There seems to be little information available regarding the use of steel-cased factory ammunition in improved wildcat chambers. What little I have turned up is the advice not to try it, but without any suplementary evidence that the person giving the advice has ever tried it or seen it tried. There's enough folklore in the gun world that just because people repeat something doesn't give me any confidence it is correct. On the other hand, for all I know it is highly dangerous. While I have no aspirations to Darwin Award candidacy if it is truly dangerous, I am curious.

Does anyone have any experience trying this or know of anyone else who tried it? I can think of any number of barrel makers (and a few rifle makers) offering .223AI and .30-06AI, both of which have steel-cased ammunition widely available for their unimproved parent cases. Surely it's been tried by now.

I suspect it most likely would not be unhealthy for the shooter, but if the shoulders kept cracking and exposing the chamber to hot gasses it might be unhealthy for the guns chamber.

If I went through all the trouble to make an AI gun I'd find other ways to save a couple dollars than risk pitting and possibly ruining the chamber of the gun by shooting steel cased ammo you can't reload anyway.

Here is an idea though- they used to make chamber adapters (probably still do) that enable you to shoot say a 308 in a 30-06 chamber. You could possibly turn a bushing to fit your chamber. Again, a bit of work to save a few dollars.

I have found that in standard chambrings that steel cases do not seal well and allows gas to go rearward.Not healthy, I've gotton gas in the face with steel cased cartridges more than once .

This also means that steel does not take the shape of a chamber as nicely as brass; something necessary in many wildcats.This also means that there will be an increased difficulty factor in forming cases by necking down. another draw back with steel cases is the rust factor. Visually unditected rust really will screw up a chamber.It is abrasive. roger

The only way to find out is to try. Use a LOOONG string, though. Shouldn't ruin a bolt gun any more than the occaisional case separation.

My feeling having shot a bunch of steel cased ammo is that the shoulder will split before it can stretch enough to reach the chamber wall. Once might not be a big deal but repeated firings would erode the chamber wall.

Thanks for the answers.

I have no particular objective in mind in wondering about this, just idle curiosity, but I suppose it might have emergency application in countries where military callibers are banned.

Perhaps I will try it some day. At the end of a long string, of course.

Does make me wonder though, whether Cooper and others warn buyers of their AI rifles not to fire steel cased ammunition. (They can hardly, like the big manufacturers, warn not to use handloads! Not for the AI's anyway.)

In emergency applications one can always acquire (or dig up as the case may be) an emergency firearm to fit. Exotics and wildcats have no practical use at that point anyway.

I think it is such a fundamentally bad idea (not that I'm discouraging you from safe experimentaion) that most builders would never think it necessary to state that particular caution.

i would have trouble with trying to forge (that's what it is) steel under an explosion due to metal properies... brass flows, steel tears...

I am seeing a nasty gas leak, at the very best

jeffe

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
I think it is such a fundamentally bad idea (not that I'm discouraging you from safe experimentaion) that most builders would never think it necessary to state that particular caution.

That probably is the reason, but considering a) the horrific mistakes many novice reloaders make even without using brittle, undersized cases, b) that the widely touted advantage of Ackley-impoved rounds is that one can use factory ammunition, and c) that many reloaders shoot steel-cased ammunition in "throwaway" circumstances (plinking or - in handguns - action shooting games) even if they save and reload brass cases most of the time, I would think a small number of people might try this out of ignorance, not out of the spirit of experimentation.

Perhaps I'm just a pessimist about the relative caution of total strangers, but I think if I were selling AI chambered guns, I would probably mention not using steel. Consider that for every fool who asks a question on the Internet (like me ), there are probably many more who do not.

Thanks for all the answers. They dovetail with my own suspicions. I may try it some day just to see for myself, but having seen any number of split steel cases in handgun rounds, and a few in cheep Russian steel rifle rounds, I don't expect favorable results. The nasty gas leak jeffeosso mentions is what I would expect.

I'm thinking that most folks that chamber for AI's assume that the purchaser is a handloader, in fact, why would you get an AI if you weren't going to handload for it? Also, those spending the $ for a custom gun aren't doing so to save by using cheap steel hulled milsurp.

I have had a few people inquire about a AI cartridge armed only with the knowledge they received from reading an article about all the wonderous things the author's AI did compared to factory ballistics. Usually after a question and answer session they decide an AI is for an experienced reloader, and they don't fall into that category. I question every customer on every barrel I chamber in order to feel comfortable in doing the work for them.

To me the brass cartridge case is like a fuse in an electrical circuit. It will yield under adverse pressures long before the steel in the rifle.It is a tremendous safty factor to those of us who do a lot of reloading and often push the limits weither we should or not. To dee roger

Roger,

GREAT analogy!!

Let's see.... in reverse...a .223 should hold 100 amps just fine!!

Merry Christmas!!

Steel case ammo is not for me. I've had 2 case separations in 2 guns. I know one has a proper chamber. I'm not sure of the other. It's not worth the irritation and extraction trouble.
I've still got almost a case of the stuff sitting on the shelf- A case less 6 rounds.
(I'm talking standard chambers -not AI).