I been thinking of going down to to a 85 gr. HPBT Sierra bullet in my .243 for deer hunting in Northern Missouri. CAn anyone share their experience with these bullets on large deer.

Why in the world would you want to use a bullet NOT designed for deer-size animals when so many other better suited bullets are available?

contrary to what woodhick mentions... try calling the guys at Sierra... They actually think the 85 grain HP is there best Deer bullet in 6mm from everyone of their techicians I have ever talked to...

It should do fine in my experiences.. it sure is accurate in anything I own that shoots 6mm bullets..

I didn't hunt the brief time I lived in Missouri after getting divorced back in the 1980s but I also never saw a deer in Missouri that a 6mm wouldn't take down....

The 85 grain HP works well and opens up at even downloaded speeds....

No offense to Woodhick... just my experiences differ from his....

cheers
seafire

FWIW, The Hornady 87 gr. HPBT and 100 gr. BTSP are both rated for Varminting and medium game. From my experience with the 6mm and deer, stay away from the shoulder and you'll be alright. Those smaller bullets DO NOT go through them. Jay

No offense taken....I have taken deer with the 87 grain Hornady....one dropped instantly-another ran a few hundred yards-both heart shots....

my comment was directed toward the use of heavier bullets if one just has to use a 6mm which, IMO, is on the light side even for whitetails....

Seafire nailed this one, the 85gr. Sierra is certainly up to the task! My Son kills 2-3 Whitetails every fall using this bullet in his 6m/m Remington and never had one go more than 50 yds or so. It is extemely accurate as well.
Stepchild

I have had good luck with both the 85 grain 243 BTHP and the 90 grain 257 BTHP, but I have also had both bullets fail to penetrate through the rib cage of an average sized Nebraska whitetail. When they work, they will put a fist sized hole through the rib cage. When they don't work, they blow a dinner plate sized piece of hide and muscle off the ribcage without any penetration into the pleural cavity.

I have stopped using the Sierra BTJPs on deer and think that the 95 grain Partition offers the best balance of accuracy, penetration, and velocity in a 243 hunting bullet for the 243, 6mm, and 6-284.

Jeff

quote:

When they work, they will put a fist sized hole through the rib cage. When they don't work, they blow a dinner plate sized piece of hide and muscle off the ribcage without any penetration into the pleural cavity.

The above statement in itself is enough to convince me NOT to use a hollow point in a .243. And yes, the 6 is a "hopped up" .243, but all that means is that the hollow point is that much more inclined to fragment as soon as the hollow fills up.

I will relate the following: a good friend called me about six or eight years ago, mad as all getout about his .243. He had knocked down three Texas Hill Country bucks in the same weekend, and all three had gotten up and run off. The bullet: green box Remingtons, in 80-grain hollow point. I chewed his butt right good and proper about using hollow points on whitetails, then loaded him two boxes of 100- grain Nosler Solid Bases. End of troubles...

The .243 and 6mm are nothing but varmint rifles that a handful of hotshots a LONG time ago decided would kill deer, if they were loaded with a bigger bullet. They do. But they also wound and lose A LOT of deer, because folks put them in the hands of youngsters, or end up using the wrong bullet. And to boot, accuracy with the "big" bullets isn't nearly what it is with the 55-75 grainers. Add to that the idea that a fully expanded 6mm bullet won't leave but a 3/8" exit hole, and IMHO you are asking for trouble. Just not enough hole for a good blood trail, and not enough to let that cold air in, either.

All that to say this: either of these cartridges will kill deer if placed properly, but so will a .22 long rifle. And I wouldn't use either one on a whitetail. There are just way too many other cartridges that do a better job. And I think the animals deserve a quick, humane death without a lot of excess bloodshot meat in the process.

I will take my tongue-lashing now, but I ain't changing my mind...

If your 243 likes an 85 grain bullet you might rather try the Speer Hotcore bullet. They are deadly on deer at about any speed you can shoot them at. I tried the Hornady Interlok 87 grain and wouldn't recommend them for deer hunting but you should have success with the Speer.

Well I guess the response is somewhat a mix, I have shot deer with the 100 gr. sierra prohunter with okay results I may have to stick with them. I just have heard other remark of how the 85 grain HPBT worked for them and also the Sierra Folks have stated the same. Any others out there have any input

Federal loads that bullet in a factory load and rates it as a "game" bullet for deer size game. I've never hunted deer with anything less than 100 gr.s in the 6mms but I sell a lot of the 85 gr loads to deer hunters who wouldn't use anything else.

Properly placed Sierra .243 85gr HPBT kill deer like lightning. Properly placed means thru the ribs broadside. If you shoot them (with most anything) in the ass or in the guts, it is a wounded deer. Neck shots are iffy and they waste a lot of good jerky. Thru the ribs turns the lungs and heart into strawberry jello and unless you eat organs, there isn't much wasted meat. Your results may vary........

mohunt:

I have to agree with woodhick on this one. In my experience here in Arizona, on deer, the ighter bullets just leave too much too chance. While I like the 80-90grain 243 bullets by most makers, I won't shoot them on deer size game, for that I start at 100 grain bullets, take your choice of whose.

Jerry

Considering what this bullet has done to Woodchucks, imho (and experience), I cannot see ever using it against a deer unless these varmint bullets were all I had to use. I would be afraid that the little lightweight thin skinned 85HP would blowup on impact, or very shortly there after. Sure, it Might give a spectacular kill, If it does not strike bone of heavy muscle, but I would expect a wounded and lost deer.
LLS

I've seen a fair number of critters taken with the bullet in question. That said I am more than comfy with it.

I do choose to use a bit different of a bullet (could always run into an elk or big blackie). The bullet I now load is the 85 TX by Barnes. This is a super bullet and one you could not go wrong with!

You may want to give it a try. You could always practice with a bit cheaper bullet or 85 persuasion and then go to the TX for the hunt.

Good luck

MD

quote:

Originally posted by Doubless:

quote:

When they work, they will put a fist sized hole through the rib cage. When they don't work, they blow a dinner plate sized piece of hide and muscle off the ribcage without any penetration into the pleural cavity.

The above statement in itself is enough to convince me NOT to use a hollow point in a .243. And yes, the 6 is a "hopped up" .243, but all that means is that the hollow point is that much more inclined to fragment as soon as the hollow fills up.

I will relate the following: a good friend called me about six or eight years ago, mad as all getout about his .243. He had knocked down three Texas Hill Country bucks in the same weekend, and all three had gotten up and run off. The bullet: green box Remingtons, in 80-grain hollow point. I chewed his butt right good and proper about using hollow points on whitetails, then loaded him two boxes of 100- grain Nosler Solid Bases. End of troubles...

The .243 and 6mm are nothing but varmint rifles that a handful of hotshots a LONG time ago decided would kill deer, if they were loaded with a bigger bullet. They do. But they also wound and lose A LOT of deer, because folks put them in the hands of youngsters, or end up using the wrong bullet. And to boot, accuracy with the "big" bullets isn't nearly what it is with the 55-75 grainers. Add to that the idea that a fully expanded 6mm bullet won't leave but a 3/8" exit hole, and IMHO you are asking for trouble. Just not enough hole for a good blood trail, and not enough to let that cold air in, either.

All that to say this: either of these cartridges will kill deer if placed properly, but so will a .22 long rifle. And I wouldn't use either one on a whitetail. There are just way too many other cartridges that do a better job. And I think the animals deserve a quick, humane death without a lot of excess bloodshot meat in the process.

I will take my tongue-lashing now, but I ain't changing my mind...

AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Right on Sierra 2,"I couldn't agree with you more. By the way, the 243 is one of my all time favorites, but as you do I view it as a varmint cartridge "SUPREME".


Jerry

Killed my first deer using the sierra 85 gr HP killed it deader than hell it was a 243.

quote:

Originally posted by Jerry Eden:
mohunt:

I have to agree with woodhick on this one. In my experience here in Arizona, on deer, the lighter bullets just leave too much too chance.

Jerry

I think this quote reflects the results of too many guys who have used a 6mm or even 22 caliber.. and all too often, won't look in the mirror and ask themselves," maybe I had a poor shot placement"...

Jerry, using your quote was not aimed at you or questioning you... It just seems that the bigger the bore a guy is us to using the more adept they are to blame poor shots on the caliber instead of the individual....

I remember a guy a couple of Elk Seasons ago here in Oregon that I walked down the road with as it was getting dark.. as we headed back to our vehicles...

He was busy telling me what a overrated piece of crap a 338 mag with a 250 grain bullet was for hunting elk... He claimed to have shot one right thru the heart and they recovered it, but it had to be trailed " a dam mile" before they found it...

He went down and got himself a good Elk cartridge.. a 416 Weatherby....

I really don't question what a guy wants to carry afield.. I really don't care if someone tells me a 6mm is an overglorified varmint cartridge at best.....I use it and smaller cartridges and since I got more concered about shot placement... the failures of 6mms and 22 caliber centerfires have been virtually ZERO....

Of course the next response by the bigger bore guys is that I have "been dam lucky"....

I'll counter there experience ( if they have hands on experience with a 6mm of some sort) was either "unlucky" or they had poor shotplacement..

too many guys blame failures on the equipment instead of themselves.. and that is regardless of what kind of equipment for what kind of job...
Like my neigbor bitching about what a crappy job his lawnmower does mowing his lawn.. but then tells me I am crazy for wasting time to take my mowers blade off once a year and take it in the garage and sharpen it.....

just the way I see it...

cheers
6mm/seafire

From what I have seen, a well constructed small bore bullet will provide through and through penetration on a lung shot deer. A lightly constructed bullet will usually penetrate the near side ribs into the pleural cavity and destroy the lungs, but I have never seen those bullets penetrate through and through and the recovered bullet is usually just fragments. I would rather hunt deer, any deer, with a combination of 22-250/60 grain Partition than I would with any 243 or 257 bore rifle using the Sierra 243 85 grain BTHP or the 257 90 grain BTHP. I used to swear by them as the quickest killer that I'd ever seen, and they were, but once you have a bullet failure that wounds a deer with a surface wound, you'll know why I won't use those bullets on deer. Killing deer cleanly is good sportsmanship. Using a bullet that you know has earned a reputation for wounding, even with a well placed shot, is IMO poor sportsmanship of the lowest order.

Jeff

Seafire:

No offense taken! I have never shot a deer with anything lighter than a 270 Winchester, but thats me. I have seen though, several deer shot by "expert" rifleman, where the lighter bullets in 243 were inadequate, none were ever lost. As you know I am a 6mm finatic, but even with my 6-06 with an 87 grain bullet moving at 3700fps, I wouldn't shoot at a deer with it either. Now if I were on a combined hunt, varmint /deer and we were walking about, I would just havthemy magazine of my 243 loaded with good 100 grain bullets, then if a deer shot was available and the conditions were right, I would pop it.

As to shot placement, I absolutly agree with your statement, however why take a chance, when better bullets are available. Heck I have seen coyotes shot in the boiler room with 80 grain 243 bullets run a good distance before folding up. Thats ok, unless it is a deer in a real brushy area, and he can't be found.

Jerry

The 85 gr. Sierra HPBT Game King is made for deer. I have used them on about 20 deer in the last three years in my 243 mostly at 150 - 225 yards. I go for shoulder shots and most deer don't run. The ones that do stumble a little then fall over. A lung shot will let them run 40-50 yards. Shoulder and spine hits will not exit but I have never needed a blood trail on those. Lung shots will pass through and leave a blood trail. I have had no failures. You can't judge a bullet on one performance when you don't find the animal to verify where it was hit.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by SLS:
The 85 gr. Sierra HPBT Game King is made for deer. /QUOTE]

Sierra Manual 4th ed, pg 75:

"We also produce....243 diameter 85 grain and .257 diameter 90 grain HPBT's which despite their GameKing nomenclature are intended for varminting..."

I believe a lot of what is written about the Sierra (243) 85 gr HPBT in the Sierra manual is a carry over from many years ago. Sierra is now jacketing their HP Gameking bullets heavier then their ProHunters (per Sierra). Here is a couple of replies we got back from Sierra concerning this bullet. Take it for what it's worth. BEN243

Question:
Why don't you guys at Sierra recommend the Sierra 85 Gr hollowpoint (243) for deer hunting ? I've had a lot of experience with this bullet, on a lot of game, and it works great on deer. As a matter of fact, I know 2 gun shop owners (243 and 6mm) and 2 gunsmiths (6mm and 6-284) who also use and recommand this bullet. These are guys who can shoot any caliber and bullet they want, and they all use the 85 Gr hollowpoint. As a matter of fact. there are also quite a few guys om the Internet who also recommend this bullet for deer.
Answer: We do recommand this bullet in a BIG way for deer on the 800 line. It's quickly becoming our no. 1 bullet in the .243 dia. for deer huntin'.
Good Shottin' Paul

Question:
I along with many others have been using the 85gr HPBT Gameking in .243 Win and 6mm Remington for deer and antelope hunting. I also hear many folks saying that this is a "varmint" bullet and we have no business using it for hunting big game. What is Sierra's official response to this?
Answer:
We try to make that as confusing as possible. While we thought we were designing a decent groundhog bullet and still list that bullet to this day under varmint bullets, that specific bullet will be recommended by every technician at Sierra (that is eight fellows) as our deadliest deer bullet in 6mm. In fact, through at least 300 yards, I know of no other bullet that drops deer and keeps them there better than the 6mm Sierra 85 grain hollow point boat tail. Opinions about our hunting bullets are based upon as many as 80,000 calls and letter per year explaining the terminal performance of our bullets. Keep on doing what you were and show them a copy of this communication. Dave

What would you expect a Sierra rep to say, "Use a really good 243 bore bullet for deer, something like a 95 grain Partition from Nosler."?

I have shoot a couple dozen deer over the past 25+/- years with both the Sierra 85 grain and 90 grain BTHP Gamekings. When they work, they work really well. But when they don't work, they do exactly what I have posted. I have lost my confidence in them and won't use them or allow them to be used on my hunting ground. I think that Sierra makes some good and accurate varmint bullets, but I think that some of their game bullets are inferior to those made by Hornady, Nosler, and Speer. JMO.

Jeff

I used this bullet in my first 6MM for years as a combination coyote and deer bullet. Sudden dramatic kills are what I got and most of the deer were mule deer. On the other hand I never shot a deer in the shoulder, always behind the shoulder or neck shots. No generally what was left of the bullets that didn't exit wouldn't look like a mushroom but what the heart and lungs looked like would not make a pretty picture either.

It really does depend on HOW you shoot your deer. I have shot a heap of fallow deer in the UK with a 243 and a 6mm and 85gr bullets (I prefer the speer BTSP which has a much better BC) These were out to 150yards and broadside or near broadside vitals.

The other week I visited a friend for some fallow hunting in big fields, closest shot 200yards with one in half light (morning) at 300yards. I used my 7x57 - a properly placed 243 would have done the job but even with great care my shot was liver and lung and not heart and long as intended.

The 85gr bullet would have killed him just as dead but from my experience wind drift would have played a little more of a part and the buck would have travelled a little further.

I have Seen, dragged, and packed out, many elk killed by my cousin in CO with his 243. and the 85 grain Sierra HPBT, all the while me telling him he is nuts for using it. True he is a great shot but I have also seen it break shoulders and penetrate WAY beyond what I would have believed. Last count I knew was around 20 head of elk and way too many Mule deer to list on a forum. He fed two familys with that gun.

Fury01

At reasonable distance and shooting into soft tissue I am sure they will do a number on an elk, I not sure they would hold at all on shoulder hits very often as you stated.

I argued the same point until i ran out of air dragging the bulls with broken shoulders, spines and necks. I don't reccomend them; i am just recounting a large body of eye witness evidence that they do indeed work. I still don'
t know how.

I personally have never shot a deer with the .243 and most likely never will. However, I have been in on six kills by people who were using the .243. I can only relate what I saw. The first deer was impressive, a nice 160 pound mule deer doe. Shot was maybe 50 yards tops. I've never seen an animal drop so fast and not even twitch. I had a .243 I'd been using for hunting coyotes so I worked up a good deer load with the 100 gr. Hornady Spire Points. This was far enough back in time that they may not have been Interlocks. At the time, I had access to a Nevada ranch where the foreman wanted some of the deer removed as they were making raids on the alfalfa fields. I had friends who wante to hunt deer and I loaned them suitable rifles. Howeevr, their wives, who also wanted to hunt didn't care for recoil, so after coaching them with the .243, let them use it. The ladies took five deer from the ranch, one at about 50-70 yards but most at 100 to 150 yards. Autopsies proved that all five deer shot with the .243 were well hit in the chest cavity. (At least the ladies would listen when I told them where to shoot.) The deer ran from anywhere around 50 yards to 250 yards before expiring. The one that ran the farthest ran into a barbed wire fence, backed off and ran into it again, tried one more time falling when it hit the fence. Now the terain on this rach is flat and very open with very little brush. There are many small shallow usually dry waterways with willows growing in them. It was no problem watching the deer until they fell. Good thing too, as the was little or no blood trail. All the internal organs were literally mush in the bullet's path. I firmly believe, that if those deer had been shot in very brushy country, most, if not all of them would have been lost.
I don't know if that 85 gr. Sierra is all that good or not, nor do I know if they have strengthened the jackets any, but the supply I have left over from coyote hunting in the late 1970s are pretty damn destructive on coyotes. I certainly would have to be awfully desperate to get a deer to want to use one of those. I've passed on the .243 for deer and I doubt I'll change my mind any time soon.
Paul B.

Paul B,

Well I totally disagree with your opinion but that is fine. I have shot more deer with a .243 than any other caliber. Most deer were in wooded areas none were hard to track and none went over 100 yards. I have usually used 95 and 100 gr. bullets but have heard the 85 gr. HPBT have gave hunters great results.

My wife and I have shot a lot of deer with a 243, and she has shot a lot of antelope with one. We always used either the 100 grain Sierra or the 95 grain Nosler Partition with PERFECT reaults.

My experience with the 6MM's on deer is more extensive and different. My first centerfire deer was taken wit ha1 00 grain Remington corelokt and it dropped on the spot with a chest hit that broke the far shoulder just below the blade. I took a few more deer with the 243 and then started using a 270 in Wyoming gecause elk were on the agenda. I bought a 6MM Remington while there and started using it on Mule deer and Antelope saving the 270 for Elk. My feeling at the time was that the 6MM was very destructive if shots were placed into the shoulder and since I planned to eat the deer I stopped hitting them there. I used many different bullets including the 85 grain Sierra BTHP which by the way is very destructive on coyotes and aquick killer on deer. In the long run I settled on the 105 grain Speer spitzer and neither penetration or wound channel was ever found lacking. I never had adeer run more than 50 yards. The round was also a bit much for close range blacktails in Washington state but with the right hits not too bad. It was only when the feral hogs started averaging over 200 pounds on our place near the Sulpher river in Texas that I moved up to a 7x57 and now a 308.

I've shot 40+ deer with the 243. I've used the 85 gr TSX, 90 gr Ballistic Tip, 90 gr X-bullet, 100 gr partition and 100 gr. Sierra BT. My shots have ranged from 15 feet to about 250 yards. Every deer I've shot has gone no more than 75 yards after being hit with a single shot. However, the only bullets that have ever given me an exit wound were the TSX and X-bullet. This may not be an issue if you're hunting in open country, but if you're hunting in thick brush, trailing a deer with no snow and only a 6mm entrance would to bleed out of can be difficult. The 90 gr X-Bullet never shot that well out of my rifle, but the 85 gr TSX shoots exceptionally well. After all the bullets I've tried, it's the only one I'll use on big game in 6mm. I like to have that blood trail!

Pete

The only 243 bullet I have recovered from game was a 95 grain Nolser Partition that was shot into a white tail doe that was facing me at @175 yards. I purposely waited until she was facing me to take the shot. The bullet was recovered in a rear ham perfectly mushroomed with a little lead left in the front section.
In the 243 my favorite bullet was the 95 grain Nosler Partition.
However I must admit on deer sized game the 100 gr Sierra killed just as good.

I've only used the Sierra 85gr. HPBT at the range and find it a superbly accurate bullet. I think it would suffice nicely on some of the smaller deer of the southeast. I'd be hesitant about using it on some of the heftier deer of the midwest farm regions though. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

Are we talking about the Sierra 85gr. HPBT or the Sierra 85gr. SBT? You don't say. I think the SBT would be okay for the smaller deer. Even better is the newer Hornady 95gr. SST. That's quite a bullet. Best wishes.

Cal - Montreal

I know it dropped my 10 year old daughter's first deer (a decent sized doe) faster than anything I have seen before. It really shocked me. I am going to load some for my .243 this year and try to take a couple of does. It seemed to hit like a freight train.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Lowrider 49:
If you shoot them (with most anything) in the ass or in the guts, it is a wounded deer. QUOTE]

Setting aside the "with most anything" caveat in the above statement, and with all due respect ...once took a large whitetail buck going away from me with a 300 Winchester which entered the hip and ended up in the far side shoulder...then another running whitetail shot through the middle with a 338......not textbook bullet placements but instant kills nonetheless.....sometimes you just gotta take the shot that's presented.....which is why the pipsqueak, marginal stuff doesn't go with me when hunting big game....

and before I get flamed for taking "bad" shots, remember the old adage "judge not lest you be judged".......

why anyone would want to use marginal stuff (22 centerfires or 85 grain 6mm bullets, for example) on big game is beyond me.....if that's all you have to use and you don't take risky shots-fine......