quote:

Originally posted by 224TTH:
I shoot a 22/6mm for 99% of everything I hunt.--

224TTH

Pretty much a .22 Newton, I built one years ago and loaded 90gr. Customs most of the time.

I also built a .17 Mach IV and used it on some goats and small exotics--
it works too--

I still believe these and .223's
---with GOOD bullets--
are rifles for the experienced--
not the novice as they are largely being used here in Texas--
esp. with OTS (off the shelf) 55 gr soft points.

The "Skoal can" impact as described, I have seen and worse;
even with the 243 light bullet OTS loads as were popular for "kids deer rifles" here in Texas prior to the rise in .223 usage.

I have finished off a few of other peoples wounded animals over the years that had horrific non-fatal explosively avulsed shoulder(and other area) wounds on pigs and deer.

One such surviving atypical spike had not one but two fist sized maggot infested wounds and a broken scapula and was still able to motor on three legs quite well.

Turns out this animal had been hit initially several weeks before with a 742 Rem in 243 shooting a 60 grain.
(at about 70 yds, --How did we know;
it was owned up to by a crew members nephew, who was amazed it got up a second time and ran off)

So good bullets, placed well--etc-

& I still prefer a larger calibre.

How bout a 75 grain Swift in a fast twist barrel.

quote:

Originally posted by Moorepower:
How bout a 75 grain Swift in a fast twist barrel.

Probably a fair choice-
(the larger ones have held together well out of my .300RUM)

http://www.swiftbullets.com/st...es-1-in-8-twist.html

quote:

Originally posted by Moorepower:
How bout a 75 grain Swift in a fast twist barrel.

I personally never got better than 1.5 moa out of any rifle I tried then in. (3) other guys I hunt with also tried them in (5) different rifles with numerous loads and they never got better than 1.5 moa. When the 70gr TSX came out we quit trying to make the Swift work.

Perry

quote:

Originally posted by perry:

I personally never got better than 1.5 moa out of any rifle I tried then in. (3) other guys I hunt with also tried them in (5) different rifles with numerous loads and they never got better than 1.5 moa. When the 70gr TSX came out we quit trying to make the Swift work.

Perry

It's funny how very different rifle/bullet/calbre/ combos are--

The 180 Scirocco has rivaled my 210 Bergers for accuracy out to 400 and after that the Berger beats it handily.

-- too bad the 75/223 combo fails.

My problem is that my Swift is a 1 in 14 (40XBKS), and my .223 is a 1 in 12. By necessity I am limited to bullets of around 60 grains or less. I had some of the old Barnes X's in a 53 grain but like others have mentioned, never could get them to shoot worth a flip. They would go 1.5" for three at a hundred, in a gun that would shot 5 of ANYTHING into .75 or significantly less. I have about 25 of those left, I guess I will just step on them hard and let them be my short range .223 bullets untill they are gone. Then I plan to try some 53 TSX's, I hear they are much better in the accuracy dept than the old X's were. Sometime in the near future the Swift is going to need a new barrel, and this time it is going to be a fast twist one to take advantage of some of these heavy VLD style bullets we have now.

All the loads I have used with the 53gr TSX have been good shooters, 3/4" or better. I've had them running 3100fps in 222 up tp 3700fps in a 22-250. Their accuracy is much better than the original X.

Perry

Okay, you're looking for real world experience? I've lived my entire life in Texas, 41 years and I have to say the most common calibers I've seen are 22-250, 30-06 and 243. The reason for the 22-250? It kills coyotes and deer easily to 300 yds. You'll find those three calibers (or at least until recently) at most small town GAS stations. My dad always told me "Get a 22-250 or 30-06 and you'll always be able to find ammo." I don't have a 22-250 but I've got a 30-06...I'm just saying 22's work...

Perry what load are you using in your 22/6mm with that 70X bullet(I am using reloader 19), and what velocity are you getting? PM me if you prefer not to post the load.

thanks
224TTH

DuggaBoye,

I have a 338WM also that shoots great with 225gr federal fusion. I got a small and a large caliber, just nothin in between.LOL

thanks
224TTH

Just wondering if anyone had tried the plain old Remington 55 PSP? It is a bulk bullet but seems it may have a thicker jacket than alot of the varmit bullets. I plan to shoot some into medium to test, but haven't got around to it yet.

I got 400 of them for about $10 at an estate sale a few years ago, bought them for the boys to do some cheap practice with. Turns out they shoot pretty decent in my CZ, it will hold 5 of them in less than 2" at 200...

I have seen one deer shot with the 55gr psp remington. It was a 223 remington and the shot was a "bit" far back. Bullet was perfect mushroom on opposite side of entrance wound between the skin and muscle. It was 38gr.

thanks
longshot

That would be right around 69% retained weight, about what I have seen from the core-loct in larger calibers. I think the Remmy is an overlooked bullet, in general. I sectioned one as well as a 50 Blitzking a couple hours ago, and the jacket on the Remmy looks "somewhat" thicker, but not much. I don't have my calipers here to check it.

I am getting set up to do a penetration test into wet newsprint here real soon, if anyone has a few of their favorite bullets laying around they would like me to throw in the test, shoot me a pm. Both my rifles are slow twist, so anything 65 grains and up need not apply. I would really like to see a few of those barrier bullets show up from somewhere.

224
My load is 48gr/Re-22. Velocity is about 3680-3700fps, COL is 2.770. I could definitely push it a little faster but that does all I need it to do.


JTP
I have used a lot of 55 PSP in 223/5.56. They are good for factory loads but there are certainly better bullets out there for the reloader. if you are going to push them 22-250 speeds they will fragment.

Perry

Yeah Perry, I wouldn't even attempt the Rem. in my Swift. At the top end of the velocity spectrum there are only a very few bullets I would be comfortable with in the weight range my rifle will shoot. Barnes, Partition, TBBC, and maybe another one or two. Being able to shoot heavyweights would change that some, but my 1 in 14 twist won't alow it. .223 speeds open up a whole new range of bullets though.

Perry,

My load with the 70gr barnes X is 47gr reloader 19 col is 2.770(same as yours and max for loading in magazine out of remington 700 short action) with 3750FPS avg. I use the same 47gr load and max length with my normal groundhog/coyote load using a 69gr sierra match king at 3575fps avg. My gun is a 1-9 twist 26"brl.

The 69gr MK shoots best out of a brl with less than 40ish rounds out of it...and the 70 X shoots best after the gun has been shot a while, so I can shoot the gun over the summer at groundhogs and switch over to the X bullet and be set.

thanks
224TTH

At these velocities I just use the X all the time. It flattens coyotes! I used to use the 69gr SMK also and found it to gel when you hit larger animals with it. I shot a cottontail one time that literally vaporized. We found a leg, partial skull with one ear attached and red misty goo in about a 3' circle...it was awesome!

Perry

My experience with .224 bullets and deer is short, but good!

Remington 700 SPS in 22-250, loaded with 55 gr Sierra Game King. Deer was a large bodied 5x4 at a distance of about 25 yards from the muzzle. Bullet hit a rib on entrance a bit far back as he was on the move, but the bullet wasted the back end of both lungs and sent bone shrapnel into it's spine. He dropped at the shot, regained his hind legs and did the death wobble another 30 yards or so before he tipped over for good!

I wouldn't hesitate to do it all over again!

Seems the posts that say don't do it are just theories--no actual experience mentioned. Here in Texas most all hunting is on private land and leasing such is very expensive. I am lucky in that my son in law inherited land and I've had a place to hunt. Plenty of first hand experience and actual observing. People exaggerate and refer to the Texas deer as rabbit size. They aren't huge, most in the 100 and under well under 200 pound range. I have done the reloading for my son in law, grandson, nephew and great nephew and have seen a bunch of deer taken with .222, .223 and 22-250 as well as .243. I use Winchester bulk packed 55 grainers in .22 cals and same bullet in 100 grain for the .243. NOT A PREMIUM BULLET. But the results have been premium. Punch em through the vital area and have a sharp knife ready. Anywhere from right on the spot to 30-40 yards you have a deer. Last year my great nephew got one that is hard to believe the reaction. It was a forked horn young buck--probably around 125 lbs. He hit it a little far forward went through the shoulders and was dead on the spot--didnt hit any vitals. This was with a .223 using same bullet mentioned.

Here are some more facts.

Winchester Model 70(post 84), 20" bbl carbine, Win,Rem,Fed .223 cases, 27.0gr BallC2 powder, Rem SR primers, 3,060fps cronographed....Since 1987 this rifle/bullet combo has accounted for 40+ deer and 2 Aoudad rams. Bullet placement is everything...no wounded deer, most were neck shots at less than 100yards.

Best regards,

Ol' John

Follow up to my previous post...bullets were 55gr Winchester bulk packed SP's.

Sorry about that..!

Ol' John

Hi folks,
70 gr Speer SMP from a 14" Contender(1-12").222 Rem. Dont know how fast, load was 17 grs imr 4198. Shot two deer that day a doe and a small buck(yearling)-that was th first of many with that gun-combo, 1988. I've used 63 Sierras @ 2800, since 1993 w/M-700(1-14"), loads were 24 grs BL-C2(2875 fps), 23.8 imr 4895(2825 fps), 21.6 H-322 dont know how fast- I have know idea how many deer with th rifle. Used the rifle for depredation in my family's melon field for a great many deer. No matter how much I shot these guns it was bound to fail or I should say I was bound to fail and did a few times, one was a big doe that I shot in th neck at around 100 yards and went back to the house to get the 4-wheeler and when I got back the deer was gone and I never found it

Yo, Leon...I like your avatar! P-38M?

tiggertate,
Yes an M "Night Lightning", I didnt like th way th Tigercat N looked,lol, blurry- yours a J?
Got to have more than one hobby you know. I build models too. I'm growing older but not up!
LMK

Not too sure about mine; it is the image from a postage stamp. The old man flew them in the big one; North Africa and Italy.

I've only killed one deer with a .22 thus far; a 53 gr X (original style) in a .225 Winchester. It was a 7 point 140 lb buck shot at maybe 30 yards. Penetrated both shoulders and exited. Internal damage looked as extensive as any other high velocity cartridge from the 6mms up through the fast .30s.

My son shot a young fallow deer buck, (which is whitetail size), using my 5,6x57-RWS at 100 yeads, his first deer. He was shooting a 74 grain RWS Cone Point, ("KS"), bullet. This has 2 x Interlocks in the bullet to stop it slipping it's core at very high velocities. This load is doing 3,600 fps so it's right up there with the .220 Swift. However, it doesn't have the Swift's problems. Namely, this bullet was only designed for deer, not varmints. It's also heavy for caliber. The rifle twist rate is 1 in 250mm, about 1 in 10", which stablilizes these heavy pills. The gun has a Savage 110 action but was made up and sold by Anschutz in Germany as their Model 1566-st, (made 1966). It's very accurate, just 1" MOA in his hands when he was about 14 and it can do better.

The deer froze then fell over backwards when it was hit. When I dressed it out, the lungs and insides were well messed up but the meat was still OK.

This rifle is unusual in that it can also be loaded with special Walther inserts to shoot .22 Hornet and .22 WRM. These inserts are supposed to be problematic, but they work just fine for us. Just put a fine amount of Ballistol gun oil on the insert inside neck with a brush to aid extraction. They're surprizingly accurate.

I've loaded up some .224" Nolser 60-grainer partitions which that company says are also OK for deer but I haven't tried them yet. Similarly the 69-grain Sierra hollow points are well recommended in Australia for this caliber for use on boar and kangaroo, (see Handloader, May/June 1989). Keep an eye out for those critters.

The .224" caliber became so unpopular for deer, I suspect, when Robert Ruark wrote graphically about the effect of using a .220 Swift in Africa using varmint bullets, all that were available, (see "Use Enough Gun"). The antis got ahold of this and, needless to say, they used it entirely out of context and the .224" caliber got the blame. But a properly constructed, dedicated deer bullet is somethinmg else entirely. The 74-grain RWS KS (Kegel Spitze) is exactly that.