches ).

To paraphrase 458Win (Phil Shoemaker), quit the ballistic masterbation and go hunting!

Gidday Blackhawk1,

Balistic masterbation is like the original form, quite satifying when the real thing is unavailable.

Anyone who says he doesn't is either lying or doesn't know what he is missing

Happy Hunting

Hamish

I may just have to buy a well made .260 just to shoot it against my 6.5X55s with 156gr to 160gr. bullets just to get some objective evidence.

Oh! For those that say a 160 gr. 6.5 bullet is an aboration ,that high SD bullet has been a real performer for a number of us.

FYI Fred Barnes was even experimenting with 190 gr. 6.5 bullets.

The 156 gr. spire, Jack Whitworth bullet was Jack's go to Colorado game bullet.

OK what short action short throated .260 rifle should I buy? roger

Gidday Roger,

You need a Sako Finnlight. They are being released in November according to Beretta NZ.

You will be a convert. lol.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

How does the 260 stack up to the Swede when shooting extra long 140 grain bullets like the X bullet? When compared side by side the 140 grain X bullet is longer than the Hornady 160 grain round nose.

I've gotten into the 2800 fps range with my Swede using the 140 grain XLC and about 48 grains of IMR 4831. This combination is a real killer, I attribute its effectiveness to the combo of the 6.5 high SD coupled with the X bullets performance. I've only used it on whitetails but would not hesitate to use it on larger game like black bears or hogs.

I don't really have a dog in either fight and am going to buy a 260 in the near future (mostly to use lighter/shorter bullets in). I just wonder how the 260 would compare with its short throat and magazine box, the 140 gr X would take up alot of powder space if seated to deep....

Matt V

The 260 is about 50 to 100 fps short of the potential in a 6.5 x 55, when 140 grain bullets are concerned....

Both can be hopped up more.. but in the real world you are talking 100 fps or less...

I own and shoot both calibers, in several different rifles for each...

and strictly handload for them both also...

.243 Bore size - 243 Win - 100 gr bullet @ 2,960 fps
.264 Bore size - 260 Rem - 125 gr bullet @ 2,830 fps
.277 Bore size - 270 Win - 140 gr bullet @ 2,925 fps

Velocity differentials are small and would make little practical difference
The choice would be essentially what bullet mass you desire for deer
Apart from velocity, BC's will differ depending on type of bullet.
All these differences out to 200 yards are not too serious.
To improve your position, rather opt for the better constructed bullet; that counts a lot.

For deer hunting the 260 Rem seems a good choice to me, a bit more bullet mass than the 243 and less recoil than the 270.

Warrior

I like the selection of 6.5 MM (.264) bullets available to reloaders. But I use the 140 Gr bullets in my 264 Win Mag for big game hunting. I would not get much of a kick shooting the little 260 Rem..

Had my 260 out yesterday and finalized a good load with the 100 grain partition. Amazing what a simple primer change can do to a load.

Regardless which cartridge they are used in, I am an admirer and user of the 160 gr. 6.5 bullets.

Most of mine are shot out of a 28" barreled Ruger No. 1 chambered for 6.5x53-R...what the Brits originally referred to as the 6.5 Mannlicher... The rest are processed through either a 6.5x55 Carl Gustaff put together by Ed Shilen & a G&H stocker, or a 6.5x61 S&H Mag put together by me.

At any rate, I have a large supply of both Hornady and Norma bullets, enough to last at least 2.6 more lifetimes of hunting. They are not fancy-schmancy, high dollar, high status, premimum bullets, but they still penetrate very well, and expand well too. Those two performance characteristics seem to kill things as dead as dead gets. So guess they and I will keep on truckin' off into the sunset together. Colour me tickled pink...

Here's one of my Pac Nor 260s...the other one is a 19# 260 AI...this one is a 9 twist on a repeater Savage 10FP action..scope is Bushnell 4200 4-16x40

I've never shot an X bullet of any sort. I've never seen a need to. In fact the closest I've come to any boutique bullet has been a Nosler Partition. And Grand Slams. To me, those are premium bullets. And with them and Hornadys and Core Lokts, I've been able to scratch down whatever I've been shooting at. In my .260, I shoot 140gr Rem Core Lokts. They do a number on West Virgina White Tails. I certainly wouldn't hesitate to take them west of the big river for big mulies either.

Utah, you the guy from GOGO varmint?

Do bear in mind that Barnes recommends going one weight lighter in an X-bullet than you'd normally use for a cup&core bullet and people who've actually played seriously with them seem to agree

And I object to drawing inferences from the fact that many shooters of the 260Rem PREFER to shoot 120's, 125's and 130's and from that CHOICE drawing the conclusion that the 260Rem "cannot" shoot those bullets for some reason.
Mabey if you are comparing both a 6.5x55 and a 260rem in otherwise indentical rifles and loading them both to observed max the swede will have a slight velocity edge
but that doesn't translate into the swede being materially better.

Remember that I own swedes, so my part in this is to be logical and eliminate the emotional BS.
and I've SEEN notable participants in this discussion claim that 100-200fps is meaningless on game.
And while they are probably right I don't see anyone trading their 264WinMags in on either 6.5x55's or 260Rems

The point is if you have no rifles in that particular power/bore class then the 260 is a slightly better choice.
If you ALREADY HAVE a 6.5x55 you don't need one.
(as if "need" had the smallest thing to do with any of this!)

But the issue with the 6.5x55 is availability and cost of ammunition and higher cost of PROPER brass if you want to handload.

Frankly to load for a 6.5x55 starting with Virgin brass is little different in cost to loading for a 257/270/7mm weatherby cartridge starting with virgin brass, the only material difference being you don't need federal 215's to light the charge and you'll be using 2/3 as much propellant.

While loading for a 260rem is no different in cost from loading a 243Win or a 7mm-08rem.

Mainly I just want you to admit (atleast to yourself)
the REAL REASON why you choose one over the other.

AD

quote:

Do bear in mind that Barnes recommends going one weight lighter in an X-bullet than you'd normally use for a cup&core bullet and people who've actually played seriously with them seem to agree

Too bad that Barnes does not make a 100 grain in the tsx for 6.5's.

quote:

Originally posted by Allan DeGroot:
Mabey if you are comparing both a 6.5x55 and a 260rem in otherwise indentical rifles and loading them both to observed max the swede will have a slight velocity edge
but that doesn't translate into the swede being materially better.REALLY????

Remember that I own swedes, so my part in this is to be logical and eliminate the emotional BS.
AD

You want to eliminate emotional ?? Did you really expect anyone to accept that statement? I guess I over estimate the power of prose. How do you spell manutia? roger

minutia (singular)
minutiae (plural)

quote:

Originally posted by olarmy:
minutia (singular)
minutiae (plural)

Thank you! Iwas too lazy to look it up. roger

quote:

But the issue with the 6.5x55 is availability and cost of ammunition and higher cost of PROPER brass if you want to handload.

We had the same situation here in SA with the 9,3x64, and that is why it would never catch up again with the 9,3x62. Also, the 7x57 has always been more popular here that the 7x64 due to a historical head-start. Lost ground is always very difficult to gain back.

Warrior