Well I didn't want to go through all those whitetail posts. Here in Alberta our Government decided that the best way to get a CWD threat under control was to wipe them out in a couple of zones in the eastern part of the province. This was accomplished with a helocopter and a markman shooting a semi auto 223 AR 15. What used to take the CO's 3 weeks on quads with 30-06's, was done in 3 days. Never once heard that 223 was inadequate for the job, and in this fellows hands it was not. FS

It's sad they had felt they had to do that. There's still no good answers for CWD yet.
Did they at least play "Ride of the Valkryies" for the condemned?

Fasteel
I know very little about CWD ... Can it be transmitted to livestock and is that why they are doing the cull..

Sorry to hear that CWD has made it to Alberta.
Hpoefully all the culling won't be in vane.

Low Wall- I don't think anyone knows a lot about CWD. I don't belive it has ever been reported in livstock or humans but CWD is just the form of mad cow that effects deer and elk.

quote:

Originally posted by Low Wall:
Fasteel
I know very little about CWD ... Can it be transmitted to livestock and is that why they are doing the cull..

From what I under stand the idea of the cull was to prevent a Province wide spread of this odd disease. Apparently deer farms from the Province to the east of us in Saskatchewan went unregulated for a period of time and these diseased farm animals spread the infection to the wild deer, which have been working their way into eastern Alberta. Some MWU's require that the heads of all deer be submitted for CWD testing.. FS

Lads

You need to be very careful that Hot Sh$t (aka the Ricochet rifleman) and his lackey Kaboom (aka the flock shooter) don't find out that you are talking about the taking of mule deer with a 223.

Again, remember that Hotsh$t is the suppository of all knowledge of harvesting deer with a 223. After all he has taken over 1,000 whitetail as is verified by his own words.

Hotsh$t is full of opinions about the use of a 223 on deer and they spew forth in a diarrhea like fashion but no EXPERIENCE, as he so states with that caliber on deer. Beware.

quote:

Originally posted by Fasteel:
Well I didn't want to go through all those whitetail posts. Here in Alberta our Government decided that the best way to get a CWD threat under control was to wipe them out in a couple of zones in the eastern part of the province. This was accomplished with a helocopter and a markman shooting a semi auto 223 AR 15. What used to take the CO's 3 weeks on quads with 30-06's, was done in 3 days. Never once heard that 223 was inadequate for the job, and in this fellows hands it was not. FS

When you’re a dumb deer it’s pretty hard to escape a helicopter crew once they spot you. These guys aren’t worried about tracking and recovery because the GPS marks the spot, They’re not worried about the meat, they’re just killing. I’m sure these guys don’t wanted to inflict undo pain on these deer but if they needed an extra shot or two, no one keeps count. After all ammo is cheap when they’re using a 223.

Don’t get me wrong, multiple shots on a sick CWD deer is much more humane than letting it die naturally from the disease. CWD is just an ugly disease. Don’t confuse this culling activity with sport hunting though. The 223 is adequate in a number of hunting situations and places. It can be totally inadequate in other situations.

I have no White Hot passions on the 223 one way or the other. Just don’t tell me it’s the only deer cartridge I need.

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Lads You need to be very careful that Kaboom (aka the flock shooter) don't find out that you are talking about the taking of mule deer with a 223.

You don't have to worry anymore about me. I can't stand by and watch you guys have all the fun. I'm gonna get me one of those fabulous 223s, and then I can take flock shooting to a whole new level. Heck, if I can wound 2 or maybe 3 in a session with a bolt action 257R, think how many I can get with a 20 round clip. I might even be able to find one or two that way.

KB

I bet you guy's would be amazed at the one shot kills if you talked to the shooter. Not that I know him but from what I've experienced the deer go down quickly when hit with the .223.

Terry

My brother inlaw has killed rediculous amount of deer with a 223 remington mod 7 with a rem 55 softpoint.

If the shooting is from a moving vehicle (Helicopter or any other) The consistant, poverbial well placed shot is non existant. In this case it would seem to me that any hit could be considered a dead animal. Maybe not dead right away but in the not too distant future. Do any of you really think this action is good justification of the .223 being a good Mule deer rifle? A .30 carbine would yield similar results and probably has. roger

My comments are not a “put down” on the shooter, “stuff happens”.

If “stuff happens” on one or two deer out of a hundred CWD infected deer, it’s still better than letting them die a natural CWD death.

quote:

Originally posted by Kabluewy:

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Lads You need to be very careful that Kaboom (aka the flock shooter) don't find out that you are talking about the taking of mule deer with a 223.

You don't have to worry anymore about me. I can't stand by and watch you guys have all the fun. I'm gonna get me one of those fabulous 223s, and then I can take flock shooting to a whole new level. Heck, if I can wound 2 or maybe 3 in a session with a bolt action 257R, think how many I can get with a 20 round clip. I might even be able to find one or two that way.

KB

I would advise against that in your case. You can't shoot for sh$t. The 223 requires that known ability to hit what you're aiming at and that would exclude any "flock shooting".

Did you ever follow up on those shooting lessons or at least some assistance from that Boy Scout Rifle Shooting Merit badge?? I think that you would be wanting to do that before you head out for the deer season this year.

Remember where you hit them is as important if not more so, than what you hit them with.

Wishing you the best in your hunting season!!!!!

Thanks for the advice on shot placment. I'll keep that in mind. Thanks for the advice against the 223 too. I think I'll like my 308 better anyway. Maybe I can get two with one shot. Like I said, don't you worry about me. Although I can't shoot for shit, I've managed to have a good time, and get a share of the deer. I'll be out there, and at the range too, all winter since they plow the snow out there. If I see any boy scouts, I'll be sure to ask them for advice.

Maybe I can post some pictures for you, to show how how my shooting skills are progressing, but then on second thought, you would probably just say that I found the targets at the range. So why bother?

Now that you mention it, I remember last year about this time I met one lad and his father at the range, sighting in a fine new Tikka deer rifle. The kid and his father were having a tough time sighting in and had shot up one box of ammo, and started on the second. After checking the rings, etc., I found the rifle extremely accurate, and had it about zeroed in 4-5 shots, then let the kid finish it. His dad and I have become friends, and he's got a boat, with a heater. That's the best kind of friends around here for deer hunting on the islands. I'm glad I had a chance to shoot a Tikka. Very impressive and inexpensive too.

Too bad about the CWD and the slaughter of the mule deer. When I lived in eastern Colorado, near Sterling Colorado, at entrances to wildlife managment areas, I noticed collection drums, and signs from F&G asking for the heads of deer, with mention of CWD, so I inquired about it at F&G office. Found out that the disease was rampant in the whitetail deer population in that region. I don't know how widespread it was. There were plenty of deer too, and permission to hunt on private land was pretty easy to get too. But after finding out about the disease, I just didn't want the meat. Apparantly this CWD is a big and spreading problem. I really doubt that it can be stopped.

We are very fortunate here because these deer populations are very isolated, and mostly on the islands. It will take years, if ever, for the disease to spread to these deer.

Anyway, hopefully your season goes well. Best regards.


KB

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:
I bet you guy's would be amazed at the one shot kills if you talked to the shooter. Not that I know him but from what I've experienced the deer go down quickly when hit with the .223.

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Remember where you hit them is as important if not more so, than what you hit them with.

Let's see: Mr. Melting at the Center...aka Hotcore...says (in his own words) that he would not shoot ANYTHING over 50 pounds with ANY .22 centerfire.

So, by his own admission, he would not take a 51 pound animal with a 75 grain Scirocco at 3500 fps from a .224 TTH but WOULD INDEED take a 200 pound deer using a .243 WCF with 85 grain bullets at 3300 fps -- again, by his own admission.

I guess he bases that on the experience of killing, in his own words, "many thousands" of deer. Yet surprisingly, in all of that "killing," he doesn't have a single experience shooting or even witnessing the shooting of any game animal with a .22 centerfire.

Yet he certainly has some loud-mouthed OPINIONS on them...

Yes, there is some BS going on, but it's coming from Melted-at-the-Center himself.

So, HC, here's your sign:

He's still got his panties in a wad from the last thread. Nobody believed his outladish lie and he's lost all credibility.

Nothing left to do but throw rocks and dig holes.

Dig away Hot Core. Maybe you can top your last tale tell and try to prove us wrong by claiming you've killed millions of deer



You're a funny guy.

nobody would know you dug a hole if you left all the dirt in it.

Anybody that tries to draw a parallel between arkansawing a deer from a helicopter with a AR15 in .223 and sports hunting with the same cartridge is really reaching.
We hear all about the spectacular successes but never hear about the miserable failures. Like the rube in WV that bragged about his grandson shooting at 14 deer before he go one down.

quote:

Originally posted by stillbeeman:
We hear all about the spectacular successes but never hear about the miserable failures.

That's because most of the miserable failures are hypothetical strong opinions based on ZERO experience. In the real world, miserable failures happen with all cartridges.

quote:

Originally posted by stillbeeman:
Anybody that tries to draw a parallel between arkansawing a deer from a helicopter with a AR15 in .223 and sports hunting with the same cartridge is really reaching.
We hear all about the spectacular successes but never hear about the miserable failures. Like the rube in WV that bragged about his grandson shooting at 14 deer before he go one down.

Killing is killing. It doesn't matter if you're sitting in a helicoter or wearing orange. They knew what it would take to kill these animals and they used it. Why is it reaching to bring this up? What amazes me is the amount of denial I've seen on these threads. The .223 works on deer.

Kind of rediculus to blame any cartridge for taking 14 shots to bring an animal down. Slob hunters are everywhere and they wound and mame lots of game animals with all different size cartridges.

quote:

Like the rube in WV that bragged about his grandson shooting at 14 deer before he go one down.

Wasn't that somewhere in the Carolinas?
where some people kill thousands of deer?

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Remember where you hit them is as important if not more so, than what you hit them with.

so I can assume none of us have to be concerned about shot placement any more?

COOOL... that's a load off...

just load up a 458 Win Mag with a stiff charge of Blue Dot... and I should be all set!

Look out Deer....

here I come!

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:

quote:

Originally posted by stillbeeman:
Anybody that tries to draw a parallel between arkansawing a deer from a helicopter with a AR15 in .223 and sports hunting with the same cartridge is really reaching. ***

Killing is killing. It doesn't matter if you're sitting in a helicoter or wearing orange. They knew what it would take to kill these animals and they used it.

Totally regretable belief.Try hitting a 9" stationery paper plate at 100 yds. while someone is pulling you in a wagon; none less a helicopter.
Does any one think the shot from the helicopter would be made only at deer standing still?
Again, the idea that shooting mule deer from a helicopter qualifies the .223 as a mule deer hunting rifle has no validity. Poor example.
Now if you get your rocks off contradicting, critisizing, argueing and name calling I guess you came to the right couple of threads. roger

quote:

Posted 14 October 2009 06:19 Hide Post
My brother inlaw has killed rediculous amount of deer with a 223 remington mod 7 with a rem 55 softpoint.

how many has he lost with a223 55gr sp

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:

quote:

Originally posted by stillbeeman:
Anybody that tries to draw a parallel between arkansawing a deer from a helicopter with a AR15 in .223 and sports hunting with the same cartridge is really reaching. ***

Killing is killing. It doesn't matter if you're sitting in a helicoter or wearing orange. They knew what it would take to kill these animals and they used it.

Totally regretable belief.Try hitting a 9" stationery paper plate at 100 yds. while someone is pulling you in a wagon; none less a helicopter.
roger

So, you're say'n shoot'n deer from a copter is harder? if so then according to YOUR logic it would be easier to hunt with a .223 than shoot them from a helicopter. Is that your point?

If so then ok, I'll give you that but that fact remains they did it and, did it effectively so what's your point Roger?

Just to make things perfectly clear to you, my point was if it works in the air it will work on the ground. There is nothing between the lines. It was a clear statment. Are we clear on that?


I already know the answer Roger. What ever it takes to hold on to the belief that it's a bad idea to hunt deer with a .223

quote:

Originally posted by vines:

quote:

Posted 14 October 2009 06:19 Hide Post
My brother inlaw has killed rediculous amount of deer with a 223 remington mod 7 with a rem 55 softpoint.

how many has he lost with a223 55gr sp

That's like asking a stranger when did he quit beating his wife. The implied accusation is equally insulting if you think about it.

quote:

Originally posted by seafire2:

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:

quote:

Originally posted by TEANCUM:
Remember where you hit them is as important if not more so, than what you hit them with.

so I can assume none of us have to be concerned about shot placement any more?

COOOL... that's a load off...

just load up a 458 Win Mag with a stiff charge of Blue Dot... and I should be all set!

Look out Deer....

here I come!

Hey Hotsh$t

Look like you're getting the sh$t kick out you here with every post you put up, you old ricochet rifleman.

I guess the lads here have found out what you are really all about and makes me wonder if someone has squeezed your head??

By the way I was at a Gun shop and found a great rifle for you that I had them put on hold for you. It's a Pre 64 Model 70 in a .223. The guy behind the counter was telling me how many whitetails that he took with that same rifle and he said it was in the many thousands. I don't know about you, but I didn't believe him.

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by bartsche:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by TC1:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by stillbeeman:
Just to make things perfectly clear to you, my point was if it works in the air it will work on the ground. There is nothing between the lines. It was a clear statment. Are we clear on that?


I already know the answer Roger. What ever it takes to hold on to the belief that it's a bad idea to hunt deer with a .223:

I have to hand it to you; You are a pretty good spin doctor and side steper and you deffinitely are part of the right thread. roger

quote:

Originally posted by bartsche:

quote:

Originally posted by TC1:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by bartsche:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by TC1:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by stillbeeman:
Just to make things perfectly clear to you, my point was if it works in the air it will work on the ground. There is nothing between the lines. It was a clear statment. Are we clear on that?


I already know the answer Roger. What ever it takes to hold on to the belief that it's a bad idea to hunt deer with a .223:

I have to hand it to you; You are a pretty good spin doctor and side steper and you deffinitely are part of the right thread. roger

Only you and a few others here would see that as spin.

Why don't you take a minute, figure out what exactly what you didn't like about my post and then put in words. Your 1st attempt was pitiful and you seem frustrated with my reply.

You start out with this:

quote:

Now if you get your rocks off contradicting, critisizing, argueing and name calling I guess you came to the right couple of threads.

and in your next post you write this:

quote:

I have to hand it to you; You are a pretty good spin doctor and side steper and you deffinitely are part of the right thread. roger

I guess there really is no high ground here for you either.

quote:

Originally posted by Bobby Tomek:
but WOULD INDEED take a 200 pound deer using a .243 WCF with 85 grain bullets at 3300 fps -- again, by his own admission. ...

I do remember mentioning Killing Deer with 85gr Partitions in a 243Win, but I really do not remember quoting the Velocity nor the size of the Deer that were Killed.

So, until a link is provided showing I actually said that, I'll toss a couple of Flags

quote:

So, until a link is provided showing I actually said that, I'll toss a couple of Flags bsflag bsflag

Translation:

you guys keep track of what I said, so I don't have to...

Roger...

deer are not that hard to hit from a helicopter...

when I was in the Washington NG...I was on board a Huey or two over Yakima Firing Range.. and watched a couple of pilots waste more than a couple of coyotes, with a couple of side mounted miniguns...

the coyotes just sort of digitally disappeared...

would do the same to a deer I am sure..

Hey bobby, No proof(link) to back up your blowhard claims??? Seems that is always the way you post - blowhard about something you don't have a clue about and imply it is true.

You fit right in with teanScum, seafire and tc1, but of course everyone knows that already.

quote:

Originally posted by Hot Core:
Hey bobby, No proof(link) to back up your blowhard claims??? Seems that is always the way you post - blowhard about something you don't have a clue about and imply it is true.

You fit right in with teanScum, seafire and tc1, but of course everyone knows that already.

"I've killed many thousands"

Where is your proof?

You'll never be taken seriously again.

HC- I don't need a link. Here are your ACTUAL words:

“Have Killed a few, drug in Deer for some folks, and discussed the results of the shots and cartridges used with folks who bring Deer in to be Processed. (Maybe he works at a processing plant, too!)

So, I'd have no reason to have seen a Deer shot with any 22cal.

Concerning Deer Loads, I've killed a bunch of them with various 85gr, 90gr, 95gr and 100gr bullets in the 243Win. Right now I'm using the 90gr Speer Hot-Cor and it has proven to be excellent... No, I never wasted any time chronographing a 243Win load.”

And then you go on to say you have killed "many thousands" of deer...
----

There they are: YOUR WORDS. What more PROOF do you want?????

But keep . The entertainment factor you provide with your outrageous claims -- errr...make that lies -- is invaluable.

By the way, HC, you keep "forgetting" to provide ANY proof of those "many thousands" of deer you killed.

Every who wasn't on to you already now certainly is.

Deflecting attention with even more lies and false accusations will not work, either.

So, on behalf of lots of folks here:

Put up or shut up...

Well well well, your above "quote" does not contain anything about 200# Deer nor 3300fps. So, you just proved yourself to be the same as "my hero" teanScum - a Lying sack of obummer.

All the Kills I made with the various weight Bullets in the 243Wins showed me the LARGER Diameter Calibers Killed cleaner and with more authority. I realize you don't have a clue as to what I'm talking about. That is because you are simply a Lying blowhard with Zero first-hand Experience.