i know that a lot of deer have been killed with the 85 gn 243 bullet but i personaly wouldn't use them. i like more than a 243 for deer but if i had to use one i would get a good 100 grn bullet. like woodhick said, i think the 243 is marginal for deer. and there is always the chance that a 400 lb pig will show up. good luck with your choice...bud

quote:

Originally posted by budiceale:
i know that a lot of deer have been killed with the 85 gn 243 bullet but i personaly wouldn't use them. i like more than a 243 for deer but if i had to use one i would get a good 100 grn bullet. like woodhick said, i think the 243 is marginal for deer. and there is always the chance that a 400 lb pig will show up. good luck with your choice...bud

The 400 lb.pig you refer to... would that be the one with the silverware?
Stepchild

stepchild...i think 400lbs is probably rosie's all time low weight. it's usually more than that due to all the shit she's full of

A 400 pound pig doesn't necessarily have to be shot at does it? Probably not good eating and getting ones picture taken with one may show you are actually prettier than at least one other creature on earth, maybe not.

if i had my picture taken with a 400 lb pig, the pig would probably win the beauty contest

if i had my picture taken with rosie, i think it would be a toss up

mohunt,

I have literally killed 100s of deer with a 243 and many of them have fallen at the hands of the 85gr bthp. I had always used sp until I talked to a guy that I know that works for sierra in sedalia. he actually recommended the hp. He uses a 223 or 22-250 with hp's. he too has killed 100s of deer. I have only hunted northern mo a couple of times. I am from southwestern mo and a 170lb field dressed 9 pt is the biggest I have ever killed but the 243 is more than enough here.

Gidday Guys,

As you know I have a mate who insists on using these bullets on deer, pigs in fact anything he comes across.

I have been trying to tell him for years to get a life and a real bullet that is designed for big game.

He doesn't argue with me he just keeps on using them to kill everything without fuss or bother.

He used them on the hunt we have just got back from tonight. There is a 70 kilo red hind hanging in my garage at this very minute with a six mil hole in her from a sierra 85gr hpbt.

I hate it when he uses that logic time and time again. Never 1 failure to win the argument.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

Howdy Hamish!!

How dare your mate beat you with logic....perhaps he just hasn't been told properly.

My Grandfather shot a Win 92 in .32-20 for deer and everything else for about 60 years because he didn't know it wasn't supposed to be used to kill deer. Your mate may have the same problem....he just doesn't know not to use the 85gr HPBT in his .243...but, it remains my favorite in the .243 too.

Enjoy that stag roast and try to shake off the "logic" thing!! I suppect your mate will be fine!!

Gidday Lowrider,

What makes matters worse is that he won't even drive these bullets at full speed. They are only doing 2800 fps there abouts so blowups are not a problem.

Just ripped the lungs apart and took the top off the heart before exiting through the opposite shoulder.

You could just about eat right up to the hole.

We will be giving this load alot more work as we have found an area just crawling with deer, brown trout, blue cod, whitebait, rig, mallard and paradise ducks in some of the most beautiful scenery on earth.

The deer in the garage has been turned into steaks for the Bar-B-Que as Summer is almost here. That should last 2 weeks until I can get some more time off to get some more.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

Last year I read an article on the net written by a gunsmith, I believe, on his site, where he had done EXTENSIVE testing of the 243 and different bullets on deer. He had gotten Sierra to change the 85gr HPBT to a GAmeking bullet designation from a Varminter bullet because of it's devastating effects on killing deer.
If anyone knows this article, I'd love to be able to find it and read it again.

All that being said, I just think, at least in my mind, there are sooooo many better suited cartridges for deer that I won't use the 243 again. I've used it in the past a few times and had to hunt for deer that were well shot. I just don't have the patients for that when I can use a 308, 270, 280 or 260 and get fantastic results without any huge meat damage. For recoil sensative folks, I recommend the 260 and 25/06, and they won't be handicapped in any way. If recoil is not a problem, I'm a fan of 270 and 280, they work great and you couldn't ask for much more. If you're into big caiblers, the 308 and 30/06 are the ticket, you'll hardly go wrong with them. One caveat in all this is I've not had good luck with the Nosler Ballistic Tips in the calibers above 7mm. I can't answer why, but they seem to not work well for me in 308 etc. I've shot a couple of deer with them that required follow ups, when after examination a 270 or 280 would have downed them with authority, so I now use interlocks in the bigger bores with great success. In the 270, the NBT works very well, I've yet to have any deer shot with them get up and move.
As usual, your milage may vary, and I don't criticize anyone for what they shoot and why. If a 243 is your baby, then good luck and I hope you find a bullet that works. I always hear people say "a well placed bullet from .xxx", well it takes a well placed bullet from a howitzer to kill a deer. NO caliber with a poorly placed shot will kill effectively.

Hey Hamish!!

I really feel like I should offer to help you take care of all those critters in the most beautiful scenery on earth!! My wife asked me tonight if I was going to go elk hunting next year and I said well...maybe, but I think I'd rather chase Stag in New Zealand. She wasn't against it as long as I take her along. Sounds like a 6 wt fly rod, an 870 in 20 ga, a .243 and a camera is all I need.

We had back strap on the barbie tonight. I cut it about an 1" thick and wrapped it in bacon and cook it about 4 minutes on each side on high heat and then smother it in a butter, red wine, onion, garlic and mushroom sauce and serve it over rice.....damn good!! If you like beer, it is good with it too.

Hunt safe and hunt well!!

Gidday Lowrider,

Any time you want to get over here for a hunt not a problem. We can jack that up without the slightest problem.

I can't guarantee a trophy red stag or a 14" tahr but I can say you should get a shot at a representative head.

If you want a great trophy trackersnz will be able to sort that out or Nigel from Alpine Outfitters. Both offer top notch Trophy hunts for a price.

I can show you some of the best country in the world but you must be reasonably fit because it is big country. Think of Montana on steriods, that is the Southern Alps.

This invite goes out to all AR people if you are after a good cheap hunt. If you want a top trophy Email Tim at nzbcoutfitters@xtra.co.nz or Nigel at info@topoftherange.co.nz. Nigel specialises in tahr hunts but if you want a top red or chamois trophy trakersnz will be your man.

Happy Hunting

Hamish

Hey Hamish!!

That is very gracious of you and thank you very much!! When is the best time to come down? I need to think this one out a little, but damn...that would be a really cool thing to do! Sounds like I need to bring my 4 wheeler to move this fat old man around...I've been on flat land for too long...guess I need to loose some weight!!

Again, that was very kind of you to offer and I'll look into the trip a little bit.

Hunt safe!!

About a week ago I shot a 251 lb 10 point with a .243 and the 85 grn bthp. 163 yds, heart shot, deer ran about 60 yds and died. But it was in the open ! if it had made it to the thick brush I would have lost him. No blood trail or exit wound, bulled lodged in off side rib cage. I believe if I had hit the deer in the middle of the rib cage (lungs) he would have fell on the spot.
I killed many deer and antelope with the old 95 grn nosler solid base all DOA. I also shot a big bodied buck at over 200 yds with a Hornady 75 grn hollow point, hit in the ribs deer took one jump into the woods, I thought I lost him but there he was stone dead ! YThe inside was mush.

Got to try this bullet for the first time this afternoon. Shot a whitetail doe (about 120 lbs) at 40 yds,(243 Win) broadside at MV 3200+ fps. Bullet entered ribcage just behind shoulder, complete pass thru, took out top of heart. Bullet not recovered. Entry hole bullet dia., exit about quarter size. No bone hit. She ran about 40 yds up steep incline into trees, was DOA. No big holes like I kinda expected with HP bullet. Got these bullets for coyote shooting, but it definitely did the job on this deer at close range.

Shot a Mule deer buck thru the chest with my 300 Win Mag pushing a 200 grain Speer hotcor right behind the shoulder and it slowly walked downhill for about 50 yards and laid down. 1 inch exit hole. Sounds to me like the 243 is working just like the bigger guns.

Look at the new issue of Peterson's Hunting magazine and look at the results of their test. I have changed my views on some bullets after looking at this test! Some people can succcessfuly use lesser bullets because they are careful and wait for the shot they want. For the rest that might take less than perfect shots,the test will tell you what might work the best under worst case situations!
FYIY
GregH

Any body use Varget for the 85grn sierras bthp ?

Chapster1, I have used varget with several different bullet combo's in the .243. I have not achieved the accuracy with it as i have with other powders in .243.

I use varget alot and it is the best accuracy powder in my .260. It is a close second in my 22-250 behind H380.

I am sure i could get a good load for it in my .243 but so far H4831 has surprised me with .75 groups in my m788 .243. For a knock around loaner gun i ain't trying nothin else.

jme

arky65

thanks arky65

Mohunt: I have used the wonderfully accurate Sierra 85 gr. HP/BT out of my custom 240 Weatherby on several Antelope Hunts. This bullet again is just splendidly accurate and quite lethal on these 130 poundish creatures. I have not used this bullet on Deer as yet.
I have used it on Coyotes and Rock Chucks though and again great lethality results.
Please make reference to page 108 of Sierra's "Rifle Reloading Manual" 3rd Edition Copyright 1989 by Sierra Bullets, L.P.
They show a picture of an 85 gr. Sierra HP/BT that retained 54% of its weight after killing a Whitetail Deer at a range of 250 yards.
There is also a short description of the 85 grain HP/BT and its suggested uses.
Also it appears that Cal Sibley is confused (somehow?) about the bullet in question? All of the loading manuals by Sierra that I possess only show ONE (1) HP/BT in 243 caliber by Sierra!
It is catalog (part?) number 1530. The latest boxes of these I have been using states on the box that these are "Game King" bullets and are Hollow-point Boat Tail bullets.
These are the ones I use on Antelope and Coyotes and are obviously the ones Mohunt is referring to.
Interested parties should also make reference to the newer Sierra Manual Edition "V" for a very specific description of Sierras 85 gr. HP/BT on pages 72 and 73.
Long live Sierra!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

Woodhick: I have seen quite a large number of heads of Big Game cleanly harvested with 22 centerfires AND various 6mm calibered Rifles. Perhaps you have just not had enough exposure to careful shot placement, patient Hunting practices and ACTUALLY USING 22 centerfires and 6mm calibered Rifles on Game?
Let me just relay one set of experiences I have observed out of the dozens of which I am aware!
My close friends here in Montana have Rifles in their gun vault from 223 Remington on up through 338 Winchester Magnums! In the last few years various members of that family have used their 223 Remington Rifle to cleanly kill Mt. Goat, Antelope, trophy Mule Deer, Whitetailed Deer, Bobcat, Cougar and a host of Varmint species!
I was looking over the shoulder of the user of this Rifle last week when he killed two Whitetailed Deer with it on two different days!
I have seen 12 year old members (two different 12 year olds in different years) of this family kill Whitetails with this Rifle at ranges in excess of 200 yards - clean harvests one shot apiece! The area this family Hunts is over-run with Whitetails and I am sure last year this Rifle accounted for at least 8 Whitetailed Deer (both Bucks and Does).
It may sound odd or unusual to you but take my word for it the 22 centerfires (222 and above) and the 6mm's are VERY capable on Deer, Antelope and Mt. Goat!
I hope the realization that 22's and 6mm's working well on game does not, any longer, "trouble your concept of reality"!
I am sure I have killed a ton (I mean this literally - A TON!) of Big Game with my various 22's and 6mm's! At an average weight of 200 pounds lets say then I am sure I have killed TWO tons of Big Game with my 22's and 6mm's!
Theres an old adage that may pertain here - "Don't knock it if you haven't tried it"!
Long live the 22's and 6mm's!
Hold into the wind
VarmintGuy

An excellent bullet from a 243 on deer. The ft/lb energy is better than from a 100 grainer.
The jacket is tough but I often find copper shratnel under the far side skin with this bullet. It is far and above my first choice for reliable knockdown, a stronger jacketed bullet than the hornady 87 grain. A 100 grain bullet is a little heavy for a 243.

VG,

Great comments...you're right on!! The ability to hunt and shoot makes all the difference. Glad to see you're teaching the kids to do it right!!

We have a NEF .223 beater that I ran a AI reamer into and mounted a Weaver 6x. We call it "sudden death" shooting a 64 gr Power Point on everything from crows to deer. I even killed a pretty good size shark we caught with it.

We're still shooting bow back here for a couple more weeks, but I think we are close to half a ton plus gut piles with bows and ML this year. I've only shot does so far and we have a load of jerky in the dehydrator right now. I have seen an 11 pt. (Western 4 pt with brow tines) twice that has about a 3" drop tine on the right side. If he waits until gun season or comes in close to me.... he's mine...I've never killed one with a drop tine...I told my neighbor that and he just said bullshit!! He wants him too. We'll see!!

Myself, I can not say it is not a good deer round. I bowhunt mostly so if a Muzzy will drop a deer I know the 243 will. I grew up using a freaking 22 hornet on little East Texas whitetail. Now that is a very poor deer round. It worked and I had some great kills with it. But I never had a marginal hit. I grew up shooting dove at the pond with a 22 short in the head so I did not miss. They where all perfect heart shots. Knowing what I do now would never use the hornet again.

If you can hit where you aim. I would load up a little bit better bullet. Try the Barnes, or a Nosler Partition they will give you better performance if you do make a marginal shot. Know the limits of the rifle like no 500 yard ass shots and you will be fine.

My daughters just used a 85 sierra hpbt over 45 gr of ramshot hunter to harvest two whitetail doe. So far two shots two deer. Both deer were bang/flop, one shot broadside through the lungs bullet exited, 180 yds. The second was shot through the neck with the deer looking in our direction at 100 yds, bullet entered at the white throat patch and exited through the spine, one very dead deer. So far the performance of the bullet has been great. Looks to me like as long as you put the bullet where it counts it will work fine.

My oldest daughter (I have 3) just used the same load to take her doe and buck. The doe was 125 yds shot broadside. The bullet went in behind the shoulder and exited into the offside shoulder. Interestingly I found the jacket and a couple small pieces of lead in the hide, but the main piece of lead exited. Her buck was similar, she made a long stalk of about 800 yds and had to crawl the last 200 yds. Got up as close as we could and she made a great shot, 320 paces, bullet barely clipped the front leg going in, mushed the heart and bottom of the lungs, but unlike the rest of the deer shot this year this one kicked out hard with his back legs at the shot and sprinted hard, after running 40 yards his nose dropped and his head hit the ground, horns hooked the dirt and he flipped over and skidded to a stop. Upon skinning the deer I found copper shrapnel and the base of the jacket in the offside hide with the lead core exiting. I would prefer that it had a more classic mushroom but who can argue with the results

Only slightly off topic, I would like to add two cents about a recent (yesterday) experience with Nosler 85 gr. Ballistic Tip.
Will not be using it for deer anymore- It broke my string of "one shot- one deer" that I had kept going over 5 years and 18 deer. The first round hit front of chest just above heart and just "ice picked" through.
Good sized doe jumped, went 100 yards and layed down where I placed the second through the spine at high neck level just to put her down for good.
Will go back to 100 gr. core locked where I have never had a problem.
The main reason for using a .243 here is encroaching civilization and nearby neighbors upset by really loud report of large bores.
Cannot complain about results from the 243 as it performs flawlessly using the right ammunition and proper shot placement.

P.S to above post:
Shot taken at 125 yards .
85 gr. NBP pushed by 39.0 gr. H 4350 and CCI LR primer.
Excellent accuracy but I did not care for its terminal performance.