I got some good news today from the gunsmith. My 6.5 Grendel on the Ruger 77 short PPC action is finished and ready to ship.

Dies, brass, bullets, primers, powder, and some Hornady and Wolf factory ammo, all on the shelf awaiting its arrival.

I'll try to remember to post some pictures later, and some range results, and hopefully some hunting results too.

Does that qualify me to join the elite small bore deer hunter's club? If not, I have a 243.

KB

Please post photos and tell what sort of optics you will use on it when you take possession.

KB, what could you possibley do with a 6.5 Grendel? Heck it's not even big enough to kill those Alaskan Mosquitos.

Who did you use for the work, and what chamber version was the reamer? I am wanting to have a Grendel conversion done on a CZ 527 in 7.62x39 I have.

PacNor made and installed the barrel using their reamer. As I remember, from conversation, their reamer was made by PTG. It's listed on PacNor's web site under wildcats, and has the name of 6.5 Gren Match.

If you need to know more, call PacNor for answers. One thing that I noticed on internet postings is that some guys seem to make a big deal out of nothing, IMO, re the 6.5 Grendel chamber. I trust PTG and PacNor to have whatever issue, precieved or real, already resolved. So I don't worry about it. When I test the finished rifle, if a problem shows itself, I'll deal with it then. Based on my experience with PacNor, they'll make it right, but I'm quite sure it's already right.

Factory Hornady and Wolf ammo chambers with no apparant hitches. I'll know more when I fire some of it.

Conversion of the CZ 527 is a good idea, feeds well.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by Antelope Sniper:
KB, what could you possibley do with a 6.5 Grendel? Heck it's not even big enough to kill those Alaskan Mosquitos.

Yea, well at least it won't just piss them off, like a 223 is likely to do.

KB

Some guys on internet make a big deal of nothing. Aint that the truth? One idiot goes by the picture on a box of ammo to determine it's use.

And another guy ignores the picture on the box when determining its use. And likewise ignores the manufacture's design intent for the bullet.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:
And another guy ignores the picture on the box when determining its use.

KB

And still others haven't even learned to read pictures!

Thanks for your response. I will talk to Pac-Nor about my conversion project.

quote:

Originally posted by webfeet:
Thanks for your response. I will talk to Pac-Nor about my conversion project.

They can clone your barrel contour too, if that's what you want.

I had them set up a custom contour for a mini-mauser, for another 6.5 Grendel project. I didn't like the factory contour, considered it too skinny. They already have it programed in their machine. The shank diameter is not STD. I think it would look good and fit appropriately on the CZ 527 as well. Ask Penny about that too. It will probably need some barrel channel work to fit, but that's not really a big deal.

KB

One more question if you don't mind: what length barrel did you go with for your Grendel? I have been playing with QuickLOAD power and bullet performance projections, but I haven't finalized my length decision.

I went with 23". I just couldn't stand to make it shorter, since the little cartridge needs all the help it can get, IMO. I just figure even 50 fps matters in this little cartridge.

I know that the fps issue is easily resolved by just using a 260, or whatever, but I wanted to try the Grendel.

Also, I got a box of the 100gr Barnes TTSX bullets for my first handloads, because they enable speed, but probably the 120gr will be just as effective, if not more. We'll see.

I plan on starting with H335.

Also, FYI, I went with the 8.5" twist, 3 groove stainless barrel. I don't plan on using any bullets heavier than the Hornady factory loads.

KB

Went to the range today - twice. Had to use 4WD to get in due to the snow, but I had the place to myself.

No pictures yet. Nothing spectacular to show, although the rifle shoots well. So far I'm getting 3/4" to 1.5" with the loads tested. Shot some Hornady and Wolf factory ammo. Handloads with AA/Lapua brass, small primer, H335 powder, and Nosler 120gr BT, Lapua 100 gr FMJ, and Barnes 100gr TTSX. I was surprised that my initial handloads beat the factory ammo right away.

I want the Barnes to work out, and they are showing good groups. The last group was less than one inch, and I'm pretty sure I can improve that.

Some discoveries thus far: It is a very mild cartridge to shoot. The magazine is just barely long enough for the cartridge at normal OAL. Just as well because the throat is short, so I couldn't seat the bullet out anyway, even if the magazine would allow it. The feeding isn't perfect because if I put four in the magazine, the first one off the top wants to get crossways and jam. If I put only three down, they all feed fine.

KB

Walther has a 6.5 grendel barrel for the cz 527.Put one on my cz it shoots better than I can drive it.

I didn't know Walther had a Grendel barrel for the CZ. I'm going to look into that. My wifes been bothering me for a "little" rifle. That would be perfect.

Cheers, John

That LW barrel chambered in the Grendel for the CZ 527 could be a really good thing, if the price is right and it's prechambered and threaded. I would like to read more about that from those who have used the barrel. IMO, there is hardly a better action to convert to the 6.5 Grendel than the CZ 527, with the 7.62x39 bolt face and magazine. By better, I mean the least expensive conversion, and basically trouble free. The action itself is a dandy, and I see no reason to expect less than surpurb accuracy. I tested the one I had and it appeared to me that there is nothing to do to the action or the magazine for perfect feeding. I liked the trigger too. The one I had adjusted very well, and the set trigger was nice too. Depending on how well I like the cartridge, I might get another cz 527 just for the conversion. but I already have the Ruger, and another one in process on the mini-Mauser action.

So far I like the cartridge, at the range. It's very mild in both recoil and blast. I had some mysteries with the loading dies, but it could be me, since I'm not used to the Forster dies.

I didn't get to finish my load development this weekend because I got an invite to go deer hunting. The three of us got five deer today. The recent snow pushed them right down off the mountains to near or on the beach. Lots of boats out there and competetion, but apparantly everyone was successful. Fresh liver and onions for dinner tonight.

I really wanted to test the 6.5mm 100gr TTSX on deer this weekend, but I didn't complete the sighting in when I got the invite. Instead, I did test the 123gr .310 TSX bullets left over from when I had a 7.62x39. I loaded them using Varget powder in the 7.62x54R to shoot in the MGM Encore barrel. I got one deer with that load. I'm estimating the velocity at impact was about 3000 fps, way faster than the cartridge they were designed for. The effect was awesome. My hunting buddy was watching the deer through his binoculars and he said hair and lots of stuff blew out the opposite side of the deer. DRT. I'll not elaborate on the shot, except to say it was a difficult one, and I hit bone, consequently the exit hole was rather large and messy. Based on that one test, I believe I should be rather careful with shot placment, to avoid significant meat damage. Also, I doubt that I'll be recovering any bullets to show pictures of, unless perhaps I shoot a deer length wise - then maybe, but I don't usually take those kind of shots. Even my 338 hasn't done the kind of damage that light 123gr TSX did on that one deer. I'm sure hitting the backbone had a lot to do with the size of the exit hole. I was a little concerned that the low SD of that bullet would result in the bullet not exiting. Now I see that even with a solid bone hit, the bullet will still exit and take a large amount of bone with it, in fragments.

Looks like more testing is needed. I think I settled any question of that particular bullet's effectivness for light game such as deer or hogs.

The degree of overkill shown by the 123 gr .310 TSX driven fast, has me thinking that the little Grendel may be a rather dandy deer cartridge, especially with the 100gr TTSX, running 200 to 300 fps slower. With hearing protection on, so the blast is insignificant, the recoil of the Grendel feels like I'm shooting a 22 mag. That's really a treat for me. I'm looking forward to developing an opinion about it based on actual performance on several deer. I have a huntch that it will be in the class of easy shooter to suit women and younsters, yet very effective for the purpose.

The trigger has a little creep in it, so I have to work on that to allow this cartridge to impress me in the field. Just like most rifles, it takes a little time to work the bugs out.

I'm having fun, and hope you enjoy the progress reports.

KB

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:


I'm having fun, and hope you enjoy the progress reports.

KB

Very decidedly so. The Grendel is a facinating little cartridge and a light bolt rifle so chambered has my 'wants' button well and truly pushed.

look forward to lots of updates.

Von Gruff.

I have an AR-15 chambered in the Grendel. I really like the little cartridge. So far the powders I have used are H335, Western Tac, and BLC (2). Out of all of them for my rifle Tac has been the most accurate. I haven't tried the Barnes bullets yet though so I'm not sure what will work with that. I have used the sierra 120gr, 95gr Vmax, and Nosler 100gr Ballistic tips. Sierra's have shot very well out of my rifle.

I would love to have an AR in the Grendel. However, I'm using Lapua and AA/Lapua brass, and at over $1 each, I plan on not losing many. That's why I went with a bolt action. Besides, that's the platform I'm used to.

So far I've used only H335 powder. The accuracy has been good with the initial tests, but not super impressive - yet.

There are at least two things I'm curious about. I already settled some issues, one was throat length, which is short in the chamber of my rifle. IMO that's good. I'm wondering if it makes any difference, comparing the large rifle primer to the small rifle primer?

Also, the pressure specs for this cartridge are rather mild, to suit the limits of the AR action. The brass seems plenty substantial, and I'm already running the max book loads with no sign of pending problem. I tested four loads .5 gr over max, and the group tightened up somewhat. One test isn't enough to say for sure, but it looked promising. With H335, the max book load is not compressed (with the 100gr TSX). I'm wondering if I can work up carefully until I see signs that I've reached max for the bolt action - then back off, with knowledge of not-to-exceed loads for my particular rifle. I generally know that kind of data for most, but not all, my other rifles. I can see that I'll not get there, limited to book max for this cartridge, in the bolt action.

It may be a moot question anyway, because H335 is the only powder in the data sources I have that isn't compressed with the mild AR loads. Just eyeballing it, I'm thinking this little case will hold only about a grain more H335, over book max, before compression becomes an issue. Dunno for sure, since I haven't tried it. The extra 1/2 gr didn't cause any problem.

KB

I've been fooling with that cartridge since it's beginning. If some of you fellows think it's a pipsqueak cartridge you are mistaken. Granted it's no 264 Win Mag, but I know one fellow that took an elk with a clean kill at a measured 450 yards with it chambered in an AR 15. One of my friends also took an elk an nearly that distance with a 6.8 Rem in an AR 15. Another one of my friends, Arne Brennan is the main inventor of the cartridge. He was put together with Bill Alexander of Alexander Arms and they together submitted it to Lapua who tweaked the design and finalized the cartridge. Here's some more loading data:


Case Bullet Powder Charge Primer OAL Forum Member
.
Lapua Sierra 85 gr. HP BL-C(2) 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Sierra 85 gr. HP H-335 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Sierra 85 gr. HP H-335 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Sierra 85 gr. HP H-335 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Sierra 85 gr. HP VV N-530 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
AA Speer 90 gr. TNT H-335 31.4 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
AA Speer 90 gr. TNT H-335 31.6 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Speer 90 gr. TNT Benchmark 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Hornady 95 gr. V-MAX TAC 30.8 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
AA Hornady 95 gr. V-MAX H-335 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.160"
.
AA Hornady 95 gr. V-MAX Benchmark 30.0 gr. CCI #400 2.200"
.
Lapua Hornady 95 gr. V-MAX Xterminator 30.4 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
Lapua Hornady 95 gr. V-MAX Xterminator 30.6 gr. CCI #450 2.200"
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 30.0 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip H-335 29.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip H-335 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip H-335 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"


.
AA Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip Xterminator 29.3 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
Lapua Nosler 100 gr. Ballistic Tip BL-C(2) 29.7gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
Lapua Lapua 100 gr. Scenar AA 2460 30.2 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Lapua 100 gr. Scenar IMR 8208 XBR 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 100 gr. Scenar VV N-130 25.2 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 100 gr. Scenar VV N-530 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing H-335 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
AA Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing H-335 28.9 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing BL-C(2) 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing BL-C(2) 32.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing VV N-133 26.1 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
AA Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing VV N-530 25.8 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
AA Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing VV N-530 26.1 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing Benchmark 26.5 gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing Benchmark 27.0gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing Benchmark 28.0 gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing Benchmark 28.5 gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing Benchmark 29.0 gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
AA Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing H-322 26.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Sierra 107 gr. MatchKing TAC 29.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"


.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar VV N-530 26.1 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar Benchmark 27.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar Benchmark 27.7 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar Benchmark 28.7 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar Benchmark 29.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar H-335 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar BL-C(2) 30.8 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar BL-C(2) 32.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 108 gr. Scenar VV N-133 27.5 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Barnes 120 gr. TTSX Win 748 28.0 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
Lapua Barnes 120 gr. TTSX Win 748 29.0 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
Lapua Barnes 120 gr. TTSX Win 748 30.0 gr. CCI #450 ----------
.
AA Barnes 120 gr. TTSX AA 2520 30.4 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
AA Barnes 120 gr. TTSX BL-C(2) 31.0 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
AA Barnes 120 gr. TTSX BL-C(2) 31.5 gr. CCI #450 ---------
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip BL-C(2) 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip BL-C(2) 31.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip BL-C(2) 31.7 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip RL-15 29.0 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.260"
.
AA Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip RL-15 28.5 gr. CCI #450 2.230"


.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip AA 2520 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip AA 2520 31.0 gr. Fed. 205M 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 27.5 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
AA Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 28.5 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
AA Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip TAC 29.0 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip H-335 27.5 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip H-335 28.5 gr. CCI #450 2.230"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip VV N-530 25.7 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip VV N-135 26.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 29.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 31.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 31.5 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Win 748 31.7 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
AA Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip H-4895 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Varget 28.2 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Varget 29.0 gr. CCI #450 2.260"
.
Lapua Nosler 120 gr. Ballistic Tip Varget 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.260"


.
AA Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing H-322 26.5 gr. WSR 2.250"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing Win 748 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing Win 748 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing Varget 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing AA 2520 28.3 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing AA 2520 29.3 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing AA 2520 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing BL-C(2) 31.5 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing TAC 28.5 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing VV N-530 25.7 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing VV N-135 26.0 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing H-335 27.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing H-335 27.8 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Sierra 120 gr. MatchKing H-4895 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. Pro-Hunter SP TAC 28.0 gr. CCI #450 2.235"
.
AA Sierra 120 gr. Pro-Hunter SP TAC 29.0 gr. CCI #450 2.235"
.
AA Sierra 123 gr. MatchKing AA 2520 29.9 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
AA Sierra 123 gr. MatchKing AA 2520 30.3 gr. CCI #450 2.220"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar VV N-530 25.7 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar BL-C(2) 31.5 gr. CCI #450 2.265"


.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar VV N-140 27.2 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar Win 748 28.5 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar Win 748 29.0 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar Win 748 29.5 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar Win 748 30.3 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar Varget 28.0 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar RL-15 29.5 gr. Fed. 205M 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar H-4895 27.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar VV N-135 26.0 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar AA 2520 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Lapua 123 gr. Scenar AA 2520 30.6 gr. CCI #450 2.265"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX AA 2520 28.0 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX AA 2520 28.5 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX AA 2520 29.0 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX AA 2520 29.5 gr. Rem. 7.5 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX TAC 27.2gr. Wolf 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX TAC 27.9gr. Wolf 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX TAC 28.3 gr. Wolf 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX Win 748 29.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX Win 748 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"


.
Lapua Hornady 123 gr. A-MAX Win 748 30.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST BL-C(2) 29.3 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
AA Hornady 129 gr. SST BL-C(2) 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST IMR 4895 27.2 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
AA Hornady 129 gr. SST TAC 26.5 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Hornady 129 gr. SST TAC 27.6 gr. CCI #450 2.250"
.
AA Hornady 129 gr. SST H-335 27.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST Win 748 30.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST Varget 26.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST AA 2230 23.8 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST AA 2230 24.5 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST AA 2230 25.0 gr. CCI #450 2.255"
.
Lapua Hornady 129 gr. SST AA 2230 25.8 gr. CCI #450 2.255"

I've been using the Hodgdon on-line data as my only published source.

Thanks for all the load data SJ.

The way I approach internet forum load data is to corroborate the selection with published data, then and only then use it.

I'll print the info you posted and if I later decide to try any of them I'll find sources to confirm the loads, and starting place. I don't yet know where to find published loads for some of the powders listed, such as TAC and W748, etc. I don't even know what TAC is.

Right now, I'm concentrating my efforts to get a load with the TTSX 100gr, and I'm having to use Hodgdon loads for other bullets as an indicatior of where to start. For example, I used the 100gr BT load with H335, and substituted the 100gr TTSX and small rifle primers. That's why I feel OK with 30.5 grs, having tried 29.5 and 30.0 grs first. I have a batch of six rounds loaded with 31grs, waiting for the opportunity to get to the range and test. I strongly suspect that once the specific load is working like I want, at the range, then I stick with it in the field, until I have a good reason to change.

KB

That one came off the 6.5 Grendel forum and this next one is from Alexander Arms themselves:

http://alexanderarms.com/image...rendel_reloading.pdf

Last but least this is from Accurate Powders. Once there scroll down till you find the 6.5 Grendel:

http://www.accuratepowder.com/...te_load_data_3.5.pdf

Like I've said I've been with this cartridge just about from it's conception.

Now the Alexander Arms data and the 6.5 Grendel forum data you'll notice uses a Small Rifle Magnum primer.

Besides the Lapua and Hornady brass many people form brass from the 7.62x39 but you have to start at the lower end of the data and work up due to most all that brass is large rifle primered.By the way brass marked Alexander Arms is Lapua brass.

Great. Thanks again SJ.

When I bought the small rifle primers, I looked to see what was available on the shelf at Sportsmans Warehouse, and saw no magnum small primers, so I selected the Federal match small primers and bought several hundred.

I also have a good supply of Hornady and Lapua brass with the large primer pocket, but just started with the AA. It's beautiful brass, BTW, and seems very precise. I messed up one piece by pushing the neck back in the shoulder. Not quite sure how I did that, but adjusted the die, and tried again carefully, and it worked for the rest of the batch.

I also have a large supply of 7.62x39 brass. Maybe someday I'll use it, but probably will just sell it since I don't like to neck ream or fire form brass. It's much easier to just use 6.5 Grendel head stamped brass.

I'm far more interested in precise shooting with this rifle than I am about saving a nickle or two on componants. It has never made sense to me to spend well over $1,000 for a rifle/scope set-up, and pull a carpetman on bullets and brass. IMO, that's a true classic study in false economies, or perhaps a hoarder game. That's why I have no problem using the best brass I can find, Lapua, and the Barnes TTSX bullets for my real hunting loads. 100 pieces of brass and 100 bullets will last me a long time, used just for hunting deer and hogs. I'll let Midway inventory the stuff and order a new batch when needed. If I want to just play with some cheap loads, I can use Nosler BT bullets or some of the Hornady or Wolf factory ammo, and reload that brass with some cheap bullet.

KB

The Grendel seems like a neat round. Right now I have a big hole in the middle of my battery, I go from a couple of .224's right straight to the 7x57. I have thought alot about what would make a nice in-btween, but there are so many good choices. Really, I think I want something in 25 though, to me the 6.5 is just too close to the 7mm I already have. But there are alot of good bullet choices in 6.5 too. I bet yours turns out to be a dandy for you.

It was a tough choice, going with the under-7mm cartridge. I already have a 6.5x55, which I haven't gotten around to hunting with yet.

I considered a 6.8 SPC, but prefer the 6.5mm bullets, althought the 6.8 mm has got to be better than a 223, for several reasons. One reason is the rifles are available in the AR and bolt actions, and ther already have the right twist to use a Barnes TTSX bullet. In a 223, if I were to buy one, it would have to be a fast twist (faster than 8" twist) so I could use heavy bullets, and I would still feel undergunned.

I class the 6.5 Grendel as about the same as a 250 Savage. The main reasons IMO to choose a 6.5 Grendel is if you want to use an AR type firearm or a small compact little bolt action, such as the CZ 527 or mini-Mauser, and IMO those are pretty darn good reasons. Many years ago I had a little Sako action, setup for the 7.62x39, (correct bolt face and magazine) but I sold it. Now I wish I still had it. In the really compact little actions is where the cartridge has something to offer that isn't the same size rifle as a 243, 250 or 257, or perhaps others with std short actions, like a 260.

I have been very reluctant to mess with the small cartridges, but the idea of a small and compact rifle was appealing. Then a Ruger action set up for the PPC cartridge became available at not a bad price, and I had a new factory sporter laminate stock already finished and checkered. So, I decided to play with it anyway, although it doesn't offer the main appeal of the little rifle, since this rifle is normal size and weight, for a std short action.

The main appeal of the Ruger setup is that it's stainless, so I feel better about taking it out in the wet and/or near salt water. I hope it's a good test platform to see just what it can do on deer. I'll also take it to Texas to whack some hogs with it.

KB

Grendel in a 527 would be a pretty sweet little package.

Really though, I'm probably just toying with the idea anyways, at least untill my little girl gets bigger. I had too much crap and sold alot of it a few years ago, making sure to cover the bases with what we would really use. My loading is alot simpler now, we shoot alot more, and we have stuff we really trust and enjoy shooting. I still have a few toys, but most of our stuff is serious working guns now. I still enjoy thinking about all the possibilities though.

Man, I sure like some of your buzz words - like "alot simpler now" "shoot alot more" "working guns", etc.

I can hardly resist the toys and possibilities, and consequently have lots of projects. It takes a long time to go from possibility to finished, and become a working gun - too long.

I keep thinking that I have got to simplify things. It's gotten to the point that I simply can't do justice to and shoot all the rifles I own.

You guys writing about the 223 have me thinking more seriously about condensing my rifle ownership - reducing the numbers - down to one main working rifle, not too expensive to operate. I'll have to keep a few toys, of course.

Ever since Ruger came out with the SR 556 in 6.8 SPC, I have wanted to try one. I've never owned a simi auto centerfire before, and I think that one would be a good starter for general purpose, including deer and hogs. It's about as close to a 223 as I can do. Covers the same purposes, plus some. If the 223 can do what many claim, then for certain I can learn to live with a 6.8mm for the same purposes.

KB

The 6.5 Grendel is a far better cartridge then the 6.8 for hunting. To compare the 6.5 Grendel with another cartridge, the one that compares pretty closely is the 6.5x54MS. If you look at the velocities of the two you'll see that the 6.5 Grendel beats it in some instances.

What I'd do if I were you and wanted to try a center fire semi auto is built on. But a flattop upper so you can mount a scope on it, get a heavy profile barrel and you don't need any flash hider on it. Put a free float forearm on it and a match trigger and I believe you'll be hooked forever. None of the AR's I have shoot larger groups then 3/4. Another thing is once you have a complete rifle you can just keep adding uppers in different caliber just by pushing the take down pins and installing them. Due to different calibers you may need caliber specific magazines and the bolt should come with the barrel you buy because that is what they head space it with. You can even own one bolt carrier and change out the bolt heads.

I don't see the 6.5's as being close to the 7mm's, only in actual diameter because the 7mm's, in my opinion, hit harder like a bigger caliber. I see the 6.5's more comparable with the 6mm's. By the way a great little cartridge on an AR 15 that isn't a 223, which you seem not to want, is the 6x45. I love mine.

"The trigger has a little creep in it" Kabluey. "And a big one pulling on it"-carpetman.

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
What I'd do if I were you and wanted to try a center fire semi auto is built on. But a flattop upper so you can mount a scope on it, get a heavy profile barrel and you don't need any flash hider on it. Put a free float forearm on it and a match trigger and I believe you'll be hooked forever.

Do you mean something like this one?
http://www.midwayusa.com/produ...rd-10-round-magazine

Probably the least used rifle in my arsenal right now is my 40 XBKS in .220 Swift. Throat is shot out in in, but it still does okay. Somehow I just can't seem to part with it even though I don't do the amount of coyote calling and p-dogging I used to. I think, this spring it will be time to give it a new lease on life. I think I will do what I have been wanting to for awhile, which is a fast twist 6mm Remington. That will cut the wind lots better than the Swift, and should make a heck of a doe culler in open fields with a 105 VLD. Just checked my "play money" stash and it looks like I am pretty close to being there. May be time to start putting the pieces in place.

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinJ:
Yeah but you can build that for half that price.

I'm not so sure I doubt that I can build it myself. But, believe it or not, I have friends with such skills, and they have tools.

However I can't impose upon my friends to skillfully assemble a rifle like that for free. It would cost, and maybe cost again to send it somewhere to get it right. I haven't had good luck with a home shop project. A setup for disappointment comes to mind.

I do have a retired friend turned gunsmith in Texas who has been building them on a small scale, who I might be able to get the right combo of good price and reasonably skilled work. He asked me two years ago to let him build one for me. We didn't discuss details.

What receiver should I start with?

KB

It takes "less" then an hour to assemble an upper. Once you know the correct things to do it's really easy.

Personally I'd go with a Stag upper receiver.

Alexander Arm's rifles are grossly over priced.

Even paying your friends a few buck you'd still beat that price.

If I were to do it over again right now I think I would have bought the 6.8SPC. When I bought my Grendel the 6.8 had one bullet offering (110gr) and not much else. Now that it has become more popular and they changed the twist rate to a slower rate as well as lengthening the throat a little similar to .223/5.56.
The down side to the Grendel is the fact that it really needs a longer barrel to get the necessary velocity. The 6.8SPC can develop it's velocity in 16" of barrel as it was designed to perform.
I love my Grendel don't get me wrong I just think that for a nice hunting AR the 16" carbine is perfect.

I used to read a lot on the Grendel forum about guys converting the CZ 527 carbines and loading them hotter than what the AR could handle. A few of the guys were getting quite a bit more velocity but how much I don't remember.
With my AR I know I have to use an almost max load in order to get it to cycle as well as shooting accurately.

any thoughts out there for/against the new 300 Blackout from AAC? Their website basically makes the case that the round is the equivalent to (or slightly better than) 7.62x39, and obviously geared towards AR platform. My understanding is that they are aiming at the sub-gun market (to supplant the MP5), and obviously suppressed deployment. But this looks like performance similar to the cartridges listed above, and would also fit in a micro bolt action.

The 300 ACC is a nice little round. The major reason it has really started to take off is...it was never trademarked like J.D's 300 Whisper. The same mistake that Bill Alexander made with his 6.5 Grendel, although that now has been released to SAAMI. Too little too late. Back to the 300 ACC. In reality there isn't a whole lot that it does that the 7.62x39 can't do except maybe one thing and that is the 300 ACC can run better through an AR 15. The 7.62x39's magazine is the Archiles Heel for the AR even though the round has been chambered on that system.

The 6.5 Grendel does very well out of a short barrel. Because it's bullet BC is so much higher then the those for the 6.8 even if it starts lower then the 6.8 it passes it up.

The AR 15 limits the 6.5 Grendel to around the 50K pressure bracket. This is because opening up the bolt face for the larger case head greatly weakens it. Even the enchanced bolts have a limit. The initial limits were set in the high 40K's, but Alexander greed has it pushed all the way up to 53K which is way too much. In the bolt rifle the performance greatly exceeds the AR 15.

I had a 7.62x39 in the CZ 527 for a while, but traded it for some work on my cabin. I liked the rifle and the cartridge, and shot some deer and hogs. One hog got away.

I was never comfortable with the cartridge for deer, and used it several times for rabbits. I felt like it was useful perhaps for only the really close shots, carefully placed, for deer size game, and I didn't want to place such restrictions on myself, especially after that hog got up and ran off. They say it's like a 30-30, but I don't believe it. Loaded with 150gr bullets, maybe, but not the 123gr.

From the lessons I learned from the 7.62x39, I had built a real replacment for my old bolt action 30-30. I had a very nice FN Mauser action, a pretty slim walnut Fagen stock, so I bought a reamer from PTG for the 7.65x53 Argentine cartridge, and had PacNor make and install a barrel. Now I have something to shoot all those .311 bullets I acquired for the 7.62x39, and speed won't be an issue out of the 7.65x53. That's gonna be my nice day in the woods rifle, deer hunting in the creek bottoms, and hardwoods down south. It's not quite finished yet, but I have a local gunsmith lined up to finish it hopefully around Christmas. I hope to post some pictures of it in a different thread.

Anyway, now I have a 6.5 Grendel, and hopefully anything to do with a 7.62x39 or 300 ACC is a moot issue, henceforth.

KB

Yeah if you have a 6.5 you don't need any of the others. The 7.62x39 is a very capable round. I've seen it take deer cleanly even with cast bullets and contrary to popular belief there are loads for it with bullet weights up to the 200 grain bracket.

One thing that amazes me. The most recent wars, battles, whatever you want to call them have been fought with small calibers and they seem to have done a very decent job unfortunately. I would classify whitetail deer in the man size category. Anyways that's not an argument I want to get into.