I guess i'm just scared of the big,mean animals.

Cherry Boy
AIDS!!! You are just plain ignorant, South Africa has some of the best medical facilities in the world, blood transfusions are on a par with the West, if not better. There is a saying " Better to remain quiet and be thought a fool, than open your mouth and be confirmed as one" Cherry Boy its confirmed.

When I first saw this topic I said to myself "for sure its the money." After reading this thread I'm not so sure now with all the testimonials of how anyone can save the money. However, I still have my doubts so I'm gonna ask a question that is usually rude to ask. For those of you that say you aren't rich but can still go, what kind of money do you make, including duel incomes if any? And what about kids and wives? $40,000 a year for a single guy is pretty rich, but for a married man with a stay at home wife and 4 kids that's not very much.

For me, it's not the money. I enjoy the company of my hunting companions, and so far haven't been able to talk anyone into it. I prefer not to hunt with strangers locally, let alone half a world away.

I haven't read all of this thread, but before my last trip over I went to have a check up and talking to the doctor about hunting around the world, he said, after knowing me only a short while, the reason I hunted Africa etc was I was afraid of not living.

[ 05-09-2003, 16:05: Message edited by: Die Ou Jagter ]

Since I made my intial posts on this I have lost 2 more friends. One to a suicide and the second yesterday to cancer. Again I will say that if you have a dream no matter what it is the time is now.
If you work hard and make the sacrifices necessary you can make it a reality.

I would love to go, and at age 62, I can't take the loot with me to the hereafter, but I do have several obstacles to overcome. I wonder if I'm up to it. I can handle 2-3 miles of hilly country each day, but no more. Second, what will it cost in dollars? Estimates are are all over the place. Third is quality of outfitters. Here in the states or Canada, I rely on friends for outfitter info. Then there is the flight. I fly from the east coast to Hawai each winter in the cattle car. No treat that! Last but not least, all of my pals think old Stoney has gone completely around the bend with his African obsession. Stoneybroke

If their is a will there is a way! I drive a 95 Z71 Truck and it is paid off. I could afford a new one but why (My wife gets the new one)? The thing looks and drives as good as ever. I have a daughter starting college next fall and I will still be able to put money away for an all out Africa hunt. By making these kind of sacrifices I have been to Alaska numerous times(DITY hunts)and quite a few other places across the country. It is all about priorities. Personally, if I could hunt year round I would and I have always had the same passion for the hunt. So that is where I choose to prioritize and organize my goals. Sure my wife's are different and we compromise as she understands my passion and would never ask me to quit.

I kinda roughly went into my records and I book about 100 African hunts to one of any other kind of hunt...

I have been in African hospitals and they are clean, the folks are fantastic, and the doctors are second to none...Tanzania has a fantastic hospital in Dar Es Salaam, my good friend and competitor Russ Smith, got a load of Malaria their and raved about the treatment he got there..

Nirobi has a good hospital also...and these folks have a better handle on putting folks back together from bites, scratches and stomps plus dealing with Malaria as they deal with it more but all that aside I would want to be medivaced to the USA ASAP..

My 10 day African plainsgame includes 7 nice animals for $4200 1x1 and $3800 2x1 plus you can add about $1200 for air fare so that is $5000. for the whole package as opposed to $5500 to $7500 for guided elk hunts. Africa definately gives you more bang for the buck..

I left my byline and the word I live by out of the above post. that is:

"their are those who WANT things to happen, and their are those who MAKE things happen." Excuses are a dime a dozen...

There is nothing there I want to hunt. There is nobody there I really want to know. There are no diseases I want, no thrills I haven't had. I have hunted the most dangerous game. I don't particularly enjoy folks of the "third world" and I'm sure they don't care for me. I'll spend my loot in the best hunting land in the world, North America.

Most people think you have to be rich to hunt in Africa but you don�t. A year ago I had melanoma and also had the insight "F-ck it, I�m going hunting". And I went. The hunt was great and my total stay amounted to six weeks -total cost 10 grand. Next time I go I�ll stay for ten to fourteen days and I�ll be able to cut costs in half. My trohies are all good (except the vlakvarks -warthogs), kudu 54 1/8 in (Rowland Ward), good impala, two good blesbock (one SCI), one good impala, a good wildebeest, a nice civet cat, a good duiker (SCI) and two pigs (one average -but I got lazy on teh pigs). The money used on the hunt (seven days) wouldn�t allow me to shoot much of anything in Europe.

The main thing: I�ve always wanted to go.

Any other excuse is bull.

cewe

A lack of the adventurous spirit?

Stoney, Go for it you wont regret it. Except for maybe having to go back again to satisfy that need.

Good point: Once you�ve been to Africa you NEED to go back. I�ve shot plenty of elk and whitetail but nothing compares to Africa. The night sky, the ancient land, the dream come true.

The sweat and the blood.

The feeling of being alive.

Nothing beats hunting Africa.

cewe

Hi All,

In answer to why- or not to visit/hunt Africa.

I consider myself in a good position to give an unbias opinion which certainly stands to be corrected.

South African bred and born in 1949. Grew up in a major city and was most fortunate to spend most weekends in the stix, also ALL holidays. Thank you LORD! You could take me out of the bush but never vice versa.

Shot the largest kudu bull I ever laid my eyes on, in thickets when I was 11 with a 22 Hornet, pre 64 model 70, serial 7895 with a .223 barrel. Have ever since been busy on game farms/with hunters/tourists/safarigoers etc. I have frequented Zimbabwe AtoZ, have been to Zambia some and on a fact finding mission to Mozambique in April 03.

Back to the topic.

South Africa is not Southern Africa. It is an entity on it's own. DRC is 2500 km. distant. Tanzania borders the latter for 800 km. and Kenya borders the latter. Great hunts and photo safaris there?

South Africa has some of the best outfitters known to man kind. I will not oppose that there are many fly-by-nighters as well for many PHes quallify annually.

I have visited safari outfitters in Zimbabwe and will be done proud if I was a part of any of the units I saw.

So will we find excellent outfits in Mozambique, Botswana, Namibia and every country in the region.

And bar the fact that an African- hunting or photographic safari is not cheap-what the US rates are compared I am ignorant to-, if a prospective visitor overcame the money, aids, long flight, leave and whatsoever other obstacles, South Africa is still adjacent to a Zimbabwe with a demoniac in the chair unto which other local people don't say much to.

I certainly am a future safari outfitter and see the problem as an African one. You are actually much safer in Zimbabwe than in SA. I frequent the northern most corner of Zim. tiger fishing and drive on roads-as a whole seen- in better condition than in SA. I have to put up with the worst customs service known to man kind, cart along most of my fuel, be stopped in road blocks 8 tines in 900 km. but still it's more enjoyable than in SA.

As far as Moz. is concerned, One mission in the past 30 years wont say it all but the bottom has been reached and will take time to recuperate. BUT IT's GREAT!!!!!!!!

The moral ofd the stoty. Mozambique wasn't all that wealthy, it took 30 years to hit the bottom. Zim. was better off, the devil's deciple will reach the bottom in 25 years. SA is another kettle of fish. 50-70 years at least from 1994. The US$ is back up above 8:1 on the ZAR. Come enjoy it while it lasts!!

On the point of hidden costs on a safari for first time visitors.
Why is it that after a hundred years of hunting, all facts are not known by future safarigoers. Certainly all haven't got thick wallets. A working class person-as I- should ascertain himself of facts and the ruthless outfitters must be reported and collectively rooted out!

You want to photograph, hunt, tiger fish, bass, trout or join as a guest, make hay while the sun shines and take toyr malaria pills.

Comments please gents and ladies.

God bless u all.

To Stoneybroke.

There are outfitters that will respect your age and bring you in close to what has to be taken by car. If this can not be agreed upon get another outfitter, easy as that. Toyota maintains "if a section doesn't perform, change the manager quick"

Happy huntings

Stoneybrook,
My dad went to South Africa for the first time in June of 2000 at the age of 66 after my continued coaxing. My mother also went along at age 63. They LOVED it! Dad just returned from his third trip to South Africa and is talking about his fourth trip in 2004. The P.H.'s we have used have been very aware and accomadating of my parents age and limitations. My dad has taken some great trophies and made wonderful friends and memories on his jaunts to the "dark continent". He also has center stage at the little cafe he has coffee in with his buddies!

I have been privileged to share his hunts with him and hopefully my seven year old son will be traveling to Africa soon so three generations of my family can hunt there together.

Please go and make your own memories. You will never regret it.

O.K. guys,

Here's my two cents worth. I think the money excuse is a cop out. I am about as blue collar as you can get. I am a service tech. that works on gasoline pumps. In 1999 my cousin and I decided to give Africa a shot. We did our home work,(with alot of help from people on this forum) cut our expenses, and in 2001 we were on our way to Zim. for a ten day safari.

Our hunt was a package deal, including seven plains game species. I ended up shooting fourteen animals, including Giraffe, two Zebra, Bushbuck, Wildebeest, Eland, two Impala, Warthog, Honey Badger, Jackal, Genet Cat, Baboon and a beautiful 56" Kudu. The total cost of my hunt, including the dip and pack, tips, airfare, shipping, hotels, shopping and all was $9100.00. A real deal if you have done any guided hunts in N.A.

I have hunted in Canada, Alaska and N.W.T. You can rest assured after my experience in Africa, that nonsense is over with!! The N.A. outfitters need to take a look and see what their African competitors are doing! I notice that alot of guys bring up the taxidermy cost when it comes to Africa, but never on the N.A. hunts. Let's include that $700.00 Elk shoulder mount, or that $1000.00 Black Bear rug. Any taxidermist worth his salt will work with you over a three to four year period to complete all of the mounts.

Hell, I know you'll all laugh at me but, I went on four, that's right four Caribou hunts before I scored. Total cost for those two Caribou $12000.00. As far as the AIDS and crime rate excuses go, use your head, trust your P.H. and have a great time! Africa is hands down the most affordable guided hunting in the world!!

BOWHUNR

Well, I don't know how much I have spent on the 4 trips out west chasing elk, but all I have to show for it is a mediocre mule deer mount.

I don't regret going to the Rockies at all, but it shows me that an Africa trip is not as expensive as it looks.

I had 2 friends who "considered" going to Africa with me last year, but backed out for "financial" reasons. One had been laid off, and the other was afraid of being laid off.

So I took my family, and had an incredible experience. Not only that, but I bid on & won a 2003 hunt in Namibia for only $750 including Gemsbok.

Now, fast-forward to this March - we are at the SCI chapter banquet/auction, and the SAME hunt comes up for auction, and they are looking for someone to start the bidding. It seems the locals here are afraid of traveling overseas.

I am coaxing my buddies to bid - which would mean they could accompany me on the same hunt in Namibia this year. Neither one would budge. The winning bidder got the hunt for $500.

Now I'm thinking, "What's up with these guys?"

Here's my take:

1. These guys didn't dream the same dreams I did when I was a kid - of hunting in the Dark Continent or a real "Safari". Maybe they didn't read the same magazines & books.

2. These guys were afraid. Traveling to Africa was just too big of a decision to make. It would require them to leave their "comfort zone" and step out and do something adventurous.

3. They didn't have the same fears that I do. Their fear was that something might go wrong. My fear was that I would get old and find myself lying on a bed in a rest home thinking of all the dreams that I had buried in my lifetime, in order to feel more secure and comfortable.

Sorry, but I have only one chance on this road, and I don't want to spend the whole trip avoiding adventures in order to try to make it last longer.

Will it last longer, or just seem longer?

My regret is that I waited till I was 50 before realizing that Africa was within my grasp all along. But my consolation prize was that I got to go with my son (21 yrs. old). At least now he knows that there is a lot to see and do in this life for people who are willing to step outside of their comfort zone.

Oh, BTW...

That friend, who couldn't go with me for financial reasons????

He just bought a $20,000 pickup truck last week.

When it comes time to say good bye, will you remember the adventures you experienced with your family, or will you reflect on all the vehicles you bought?

We all have to make our own choices. It's a simple matter of priorities.

If hunting Africa is just not worth it, then you just don't have the dreams and passion for it that others have. Anybody with an average job can save $5000 in 5 years if they really want to.

Rick.

J Brown,
Thanks for the kind words. I look forward to that day as well, my friend. That's one of the reasons we hunt...to pass the legacy of the outdoors on to our children.

I think it's all been said. Ray put it in perspective as to cost etc. I can promise it's the experience of a lifetime and you CAN afford it. I've been to RSA twice and am thinking about going again this year because there have been lots of cancellations and the outfitters I know are quoting me some rock bottom prices-$200/day all inclusive plus airfare. I've never regretted a dime I spent there. I said I'd never go back after that last 19hr plane ride but I'm ready to go today.

AFRICA, Raurk, Capstick, Taylor...
Dangerous game....

Why I don't hunt Africa,
I have spent the majority of my adult life hunting the most dangerous game of all. For over 20 years I crawled the ghettos of one of the most violent cities in the United States. In my "jungle" the animals were armed. I also spent over 5 years working undercover narcotics. I have watched the Mark Sullivan tapes and the buffalo and hippo charges. I have gone into houses after people who had just commited multiple murders. I have done undercover stakeout in convenience stores when we knew robberies were planned and they went down. I have been hired to kill people. I have been involved in marijuanna deals where 3000 pounds were changing hands. 2000 pounds of cocaine.
Which is the more dangerous situation?

AS far as plains game. Where I work now I am killing probably 40-60 deer a year due to vehicle accidents. The shooting is varied and goes from handgun to rifle. Deer in any other form just don't pique my interest, although I DO love caribou hunting but that is because the country is just so wild and so "North".

My greatest fear would be that I would get into one of those "charge" situations and there would be NO adrenalin rush, no racing heart no shakes afterwards....because the "beast" would have to close to touching distance to get to me..and that "ain't gonna happen". I KNOW I CAN shoot in stress situations.
THEN what would I have to dream about in my waning years? What would there be to look forward too in life?

In the '80's I was a three pack a day smoker.....I was unhappy about the control these things had on me and I quit cold turkey.

That's an African trip every two years.....and I'm still puting that money into my hunting and fishing. I also cancelled long distance service on my phone years ago.

I don't have a cell phone and I pay cash for everything!

It's simply a matter of priority to me.....

Time can be a factor however.....but the time can be achieved too if you work at it.

My father started this ball a rolling in 1930 when he took his '92 Winchester .25-20 to Northern (Tofte) Minnesota from the little town of Mantorville MN and shot three deer with three shots. That was equivalent to an African hunt to him.

That very same Winchester is going with me to RSA in a couple weeks for smaller Plains game....I'm also taking a .300 H&H too for Kudu and Eland.

It's not a matter of money, it's a matter of who's in control!!! You or your excuses, you or your emotions, .....I think you guys know what I mean!!

My decision was like Mike Smiths, I had lost my dad and a good high school friend. I thought, man they never did all that they had dreamed of. I had dreamed of Africa all my hunting life. I made excuses for a few years afterwards. I saved for a year, and then went to the bank and borrowed enough to take me and my wife. It only took a year to pay it off, I drove a 1982 pickup, worked extra overtime and before you know it I was planing trip #2. And on the way home from #2, unknown to my wife, I was planning #3. #3 took place as soon as they lifted the flight restrictions from 9-11. I don't even have a pickup any more and I have learned to save. I have $8000 saved for #4 and maybe get #4 a lion, for my big 5!!!!!!!!! 3 down two to go! I have done elk, bear, cougar,caribou,deer,moose, and antelope! GIVE ME AFRICA!

I read this thread and it boosts my spirits because two weeks ago I opened my Africa account and plan on going 2005. All the guys I hunt with say the same things, to expensive etc. but it really is an excuse. I have always dreamed about distant places and am determend to see them. I`ve watched to many men say "When I retire" only to get sick or have heart problems that prevented them from living out their dreams.

Very true Turman, and I had friends that said the same things. "Man when I retire I am gonna do this or that" only to die a few years after retirement. " Life is merely a collection of memories" "Make some memories" !

Rusty hit the nail on the head:

"Like most great adventures it takes planning and money, however the rewards are well worth it. Sharing a campfire with your PH beneath the Southern Cross drinking a Castle beer is well worth the price of admission."

My only stopping points are a Wife who doesn't understand me wanting to fly 1/2 way around the world to live in a primitive hunting camp for a week, spend $$$$$ on the trip and all I will have to show for it is some mounts, teeth/tusks, skins, photos and those WONDERFUL MEMORIES of those "sundowners" with the PH by the campfire and the money for my dream! Her idea of an overseas trip involves electricity, shopping and 5-star hotels/meals...Oh well...Perhaps I can get her to go along on the safari as an observer? "Look at those cute lions over there honey! why don't you get closer for a photo"!

I'm sitting a priority to "save for my safari" each month! I'm not getting any younger! (I'm a fit 50 years old)

Mike R. in TN

Well for me it was all about the $$$$$, I thought Africa was just too costly for me. land of the millionaire<sp> hunters! Well after reading this thread, I now feel Africa is "in reach" for me! I did a quick breakdown on saving for it:

If you save just $6.85/day or 205.48 a month in two years you could go on a $5,000 safari, 3 years you could go on a $7,500 safari and 4 years you could go on a $10,000 safari. Of course I'd have to save an additional dollar or so a day to give my wife to spend while I was gone to "keep the peace" LOL

This really put it in "perspective" for me, you know the old saying: "How do you eat an elephant?...ONE bite at a time get's the job done"!

Mike R. in TN

Another money saving idea:

Go "off season". The airfares before June and after Labor day are much cheaper [ we paid about $1,200 in March/April vs $1,800 in July/August ] and the package hunts are often cheaper, or can be negotiated down in the early or late hunting seasons. It can be a little warmer but it's never as hot as Summer or early fall in the southern half of the U.S.

Also, look into taxidermy in South Africa, get recommendations from your outfitter and visit their shops. It is a great deal cheaper overall.

If you have your trophies sent to the US for taxidermy find a taxidermist that has an "exception permit" and have the trophies sent directly to them after clearing customs.

Finally, if you go to South Africa, stay a few extra days and tour a bit. It's an awesome country. Great scenery and interesting culture. Cape Town is a beautiful city, the "Garden Route", wine country are very, very nice as well.