Jason: I have a hunting friend who went to RSA two years ago, with his brother, on a hunt. He had a heart attack, and needed some blood, for some reason. I'm not a doctor. Fortunately, his brother was able to give him blood. Do you really think HIV is "silly shit"?

sS

I have to hand it to Nitro... I totally forgot the smoking money......... 365 x $5.00 a day is $1,825 that will cover the plane ticket and a Springbok.

Ann,

You certainly have a way of putting the maximum amount of truth into the minimum amount of words!

Hi,
Interesting reading some of these posts and amazing at some of the ignorance! I visited your great country in 1980 and always wanted to return but circumstances did not permit this. One of the things I remembered from my trip 23 years ago was the total lack of knowledge of Africa and southern Africa in particular.
Sure we don't have anywhere near your standard of living. Things you guys take for granted are often luxuries to us middle to upper class Africans.
Yes, there is plenty of corruption and lots of crime but I thought you guys were the adventurous, tough, outdoor types? Believe me there is no place in the world like Africa. Africans who have emigrated to other countries find their adopted countries boring in comparison.
Yes, aids is rampant but one in five is a gross exagerration and there is plenty of safe blood available in state of the art private hospitals. Don't be put off by scare stories. Be adventurous and come and have the time of your lives. Africa has plenty of problems and yes they put the blame for these problems on everyone else but where the blame rightfully belongs but Africa has plenty to offer. Africa can really make you feel alive! Don't take my word for it at R8.00 to the dollar come and see for yourself.

Juneau,

Like most of us here I am of a modest income(law enforcement). I work a lot of overtime and cut out a lot of other spending so I can take some hunting trips. I don't call in sick all year, I don't take ANY vacation time so I can take everything at once and have a nice long trip once a year.

When I retire from my present job, in 8 years, I will be moving to Alaska to get residency so I can hunt my little heart out.

If you make a plan it will happen!

Ann,

Good for you! Come on up! We need more ex-Michiganders! (originally from the Lowell/Cascade area)

Collectively, the posts above have probably summed up the various reasons. The single greatest reason is probably this:

Ignorance

Ignorant of the true cost (much less than most think), know nothing really about Africa (it is one country, right?), and hardly know where to start getting info (Call a PH you read about in a magazine???).
All PH's know the easiest way to get knew clients in the US is by word of mouth from successful hunters IN THE SAME CITY. Once a hunter can talk with another "ordinary Joe" at the gun club, church, or wherever, that has already been to Africa, half the battle is over. Ignorance is washed away pretty quickly, and the rest just become excuses.

I'd like to add a couple other factors, however, that haven't been mentioned real explicitly. Most US hunters never utilize a guide. Dedicated, experienced hunters often pride themselves on a do-it-yourself attitude. Having to hunt with a guide in Africa is so different and against our values that many balk. Even if foolhardy, some would rather go unguided and succeed (or fail) on their own.

Another reason is not having someone to go with. Many times one hunter sees the light and decides to go, but can't convince any of his hunting partners to go along. Having someone to go with really helps people get over the hurdle of the first trip.

I fully agree with most of the other stated excuses (errr.... reasons) and believe they play some part in the decision, but not always as large a part as portrayed. Money, time, that damn flight, etc. all keep me from going back more often. I am, however, about to leave on my third trip in three years, and have almost booked 2004's trip already. Yup, if it weren't for the money, time, flight, etc...., I'd go several times a year!
To steal a popular phrase, "Just do it!"

Bill

I am not a rich man (no double rifles, no new car, no big house etc.) but like the many others I broke down recently and decided I will go to Africa in 2004. I am saving every chance I get for example, saving all change everyday instead of spending it (I like the idea about the dollar bills, I will start that tonight) no other fishing or hunting trips, no local deer lease, no new guns (although I'd love to have one to go to Africa with),no expensive dinner etc. I think it comes down to "want to" and I want to very badly.

If it's not your cup of tea, fine don't go. Be happy hunting whatever you want, but don't sneer at the one's who do want to go and say it's for the rich snobs only. I have talked with a lot of people on this forum and not one has refused to answer my question or talked down to me.

Africa 2004

YOU do not have to bring any thing back with you.But you will.No matter what you have to ADD ON AT LEAST $2000.00 for air fair $500.00 for tips $500.00 for spending $500.00 dipping and boiling.And than $500.00 or more to get your trophys shipped back home.So any way you look at it you have to add 5 or 6 grand to any hunt you go on.

Based on my many conversations about hunting Africa or rather why not, my feeling is that the three M's, Misconception, Misinformation and to a much lesser extent, Money, all mentioned already, are the consensus reasons..

Cherry boy

quote:

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Do you really think HIV is "silly shit"?

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When used as an excuse to refrain from visiting an area then yes, FEAR if HIV is "silly shit". Do you lock yourself up in your house to stay safe from drunk drivers and snipers?

Jason

Firemen

quote:

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you have to ADD ON AT LEAST $2000.00 for air fair $500.00 for tips $500.00 for spending $500.00 dipping and boiling.And than $500.00 or more to get your trophys shipped back home.So any way you look at it you have to add 5 or 6 grand to any hunt you go on.

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The numbers you quoted are way too high. An ENTIRE hunt in Africa can be done for $6,000 total. I speak from experience.

Jason

I can only speak for myself, and my reasoning is as follows; mainly, I am fascinated by all of the game animals that North America has to offer; the multiple deer species, elk, antelope, the sheep and goats, moose, et al... For some reason, in watching African hunting videos and in reading about African hunting, the impression seems to be that hunting in Africa is akin to an exotic game ranch in Tx. I realize that this is not the case, but since I can not see the African game within it's native habitat, it is more difficult for me to get worked up about hunting those species. Now I'm really going to stick my foot in my mouth; I am greatly interested in reading everything that I can about hunting in Africa, particularly the Big 4/5, and never pass up a chance to learn more about the safari-hunts.

Maybe I've resigned myself to that fact that I will likely never fly 16-18 hours to hunt in another country? possibly, but there is so much hunting to do here that I'll probably never be able to realize my North American hunting dreams!

FWIW- There's no questions what animal I'd hunt if I ever did go to Africa, that one is easy: Cape Buffalo...

Money, or lack of it.

J Brown.I am NOT trying to piss any one off but I broke my trip from last may.Hotel in Atlanta $89.00.Air fair=$1879.00 dipping and boiling for 1 kudu 1 blesbuck 1 gemsbuck 1 impala and I had my zebra tanned over there=$538.I spend about $400.00 on gifts for my wifes family.Tips =$450.00.Shipping to Chicago=$494.00.And last but the best is my taxidermy bill $1750.00 for a grand total of $5600.00 EXTRA.+ $4200 For the 10 day safari= $9800.00.I had the time of my life and would do it again IF I had another 10 grand to blow.All Iam saying is safaris ARE NOT AS CHEAP AS THEY MAKE THEM SOUND.

firemen

I never doubted that you can spend a great deal of money on a safari. I see from your list there was a lot of "fat" that could have been trimmed(about $3,500 worth).

Everyone has the right to spend their money as they see fit. You are correct in your observation that a $4,200 package hunt costs more than $4,200 when all is said and done.

Jason

/

Iknow a good deal when I see one...I will always hunt Africa as long as I can...22 animals 4500.00.

2 Zebra
2 Waterbuck
5 Warthogs
10 Impala
1 Wildabeast
1 Baboon
1 Jackle

There is more here in North America than I will be able to afford to hunt in a lifetime.
However, in my ventures driving across america, I will not worry about losing my guns in travel, or my ammo. I will not concern myself with getting 10 different shots so a bug does'nt bite me and kill me, I will not worry about 13 hour plane rides and hi-jackers. Passports will not be an issue either.
I would hunt Africa every day, if I lived there.
Those animals do not intrigue me near enough to travel that far to pull the trigger.
If I had obscene amounts of money, and lots of time on my hands, I might do it.
Unfortunately I do not have an overabundance of either.
I refuse to save for 5 years to go shoot something.
Again, Africa is not a bad place, I just can't see it from my house.
Trigger

One other thing to consider (Nitro Express and I disagree on this one) Don't pay cash for anything get a Delta Sky Miles credit card and charge everything you can charge paying it off every month. 80,000 miles gets you a ticket to SA.

MHO...most hunters do not hunt in Africa because of money. By far the vast majority of people that I know would never ever consider paying for a "guided" hunt of any kind. They love to hunt, but after they have paid for the higher priorities in their lives (food, clothing, shelter, and entertainment to the standard that keeps their wives and kids happy), they have to be happy with cheap, local hunting. Most guys might be able to scrounge a couple grand to go on a longer more exotic trip (like out of province or out of state), but its a tough stretch to be "allowed" more than that.

They could get away with less in their daily lives in order to save for Africa, but these average Joe's don't have wives that are as nice and easy going as some that post here.

They have to have a newish vehicle so that they have a reliable vehicle they can use to get to and from work every day, while also driving all over to get two teenage sons to all their hockey/soccer/etc practices/games/tournaments and so on.

They buy an ATV because they can hunt/play with it 50 days a year, for 5 years or more. And their kids can use it even more. The "per use" cost of a "toy" like this is actually quite low for outdoors oriented families.

They buy a boat for the same reason.

They buy a camper/trailer because it is a long term investment in a family oriented activity.

Now, once these fellows have retired or their kids have moved out, if they have been relatively wise with their retirement planning, a few more of them can afford a trip to Africa. Money is no longer the major issue for these folks, but many of them are just not interested in Africa. Many of them have a lot of catching up to do for hunts they have had to foresake in NA. Of those that could be interested in Africa, many overestimate how much it actually costs and dismiss it without any serious investigation. Still others have a fear of the unknown, and worry about political unrest, snakes and malaria. This is where misunderstanding and misinformation play a major role in keeping people from Africa.

Increased education and advertising about how affordable and safe hunting in Africa really is, could go a long way to swaying those that can afford it. Unfortunately, that still won't help the majority of working stiffs that just can't fit it into the budget while keeping everyone else in the family happy.

JMHO,
Canuck

This is a little off topic but here goes. Had a funeral for a friend today. While there I found out another friend has stomach cancer and the lymph system is pretty much all involved. This guy is a big time fly fisherman and goes all over the world. He is going on a trip to the Bahamas that was planned last year for 10 days then coming back to start radical chemo. Doc said 10 days at this point wont make a difference one way or the other. He like most of my age group 45-55 dosnt expect this kind of thing for a few years yet. It just reinforces the fact to me that if you have a dream you should work hard to making it a reality. You never know what tomorrow will bring.

[ 03-11-2003, 03:55: Message edited by: Mike Smith ]

Mike,

You are spot on! The vast majority of my hunting has taken place in the last two years. I had a cancer scare at 29 years old and said "fuck it . . . I'm going hunting"! All I thought about before those test results came back (negative thank God) was things I would do if they were, in fact, negative. By God, I'm gonna do those things!

Best Regards,

JohnTheGreek

Fireman - You know you didn't have to kill everything you saw.

After reading some of these posts, I agree with Terry: IGNORANCE. I went to Africa in 01 and spent a total ( that's EVERYTHING down to taxi fare, taxidermy EVERYTHING) of 12 grand for two weeks of hunting and seven animals. I have friends who've spent anywhere from 4 to 10 grand for a single elk and close to 14 for a bear. Africa is a wonderful, diverse place. Johannesburg is the equal of any of our largest cities. To be sure, poverty, crime and disease are plentiful, but I never felt threatened. I've hunted here in the states all my life and trust me, there is NO COMPARISON to the African experience. jorge

I've been to RSA twice on plains game hunts. Both were great hunts and I'll probably go again. The only thing I hate about hunting in Africa is the cost of shipping home your trophies. I always feel like I've been ripped off.

FEAR OF "BLACKS" - MAMBAS that is especially the 12 foot variety.One hit from one of these mean bastards and it is all over but the shout!

BOSS I only shot a kudu impala zebra blesbuck and a gemsbuck.I came home with $3500.00 that I brang extra animals.It took 6 days to get a gemsbuck.

I have a friend who is a duck hunter. I told him, a long time ago, that I've always dreamed of going to Africa to hunt (I'm going this year). My friend said, "I haven't lost anything in Africa." Some folks just do not have any interest in going to Africa regardless of money or adventure. My friend would rather spent his hard earned money going to Arkansas to hunt ducks than harvest different kinds of animals in Africa.

I'm with Mike Smith and John the Greek,
You can always scrape up the money so it comes down to priorities and building memories. My father ran a twelve story high rise for senior citizens. I did lots of work in that building and the spread of people was from the wealthy to the I can just afford this group, but they all had the same end result, the same small rooms with pictures of family and a colour TV. So it all comes down to memories of things you do today. If Africa is in your dreams make it happen. If it takes four years to pay it off you can still think that you've been there and done that. Take pictures and video. I met the late Jack Carter of Trophy Bonded bullets at the SCI convention in 96 and his advice was go do it. He told us he made six trips to Africa and couldn't afford any of them but it all worked out in the end. It's all an adventure and I've never seen a hearse pulling a trailer. If it's a dream make it happen.
470 Mbogo

I think first you got to love hunting,second,you got to feel comfortable on dishing out the 20k or so required for a good hunt.folks this is 20k on a single piece of entertainment activity.also hunters want to do this every year.Not only do you need a good annual income,but you should have a net worth of about 5million at least.Sure you could pull such a thing off on a small salary,but Iam into sure and solid things.I would like to enjoy it at 100% while Iam at it without worrying about anything.

JBrown,Should the taxidermy cost more than the house you live in? Wouldn't a beautiful elephant mount be best suited in a home of a million or more,instead of someones garage? Imagine a big room with a tall ceiling,marble floor,expensive antiques,tables and bookshelves made out of the rarest woods,kick ass fireplace,and then the elephant head to compliment everything.This to me is reality,solid and sure.

Shootaway

Your last post really said it all. I personally don't hunt to gain possessions. I do my trophies as european mounts. My trophies are for my enjoyment only. I care not what others think about my trophies one way or the other.

quote:

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Should the taxidermy cost more than the house you live in?

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I would rather spend my money on another hunt instead of blowing it on expensive mounts. Taxidermy can cost as little or as much as you want to spend.

quote:

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Wouldn't a beautiful elephant mount be best suited in a home of a million or more,instead of someones garage?

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Having an elephant mount really says something about a person. I am leaving for an elephant hunt in five weeks. If I shoot one I will only bring back the tusks and maybe the skull. I would be willing to bet my lack of a million dollar home to display my tusks in will not tarnish the memory of this hunt in the years to come.

quote:

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Imagine a big room with a tall ceiling,marble floor,expensive antiques,tables and bookshelves made out of the rarest woods,kick ass fireplace,and then the elephant head to compliment everything.

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If you can make the kind of money to be able to some day afford this lavish set-up why not take a few hunts along the way? You seem driven by possessions and wealth, if that is the case more power to you but I would rather go hunting. The marble floors and rare wood will never bring the joy that a adventure will.

By the time you gain this wealth African hunting may be a thing of the past. What if you never hit your five million dollar goal? What happens if fate plays its hand and you end up on your death bed having never gone hunting in Africa, will you regret not having stopped to smell the roses? Will you look back with sadness on a life wasted on the pursuit of material possessions?

What if someday never comes?

Jason

I will still go to africa at least once.I am tempted just like everyone else.Maybe one day I'll have kids and take them along.

I agree with all of the reasons posted (except for the one on HIV and the crime issue, hey even Houston has areas of the city I wouldn't walk in without a BIG gun and the other, well, keep your pecker in your pants and you should be O.K.). I think the biggest reason is motivation. I have buddies who are excellent hunters, reloading and ballistic experts and darn good shots, who are "died in the wool" whitetail hunters. They spend more on their Brush Country leases then most of us would on a 7 or 10 day plains game hunt, but they wouldn't cross the street to shoot a 55" kudu. It's just the value they personally place on their priority trophies. AND this is O.K. In fact it's great! If everyone wanted to hunt Africa then prices would escalate. Why? Simple economics. More demand, less supply, increasing prices, more days required for "in demand" trophies! Hey, I ruined myself at a tender age reading Hemingway, Ruark, Capstick and I knew I HAD to hunt Africa! Since 1994, I've made 7 safaris and though I still hunt in Canada and the States for elk, mule deer, bear, caribou, etc. I always end up comparing my N.A. hunts to my African hunts and Africa always wins. Viva la difference!

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

I wanna hunt Africa, but like others said for young guys like me (23) just buying a house and getting married it's kind of hard, even on dual incomes. There is a lot to pay for, with a new-ish car and her going back to University part time, but we have a few trips planned. One: Mexico, Two: Hawaii, Three: South Africa. She wants to do a photo safari, I'm gonna go along with a nice ol' .375 and have myself a time. If you plan it right, budget and save where needed (quitting smoking has already paid off in ammo, guitar strings, race fuel for my Grand National and other more useful disposables) and are realistic about your expectations (obviously, it won't be the be-all-end-all trip) then just about anyone can do Africa. Although honestly, I pay under a hundred bucks for my whitetail hunt all told every year (even less for small game!), so there definately is a big cost difference for me!

For me it's the money.

Johan