Here's something rolling around in my empty head.

on a 98 mauser....
in a classic german style stalking rifle....

take the 495 a2 (thanks for the troll for mentioning that round... good can come from anywhere)

make a "shortened" 475 a&m, based off the 460 weatherby case... add a little taper for feeding...

something akin to the new 465 HH....

run it 500 grains at 2150, just like the 470 NE...

hmmmm.....

jeffe

[ 10-10-2003, 20:51: Message edited by: jeffeosso ]

How do you get that big of case head on a Mauser bolt? It looks like it's about the same diameter as the bolt body?? Maybe a rebated Rigby case?

Lars,
the casehead is .579, on the woundabeasts.. at least the 460... i believe, according to my ref sources.. that's .047 larger than the standard mags, and .01 smaller than the rigby/jeffery casehead...

jeffe

[ 10-11-2003, 00:26: Message edited by: jeffeosso ]

Hey Jeffe,

Your idea sounds like it oughta work. Just ran it through the Axeloadata Trollmaster software...I personally would never use more than 115 grains of Bullseye with a 600 grain bullet! Caution: do not attempt this at home--flying debris from exploding rifles has been determined by the State of Kalifornia to be possibly hazardous! Anyway, now that everyone knows I'm a smart-ass I'll let the more serious posters take over.

Good Hunting,

[ 10-11-2003, 02:23: Message edited by: ACRecurve ]

Andy,
Your load sounds like the standard troll steelrain data set.... I believe this loading practice both explains their lack of pictures in relation to their OWNED firearms, and their, well, shocking appearence.... and dainbramage, but that's another joke all together..

I did a drawing of what I think it could be, today.. I'll fax dave with it in a couple days, see if he's got another close... and if not... well, mebbe

jeffe

Ladies and Gentlemen,

Please stand by for the announcement of a brand new cartridge---the 475 Jeffe-ry! Not as fast as the 470 M'Bogo, not as nostalgic as the 470 NE, not as overblown as the 475 A&M, but a damn fine killer invented by our own Jeffe--a man who had the sense to get the hell outta ARKansas and move to Texas. Yes, folks, he did all this just so he could give us the 475 Jeffe-ry. He will be taking orders for completed rifles within the week. And he promises completion by or BEFORE the time that the trolls are gone--all for the mere price of, oh let's say, a dollar-two-ninety-eight Jamaican! Move over Rigby, get outta the way Dakota--the 475 Jeffe-ry has arrived. Just in case someone is completely unaware that this is a hoax--please send all $ to my Swiss bank account# BR549. Thank you and good day.

Good Hunting!

PS--Actually this is a good idea. Art A. wishes he'd thought of it first!

Sounds a lot like my 475 wildcat's big, belted brother.
Should wurk great!

[ 10-11-2003, 04:50: Message edited by: Bwana-be ]

Use the 470 Capstick and shorten case a little
and put your name on it.Art borrowed it from
O'Neil, Keith, And Hopkins, It was called the
475 OKH, 65 years ago...Ed.

Shorten the Capstick?
Jeffe, you're talking about a mag-length case, right?
COL ~ 3.6" right?
This on the Weatherby would smoke the Capstick on the way to work.
I still say someone should chamber the Mbogo in a 3.6" and see how she does.

a 2.85 case... with a 3.6 oal... borrowed the taper from the 470 nitro... shortened the neck to 1 caliber length... started with 460 brass.. something like 30 grains more water than the capstick.... at least, the 460 has that over the lott... and a nice gentlish taper....

who knows, i might do it... nice looking drawing... should be a decent round.. cheap brass... no round shoulders.. ...

and I just want it to match the 470 ne...

yeah, it is really just a 495, a tad reworked, and then necked to 475... but *I* don't have a 470

jeffe

A) Every cat is just a something worked over.
B) I have a name for you: 470 J-Square.

Jeffe,
Sounds cool. Ought to be good. Do it in a CZ 550 and make the first one come together easier, at least for the shop mule. I can't say I have heard of that one before. Yours is more original than my .510 JAB, which I stole from A-Square who stole from Wells who stole from Buhmiller. Then SSK stole from me.

.475 Jeffe-ry would be a practical proposition.

jeffeosso

I think you should call it the 470 Judeeshooty.

One of these is sure to cure a nasty dose of penis envy.

(Between you and me I think she already has one).

Jamie

Hi Jeff,
You should end up with a decent shoulder. How's Mike's 470 coming along. Are you shooting yet?
Take care
Dave

[ 10-11-2003, 09:06: Message edited by: 470 Mbogo ]

Thanks for the encourage meant, guys...

I am thinking I'll send a fax to Dave at ch4d, see if there's anything close... If not, it's not that huge a deal... the shoulder angle and taper are blatantly stolen from the 470 NE

Here's my general Idea (all rights reserved, as I've already mailed these to myself)

2.85 case oa
.475 neck
2.375 to base of neck .505 dia (460 2.494)
2.275 to base of shoulder, .530 dia (460 2.345)
the rest is straight weatherby case, but tapered more. If I remember correctly, the 460 is .561 at the base of the shoulder.

That allows the round to finish up at 3.6, and estimated 130ish grains of water...

475 Jeffe-ry/Trollbane? I kinda like it.

Going to use a mauser for the shop mule, though... want it to just barely make it, and hold 3 for the starters...

thanks again...

jeffe

jeffeosso - I think a better approach would be to use the 460 short A-Square and simply neck up to .475. This is a superior approach, IMHO!

Dave,
We are going to the range, today to do exactly that.... I'll post later on the monster

jeffe

Judy, the 460 A-Square Short is a 3.35" round.
The case is too short to do what Jeffeosso is talking about.

We shot the 470 mbogo and 500 jeffe today!!!

Got it on paper, at 50, and played with wc852 loads with hawk bullets on the 470...

(do not use this data)
110gr wc852 gave 2303fps, 3 shot ave, and rather pleasant to shoot. I whacked a 3.5" group, just shooting over the chrono...

the 500, with cast 535's, topped out at 2300 and a tad more...

was a GREAT day.

jeffe

jeffe, thats really not a bad idea for a cartridge considering the body taper. If you look at the fore-and-aft dimensions of the capstick 470, you find some serious problems that just dont add up.

Hi Jeff,
Mike gave me a call to say how pleased he was with his 470 Mbogo. It's nice when a project all comes together isn't it. How did you like the F990 pad etc.
Take care,
Dave

Dave,
I think I am as tickled with his 470 as he is... The recoil SHOULD have been ~ the same as my 500, as his is a touch lighter, but the recoil FELT lighter....

The f990, which is put on my 500 btw, certainly does eat up recoil.. the kickezz are heavier, and makes the gun balance differently...

at 2150 (his loads stopped at 2300) it felt like a 416... which makes me REALLY want something like this thread is talking about...

Can you imaging one of the classic german or english stalking rifle... 1 standing 1 folding sights, skinny, light, 22' barrel... and good enough for hippo at 10feet...

man... This might actually happen!!

jeffe

Smallfry,
the thought process was that I dont "like" the capstick, because it has just about zero taper, and just doesn't LOOK "cool" I've got on in my collection, somewhere....

but, if i can add 5-10% case capacity, and run it at 2150... match the 470 NE, in a light bolt gun, and lower pressure. WHEW!!

jeffe

And, funny enough, i was working on the "475 trollbane" 3 years ago, about the first 1/3 of october...

The 470 AR has taken this one's place, but the 500 AR will fit the same specs, nicely

jeffe

A 500 AR! You plan on celebrating New Years like the last?

132.3 GR OF H20 IF I READ YOU # RIGHT

RNS

OK, simmilar to .465H&H but with the more common .470 bullet....................
It will give higher preassures at same velo as the A&M..................

Yea. But at that velocity, will not the .470 AR be better?

But who the hell would have a classic cartridge stamped "Trollsbane"????

quote:

Originally posted by Bent Fossdal:
But who the hell would have a classic cartridge stamped "Trollsbane"????

Bent,
I came up with this idea before I realized that nothing shoulder fired could penetrate a troll's skull!!

Take the same case to .510 and you get a neato package.. Basically a 495 A2, but loaded to more like the 500 jeffe.. 535 at 2400, 600 at 2200+

Neal,
i calcu-figure 131.84 gr.... so, pretty darn close to the 495 A2, but I don't want to run 65,000PSI

jeffe

I like it Jeffe, I really do, but give it a serious name, like ".470 Belted Express", and it will have a future!!

Another kind of crazy idea (it seems we're on that topic) is to take the .460 case and cut it off right at the shoulder, seat a .54 cal black powder minie, and throw a .54 barrel on. Should be an interesting Mauser project, though it might not qualify as classic.

we did that!!
.550 bullet

http://www.weaponsmith.com/550-exp.html

and I more or less finished the trollbane, it MORPHED into the 470 AR(and the 458, and 416 AR)
http://www.weaponsmith.com/AR-rounds1.html

quote:

we did that!!
.550 bullet

http://www.weaponsmith.com/550-exp.html

Impressive. Did the BATFE put up much resistance?

quote:

Originally posted by nordrseta:
Impressive. Did the BATFE put up much resistance?

In the 550 mag and 550 express, Neal Shirely received a sporting round designation. In my 550 flanged, i received the same.

about the only thing was TIME to turn around, but good on em.

jeffe