The Accurate Reloading Forums THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS Rifles Small Calibers More .243......Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
| More .243...... | Login/Join |
| One of Us |
I was interesting to read in another thread the opinions about the .243. I won a Savage 7mm a few years back and decided to trade it for a .243 (I already own a 7mm) My .243 is a Savage Accu-Trigger. Now, here is the point of the discussion: I have decided to take it to Africa. Given the fact that my 3 sons, my wife, and my father are going, and will be shooting, I have decided to take the following rifles: R.280, .300 Win, 7mm Short, .243. 30-06. The reason I decided to take the .243 is 1- its an extra rifle, and 2, after the many times I have taken my sons shooting (especially my oldest), this is by far the most accurate gun for them. Now, I am not shooting larger game with it. However, I believe it will work well for impala, blesbuck, predators, duiker, steinbuck.... maybe a warthog... Have any of you taken this caliber to Africa? What did you shoot? | ||
|
| one of us |
No, I haven't taken a .243 to Africa, but our guide owned one and used it for just about everything. It is perfectly suited to warthog, jackal, baboon, springbok, impala, and the other smaller species of antelope. Your kids, or anyone for that matter, are much better off shooting a less powerful rifle which they can hit with than a more powerful one which they don't shoot well. But you may be "over supplied" with rifles if you take everything on your list. Either the .300 or the .30-06 will be fine for the larger plains game species. And everyone doesn't necessarily need their own personal rifle since typically only one person at a time is doing the shooting. You may want to consider the expense and hassle of taking 5 rifles and narrow it down to perhaps 3 or 4. If you have two two-rifle cases, then four rifles will travel as easily as three. | |||
|
one of us |
I have not taken my 243, but I have a friend that will be taking his for a second time in June. I would have zero reservations taking my 243 shooting 80 grain TTSX bullets around 3415 fps. It is superbly accurate and deadly on the whitetails and antelope I've used this combination on to-date. Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
| One of Us |
Great point. However, there will be 3 PH's guiding between my family of 5, my friend and my dad. Therefore, we will be split up at times. Me and my wife will take 4 guns and my dad will take 2. I know its a hassle, but should be worth it! I just picket up some .243 Hornady SST's in 95 grain. I am hoping that will do the gun well! Probably head out shortly to go practice with it again, with my kids. | |||
|
One of Us |
When I went, I was surprised to discover my PH used a BRNO .243 for everything except larger game. He had even used it wtih solids to take giraffe (Mugabe confiscated a friend's land so the friend had shooters in to hravest everything they could since the former owner had lost his source of income). The caliber is well thought of. I have a suggestion for you and all others who are heading for an African safari. See if you can find out what calibers your PH uses. Then, if possible, take a rifle in that caliber with lots of ammo. At the end of the hunt, leave your ammo with your PH. Ammo is hard to source in Africa and the gift will be truly an important and meaningful one. You might also find out if your PH or his trackers have young children. If so, then load up on kids clothes, socks, and underwear. It weighs little and is great to pack around your rifle as additional protection to prevent rifle damage. My PH and his trackers were really moved by the clothes and things I brought just for their children. Little things can mean a lot. NRA Life Member DRSS-Claflin Chapter Mannlicher Collectors Assn KCCA IAA | |||
|
| one of us |
The SST would be the obsolute LAST bullet I would take with me to Africa. I saw this bullet completely blow up on a small antelope buck at roughly 100 yards. At the first shot the buck humped up. The second shot put him down. We found a portion of the bullet base near his flank on an almost perfect broadside shot, meaning the bullet turned about 100-110 degrees to the right. I don't remember the final weight of the base, but I recall it being in the 20-25 gr range. This incidence relegated the SST to a varmint bullet in my eyes. Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
| One of Us |
| |||
|
| One of Us |
The Barnes exploded on me on my last trip. Maybe I should just rake core-locts | |||
|
| One of Us |
 | |||
|
| One of Us |
I have a friend that has shot a couple elk with SST bullets and had complete pass throughs on both. Me personally I would be more doubtful of the 243Win doing it's job than an SST bullet. I don't even like to shoot whitetail deer with a 6mm but have shot several and wondered if I would recover the animals. I thought one would die of old age before he would give up from the bullet wound....square through the heart. Dennis Life member NRA | |||
|
One of Us |
Really?? Animals shot "square through the heart" don't live long regardless of caliber or projectile brand name. | |||
|
| one of us |
+1. No way it could happen. Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
| one of us |
I've never personally seen a Barnes explode on anything, with the exception of some Barnes Varmint Grenades I played with in my 204 Ruger. I've shot the 80 gr TTSX thru roughly 26" of milk jugs filled with water, and it still didn't stop the bullet, which included four half gallon and two one gallon jugs. It zipped right thru all six at 100 yards. I've killed around 10 animals (whitetail and antelop) with this load. Have yet to not recover an animal, or even recover a bullet. There is certainly a much better chance of the SST exploding on impact versus the TTSX, IMHO. If you're not comfortable with the Barnes bullets, I'd look at the Nosler Partition, Nosler AccuBond, Sierra Pro-Hunter or GameKing, or a Speer bullet, in about that order. It's been my experience that the Hornady bullets are just too fragile. Good luck! Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
| One of Us |
I have shot some game with the 150 gr. SST out of my 30-06 at near 3000fps. My experience showed excellent penetration and moderate expansion. This may not transfer to the .243 version though. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I tried to make my purchases of ammo based on the best availability, for the caliber I was taking. We are taking Nosler partitions for our 7mm WSM, R.280. The 30-06, we are taking the SST's 165 grain, and the .243 will be 95 grain. Our .300 Win will shoot the 180 SST's I talked to people, did some research and I guess I'll see how it goes. I'll be sure to list the results of our hunt when we return in mid June. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I have seen enough .30 caliber 150-grain failures in the SST to know I will never buy any more of that expensive crap in any caliber. I darn sure would not trust an expensive African vacation on one. They are extremely frangible bullets and may fail on tough hides and bone. If you are going to take a small caliber with you, I would at least take premium bullets. | |||
|
| One of Us |
From reading the ammo selection I am guessing you are not reloading and using factory ammo. I have tried the 95gr SST out of my .243 and found them to be very explosive. Same for the 139gr in my .280AI. Minimal penetration and was only able to find bits and pieces of jacket and lead fragments. I would prefer to use a heavier constructed bullet in the .243Win. I have used the Remington Core-lokt in 100gr to harvest my first bull elk in the unitah mountains when I was 16. A single shot is all that was needed and when the bullet was found on the offside it had shed quite a bit of weight but the jacket had not separated. Same thing when shooting the few mule deer that I did when living there. If you are not reloading then I would look at Remington's premier line of bullets. They load the Swift Scirocco II and the And the Swift A frame bullets. The A frame is not loaded in 243Win but it is in the 30-06. The Scirocco is loaded for 243Win with a 90gr bullet and the 30-06 has two offerings of 150 and 180. The Swift bullets are hard to beat in my opinion. | |||
|
| one of us |
I have yet to see any animal shot squarely through the heart cover more than 100 yards. I know strange stuff happens, but that conflicts with my experience. 243s kill deer just fine when a good bullet goes in the right place. A bad bullet or a bad shot with any caliber is likely to result in a long tracking job or a lost animal. | |||
|
| One of Us |
That might be the best comment given on both of my threads! I am taking the SST's and Nosler partitions. I really hope the prove Naysayer's wrong. In addition, I hope the Pro-Barnes hunters prove me wrong! I do appreciate the advice, I really do. However, I will give these bullets a try and provide a FULL detail of the bullet performance. thanks! | |||
|
| One of Us |
I've had great results on antelope and muleys using a 100 or 105gr C/L's in .243. Plaidun: I'd sure like to see your loading data for that '06 150 at 3000fps. George "Gun Control is NOT about Guns' "It's about Control!!" Join the NRA today!" LM: NRA, DAV, George L. Dwight | |||
|
| One of Us |
24 inch barrel and 59.5 grs. of IMR 4350 in Remington cases with a Wolf magnum primer. This rifle has a fast barrel. I also reached 3000 fps using H414. | |||
|
One of Us |
I still have trouble knowing what this means, "exploded," and what the evidence was? Solid copper doesn't explode. As for the thread topic, yes, the 243Win is a great impala gun, but so is the 300 WinMag. Personally, I would add something at the 375Ruger level and either drop one of the 30 calibres or one of the 7mm's. After all, you'll be walking through African forest. I like to think of myself prepared for buffalo and lion, even if not hunting them. The 300WinMag will do a great job on hartebeest, but again, personally, I'd rather have 375 (or 416 Rigby) for eland. Just my preferences. Now back to the 243-in-Africa thread. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
|
| One of Us |
PS on 'square through the heart': About 30 years ago I shot a hartebeest, at 300 yards, frontal presentation, through the heart, and it ran 400 yards. We tracked 375 yards before finding a drop of blood but had heard the heavy impact of the bullet. The hartebeest was stone dead at 400 yards, with a little 270 Win hole in the front of the chest and in the bottom third of the heart. The 270 worked, and is probably better than a 243 on longer range hartebeest. But the 300WinMag and a 375Ruger would have been better. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
|
One of Us |
Earlier this month I shot a Red Hartebeest with a .243 at 241 yards. It rolled down hill a little, but did not go anywhere. It was a broadside shot through the front shoulder. DSC Life Member NRA Life Member | |||
|
One of Us |
My 14 yo son used his .243 for all those game (minus duiker) plus bush pig x2, porcupine, spring hare, and a truck load of Dassies, all with 100 Partitions. He took 2x Impala with one shot each. I believe it is a far more verstile African cartridge than it is given credit for. If you have time to hunt and pick your shot you will enjoy taking larger African game with a .243. If you are just collecting trophys then there are better cartridges. You may find it is a favourite amongst your group as it is so easy to shoot comfortably and accurately. Ammo is available everywhere and many locals use it on animals up to and including Kudu. It would be my first choice in the grass veldt and Karoo for springbok as well. | |||
|
| One of Us |
You need to get your chronograph checked. | |||
|
| one of us |
No, sir. It is working perfectly. Here is a small bit of data for you. I'm right in line. Barnes Data Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
One of Us |
I took a Winchester m70 Compact in 2006. Worked well on Grants Gazelle and Impala. I used Barnes TSX and they performed perfectly. Tanzania in 2006! Had 141 posts on prior forum as citori3. | |||
|
| One of Us |
BTW that's me with my son, his Gazelle and the rifle in the picture to the left. Tanzania in 2006! Had 141 posts on prior forum as citori3. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Sorry for continuous adds, today I would use the ttsx. I've not yet tried them but the concept sounds great. ZI've never heard of tsx's exploding. I have heard of failure to expand. TTSX should help that. Tanzania in 2006! Had 141 posts on prior forum as citori3. | |||
|
| One of Us |
can you repost the picture within the thread so that details are visible? The 243 is a great impala and grants gun but it is too light for 'contingencies.' The .243 is also a great spurwing goose gun, for reaching out up a river or across a marsh. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I don't have the picture on this computer. Agree on your "contingencies" view. The .243 is for lighter game. Based on the earlier comments, it sounds like there will be plenty of rifles for all needs. Tanzania in 2006! Had 141 posts on prior forum as citori3. | |||
|
| One of Us |
"I still have trouble knowing what this means, "exploded," and what the evidence was? Solid copper doesn't explode. As for the thread topic, yes, the 243Win is a great impala gun, but so is the 300 WinMag." If you have trouble knowing what "exploding" means, look at my Pic under the "medium caliber" section. Maybe I should have said that it broke into tiny, tiny pieces upon impact...... BTW, I am taking a 300 as well. However, the .243 is better for impala, with my 91 pound 12 year old shooting. He shoots it's better. For this reason, we are taking it. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Maybe one day we will all find the perfect do all caliber ha ha.... | |||
|
| One of Us |
Well, the thread name and/or day of posting might help find that picture. Or a simple inclusion of the photobucket link for this thread. (In the Barnes bullet performance thread, I did find the entrance picture on the eland, but no pictures of the pieces/fragments.) Without the picture of pieces, I can only say that it sounds like one of the 'varmint grenade' bullets. I've never seen or heard of a normal TSX/TTSX doing this. The typical complaint against the Barnes TSX/TTSX is that the exit hole is small, something that typically suggests a bullet having lost its petals. An "exploding" bullet would not exit. So I wonder if a varmint grenade bullet got put into a normal box of bullets? sort of a chilling thought. Fortunately, it's not something that a person would have to worry about at 338 and higher diameters. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Yeah, it was that thread. I didn't do a complete autopsy but if memory serves, I'm 99% sure it did "explode". Look at the size of the entrance wound. 4-5 petals breaking could hardly make that wound, IMO. But, I'm no expert. It was a TSX and 180 or 165 grain in the .300 win mag. Barnes acknowledged bullet failure and as I've said, I hope this was an isolated failure. My son decided to shoot an elk with them and give them a try. They worked well! The last impression I want to give on this website is that I'm some sort of bullet expert. It is just interesting to relate and hear of actual experiences. I certainly have no agenda to fill. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Jason, The anomoly still raises questions about what happened. If the bullet exploded like a varmint grenade, how did it kill the eland? It is difficult to get the pieces (of the puzzle, not the bullet) to add up. Did the eland stop for a second shot? Notice another comment on the Barnes thread:
That report is also difficult to understand. "TTSX blow apart ... everything but the bullet fragmented". Sounds like awesome internal damage. But how did the TTSX "blow apart" and then the comment that the bullet didn't fragment? It makes me wonder if this isn't another report based on a small exit hole. The hunter assumes that a small exit hole means that no expansion took place. But then the internal damage is devastating. What in the world happened? Both Barnes bullets and GSC bullets have been noted for such behavior. The real change and potential explanation for all of these events comes with the CEB Raptor bullets. Their brass petals seem to fly outward at a greater angle and make observation of the phenomenon easier. Some of the petals even reach the far side of the animal for fuller documentation of the internal damage pathways. I have seen a picture of another animal with a surface entry wound on a scale like your eland, something like a 2-3" circle of hide was blown away. The person didn't like the Barnes bullet because it was too destructive and ruined potential for nice taxidermy. But the bullet had not disintegrated, it just created an exceptional entrance wound. +-+-+-+-+-+-+ "A well-rounded hunting battery might include: 500 AccRel Nyati, 416 Rigby or 416 Ruger, 375Ruger or 338WM, 308 or 270, 243, 223" -- Conserving creation, hunting the harvest. | |||
|
| One of Us |
Hornady 95 gr. SST; Hog at 125 yards downhill. One hole in, one hole out - just a little bit bigger. In the freezer. Tastes great. I've used Hornady ammo in various calibers. Shot a giraffe with a S&W 500 w/Hornady 500 gr. softs. DRT Cape but with Hornady 458 Lott. Through the heart out the other side. He is on a pedestal next to me. This doesn't make me anything of an expert, just a firm believer in Hornady products. | |||
|
| One of Us |
I have been back for a week now and had a great trip. The most rewarding part of the hunt was the opportunity I had to share it family and friends. Now, to the results: I was cautioned not to take the Hornady SST's. After shooting them out of my 30-06, I would have to agree with what was recommended to me. Most bullets that were recovered, had core/jacket separation. Others, put pin holes through the animal and left little to no blood. One positive was that they were very accurate and although the bullet did not perform well, they were very accurate. Most shots were one shot kills. I did lose a kudu and I believe there was a possibilty that it was the bullets fault. However, that is nothing more than speculation and I would not be surprised if I was WRONG! The .243 worked great for my son. The SST's seemed to work a little better with this caliber. Maybe he is just a better shot! He shot 2 wart hog, a blesbuck, and an impala with it. Being as he is only 12, it was the perfect gun for him. I am very happy we took it. My other son and dad shot nosler bullets. They worked much better and that is the bullet(s) I will most likely use in the future. Overall, the SST's left little to no blood trail. Thank goodness we had great trackers!! | |||
|
| one of us |
Jason, I was curious what your results were going to be. I just returned yesterday from a 14 day safari myself. I got to see some SST and cup and core bullets in action from other members of my party. One guy accidentally packed some 55 gr varmint bullets for his 243 and didn't realize his mistake until he got to Cape Town for some site seeing before his hunt started. So, he picked up some 95 gr SST bullets, which were all that we're available. He wounded an impala. During the subsequent follow up the impala was taken down with an SST to the neck at 100 yards. The SST bullet didn't exit the neck and the core had separated from the cup being found on the opposite side against the skin. We also got a chance to cull a few impala which an impala was hit squarely on the shoulder, broadside at 40 yards. An hour of searching later with 3 dogs and 11 guys, not a single drop of blood was found. These results once again confirm my previous thoughts on the SST bullet. Probably fine for punching paper or varmints. The other guy was shooting a 308 Win with 150 gr Remington Core-Lokts. First day out, shot a blue wildebeest 4 times but still never recovered the animal. Little blood was found and the dogs eventually lost the track. Fast forward a couple days and a kudu bull was shot at 110 yards squarely in the should as the impact was witnessed thru the binos by the PH. Once again a few drops of blood but no recovered kudu. The only animals recovered that we're shot via this combination were two impala and a warthog. This makes me suspect the issues were with animals size and sufficient penetration. The two larger animals were not recovered while the three small animals were. This reiterates the need to use properly constructed bullets. The cost of a bullet when going on an expensive trip should never be a hindrance in the grand scheme of a safari in my opinion. I hope you had a great time!!! Graybird "Make no mistake, it's not revenge he's after ... it's the reckoning." | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
Visit our on-line store for AR Memorabilia