Whats the typical band of range(distances) Sambar are taken at?

Would you be comfortable with:

7mm 160failsafe@2700 for up to 100yds.?

Havent personally hunted Sambar yet but from what I read ranges are from 20/30 paces to maybe 200/250 metres (depending on how far you want to shoot). Don't think you would have any problems with 160gn failsafes - they should work well.

I have not shot a Sambar myself,but a mate has shot 4 all under 100 yards 7mmX64 160gr Speer.

Most sambar are shot at relatively short ranges - up to around 100 yards. The terrain and bush, that they live in, preclude most long shots.

I like to use heavier bullets/calibres at moderate velocities (such as 9.3x62, 9.3x74R and .35 Whelan) but your 7mm Failsafe @ 2700 should be OK.

You should be good for at least 250 yards and probably 300 where the bullet should still have atleast 1500 ft lbs of energy left, personally though i'de not take a shot beyond 200 yards unless the perfect shot presented itself.

What cartridge are you using 7MM-08, 7x57???

If I was hunting sambar with my 7MM-08 i'de probably use the 160 grain accubond.

both me and a mate hunt sambar with 7mmRM i use 160gr woodlieghs and he uses 175 corelokt.
shots are very rarly over 100m unless you try some long accross gully shots.
personnally id go with a 175gr bullet
cant say iv used failsafes but cant say iv heard too many good reports about them either may be a bit too hard for sambar.
id go with a good quaility bullet like accubond woodlieghs grand slams even a corelokt will do the trick. as far as calibers 7mm would be the smallest id go many people steer to the other end with .35 whelan .350rem but unless your hunting off hounds when your going to be taking alot of running shots I dont think you need that much knock down power.

sambar1, i've been hunting them for 15 years without shooting a quality stag, so I feel when the chance finally comes to nail one, I like to think he can be dropped the spot, I would hate to loose one. 300win mag or bigger is my suggestion. I know they are not bullet proof, but they can run a fair way with a.270-.30/06 slug in them, and 100 meters is a long way in some of our bush where they live. remember 300kg for a a once in a life time trophy, that is usally running away from you, you need a bullet to make the journey through to the vitals.

quote:

I would hate to loose one. 300win mag or bigger is my suggestion

You still have to put the bullet in the right spot or they will still run a fair way regardless of what cartridge you are using.

Shot placement is much more important than raw power any day of the week.

lve been fortunate enough to take about a dozen samber and the average range for me has been about fifty to eighty metre , with twenty the closest and one hundred and twenty the furthest.l dont normally take running shot or long shots without a decent rest.Most of mine where taken with a 9.3x62mm and l couldnt happier with its performance.A7mm wouldnt be my first choice but if thats all l had l wouldnt hesitate to use it.Most samber that a chest shot will run about fifty metres no matter what calibre is used,generally they only drop on the spot if the spine is broken,of course there are always exceptions.

quote:

Most of mine where taken with a 9.3x62mm and l couldnt happier with its performance

I have just bought a Tikka in a 9.3 and hope to get down next season for a Sambar

thanks for the replies guys keep them coming... 338win/275gnAframe@2450 has also been in the back of my mind.

Only shot one sambar, but it was at about 80 yds, with a 375 H & H, and it ran about 50 yrds.

Haven't shot one yet but as 'DaggaBoyBuff 'suggested, when the time comes i wan't my 9.3 in my hands.I have Shot a lot of African game the size of sambar with a 9.3 and some of them i feel might have been lost with a smaller caliber, in particular a waterbuck I once shot with a high lung shot, we almost lost it after loosing the tracks and blood in heavy cover.

Along shot at a sambar would be 100yds, unless you have access to open farm land that fringes the scrub. Use anything from 30/06 to what ever takes your fancy. my longest shot was 70m running away, anchored with a 338win. your 7mm loading will be adequate.


cheers cc

In my spots, 100m is indeed a long shot. My favourite is my 375H&H, its light at 3.6kg ready to go. Next years toy I believe wil be the 358Win.
Cheers...
Con

Have only shot 1 sambar myself, with 416sw was about 250yds on private property, dropped on the spot, Woodleigh 410grn. Never did find the bullet was a down hill shot went high and hit the spine.
Mate of mine has shot over 100 and really dislikes the 7mm's says he has seen a lot lost but thinks the 270 is ok - must have been bullet construction I think rather than caliber.
He likes 30/06 and up, he is using a 300wsm at the moement.

I have used .270Win,.308Win,.303Brit and .30/06 and have seen mates use the above plus .444Mar and .338Win with several one shot kills your 7mm will be ok but I think .30/06 or bigger with heavy bullets 200 grains plus is the way to go. The best would be .338Win,.358Win,35 Whelan etc

Steve

the onley sambar that have dropped on the spot for me are those hit in the spine , the rest have ALL RUN, from 50-100 m and cant that 50-100m be a long way!!!!
daniel

quote:

Mate of mine has shot over 100 and really dislikes the 7mm's says he has seen a lot lost but thinks the 270 is ok

Well in answer to the original post( and i have taken more than a few hundred sambar) ...your 7mm mag will do you fine mate,dont take any notice of the 7mm put downs,i have been using my Mod 70 in 7mm rem mag for over 25 years with a lot of success and i basically have used 95% Winchester factory ammo too,very rarely is it a day when i have lost a sambar at all and i could NEVER EVER blame the calibre...bloody amazes me how fellas can spruke off about calibres being no good as in the above post as in "he has seen a lot lost" what a crock of pure shiit....maybe the person who has lost a lot should learn how to shoot and not blame his tools or maybe should stop pulling his own and if he really thinks the 270 is ok over the 7mm mag he has to be bloody kidding dosent he?

Hey Gryph, good to see you back mate

Bakesy i had to answer the thread mate..and i am coming up nth one day to do a bit of muddying with ya seeing as you wont come down here haha,ok dont bullshit me about the cold either

How about some photos?

Have a look at gryphs web site plenty of on pics there.

G'day, I have shot a few Sambar (not as many as Gryph, but a few!) and it really does depend on where you hunt. If you are in thick scrub, most of your shots will be close, with perhaps the opportunity for a long shot across a gully. If you hunt farm fringe country, it will be a mixed bag of ranges, some have been 15m, one was 250m (with a .338).
If you are careful about shot placement, there is no reason why a 7mmRM (with projectiles 160gr and up)will not do well.
Most of the people in the club use either a 270, 30-06 or 308. There is the odd 338 or 375, and stuff like my 7x57R and 9.3x62.
At the moment, my favourite is a Rem Mod 7 KS Custom Shop, in 350 Rem Mag. Weighs just 2.5kg, and is easy to carry all day, with plenty of 'oomph' at the other end.
If you place your shots carefully, your 7mm will do just fine.
And be sure to wave at all the people carrying elephant guns up and down those hills!

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum.

quote:

Originally posted by Sambar 9.3:
G'day, I have shot a few Sambar (not as many as Gryph, but a few!) and it really does depend on where you hunt. If you are in thick scrub, most of your shots will be close, with perhaps the opportunity for a long shot across a gully. If you hunt farm fringe country, it will be a mixed bag of ranges, some have been 15m, one was 250m (with a .338).
If you are careful about shot placement, there is no reason why a 7mmRM (with projectiles 160gr and up)will not do well.
Most of the people in the club use either a 270, 30-06 or 308. There is the odd 338 or 375, and stuff like my 7x57R and 9.3x62.
At the moment, my favourite is a Rem Mod 7 KS Custom Shop, in 350 Rem Mag. Weighs just 2.5kg, and is easy to carry all day, with plenty of 'oomph' at the other end.
If you place your shots carefully, your 7mm will do just fine.
And be sure to wave at all the people carrying elephant guns up and down those hills!

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum.

Dave (Sambar 9.3) i have to ask why you isolate the 7mmR as far as shot placement(above) when it is applicable to all calibres.You do go on to say about the most popular cals in your club and the way i read your post it seems that those cals are all ok but the 7 mmm hmmm? When the 7 mm outperforms those three cals that you mentioned (270 `06 `08) and i see you mention the 250 yard mark also well i have to tell you Dave that any sambar stag is not safe at 400 (if possible) let alone a measly 250 yard shot which incidentally a dedicated long term hunter usually will come up with more than a few times,espec across gully heads or even farm fringes....not an attack on you mate,just defending one of the best all round calibres for Aussie conditions.
OOPS what club are you in mate?

gryphon1, my remarks about shot placement were intended for ALL the calibers mentioned, not just the 7mmRM. If it came across that way, it was unintended. It was more aimed at the 'elephant gun' crowd, some of whom seem to think that sheer power downrange will make up for shot placement.
as for distances, 250m is my personal limit with either the 7x57 (which has about 60% of the downrange energy of a 7mmRM) or the 350RM. If you feel the need to blat away at critters at 400m, have fun! Since I do most of my hunting in farm fringe country (stalking from a wheelchair can be SUCH a pain!), I deliberately pass up ANY shots that I feel are not 100% certain. Lets face it, I cannot afford to have the deer move too far away from where it was hit. Hence my pushing the shot placement bit.
People who know me constantly comment on the shots I pass up. Why take the risk? I sure as hell can't walk over to follow a blood trail.
I agree with you, the 7mmRM is a fine caliber, well suited to the majority of Australian deerstalking conditions, with a capacity to carry energy to distance very well. But that does not mean I will not continue to push the careful shot placement approach.

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum
P.S, the 338WM is a whole lot better!

gryphon1
You are right just doesn't make sense, he is just going on what he has seen/been told about, don't think it was from personal experience, would have to ask.

Is all about placement and bullet contruction. Having said that I had a 270cal 130grn Nosler Partition fail to exit a Hog deer, the lead was squeezed out of the back - basically just jacket left.

I think from memory with the NZ cullers the 222rem was popular for the reds. Look at Bell with the 7mm and elephants, although hardly a reccomended calibre.

So gryphon1 what cal do you use?

quote:

Originally posted by gryphon1:
i have been using my Mod 70 in 7mm rem mag for over 25 years with a lot of success and i basically have used 95% Winchester factory ammo

There ya go 416sw

416sw, then why not ask?
you are correct, the 222Rem was popular among the NZ deercullers, but then so was the 243Win and the 303.
As for Bell, he was a phenominal shot, with an excellent knowledge of Elephant anatomy, and could reliably place his shots into the Ele's brain. Lots of people got squashed trying to emulate him.
I too have had failures with .270 Nosler Partitions. It happens, on occasion, with any projectile. Just another reason for careful shot placement.

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum

Thanks 350 missed that.

Sambar 9.3
I could ask, I know he had a 7mm at one stage, from the way he spoke it was hunting with others using 7mm. I almost regret responding to this thread, I was simply passing on what a experienced hunter had told me. I have a disagrement with him as to wether a bullet should leave the animal or not. I should have known better really I mean an argument over calibres is limitless on any quarie be it deer, rabbits, foxes etc. Calibre/cartridge for a particular animal is just to subjective, it's just to hard to repeat shot to shot results.
It's been a long time since I read Ken Pearce's book(may even remembered the name wrong) Walking Them Up (sorry if this is a miss quote but I think I have the jist right)think he prob said it best "use as much gun as you are comfortable with". I mean a 375 would be a good reccomendation as a sambar cal, but useless if you are scared of pulling(sqeezing) the trigger and before anyone starts yes i'm sure a lot have been shot with a .22lr and prob more with a 30cal than any other.

Should have answered Woodjack's Q first up, Answer: me yes - would it be my prefered cal no.

416sw, that old arguement over complete penetration VS projectile just under the skin on the far side will not end until the sun finally cools down. I personally prefer good expansion, and complete penetration ON A SIDE ON SHOT. I will settle for less on a going away shot but will reject any cartridge/projectile combo that will not at least reach the chest cavity from the rear on aspect. Or I will pass up that shot.
You got Ken's book right, but I had to laugh at one of his comments (not in the book, in person!) "if you can't handle a 458, you shouldn't be hunting!" Easy for him, he's about three axe handles across at the shoulders!
Me, stuck in a chair, or on sticks, well I have had to tone it down a bit. The 7x57R is about it for me now, so I pick my shots carefully.
Hopefully get another few years before I have to drop to a 243, and forget about Sambar altogether.
I still think the 7mmRM will do the trick on Sambar, lots of guys use it, it seems to work fine.
The tip about using as much gun as you are comfortable with is the best one I can think of. If you are happy with a 338, use one. If a 416RM is tolerable, use it!
The sad fact is that most peoples (occasional shooters, guys who might fire 1 box of ammo a year) recoil tolerance is reached at about the 30-06 level. Then we start to get into the flinch territory. Hell, for some people, a 243 kicks a lot.
A 7mm is a good choice. If it's a 7x57, a 280 Rem, or a 7mmWSM or Rem Mag, they are all good.

Don't hold back if you think you can add to a thread, the new guys need all the help they can get! How many times have you been bullshitted to in a gunshop when you were starting out?
I know I was!

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum

quote:

reach the chest cavity from the rear on aspect. Or I will pass up that shot.

Absolutely agree on that one S9.3 i have let more than a few stags go as i wasnt confident of a sure kill shot end on..it hurts remembering these times as i often wonder what if? as in should i have taken the shot or not... but i still invariably come back to a peaceful mind as i dont have an unfound wounded or dead stag on my hands as opposed to the " geezuz its a stag lets blaze away brigade" that might have.
I do have a such a thing from the past though ...a stag i lost in the `Gatta a few years ago,no it wasnt an arse shot more a miss hit 3/4 on,none the less it is a real hurt to lose a sambar let alone a stag.
With the 400 yard thing it was more so pointing out that the distance is well within the performance realms of the 7mm rem mag than actually doing it though if EVERYTHING was right i would take such a shot ie a still animal, nil or little wind either end (leaves moving around target as indicator etc) a good comfortable rest,clear vision and so on.
Some of those other 7mm`s mentioned above do not have comparable qualities re f/pounds etc either i must add blah blah blah....

quote:

The sad fact is that most peoples (occasional shooters, guys who might fire 1 box of ammo a year) recoil tolerance is reached at about the 30-06 level. Then we start to get into the flinch territory. Hell, for some people, a 243 kicks a lot.
A 7mm is a good choice. If it's a 7x57, a 280 Rem, or a 7mmWSM or Rem Mag, they are all good.

Absolutely spot on there mate.

I would not feel undergunned on sambar launching a 160 grain accubond or simular bullet from my 7mm-08 at around 2700 fps, provided a reasonable opportunity for shot placement presented its self.

In my oppinion far too many shooters rely on the power of their super magnum taking the animal out rather than placing the bullet in a vital area.

If you cant put the first bullet into a vital spot on the animal it makes little difference how powerful the cartridge you are using is.

quote:

if you cant handle a 458,you shouldn't be hunting!

Well that does sound like something Ken would say but im sure he would of been saying it tongue in cheek,l know we live in a politicly correct world but surely we can still have a bit of a joke now and then ,cant we?
lf anyone is interested Ken is currently working on the last chapter of an updated version of 'Walking Them Up',this Sunday is his dead line.lt should be available before mid next year.

quote:

Originally posted by Sambar 9.3:
The sad fact is that most peoples (occasional shooters, guys who might fire 1 box of ammo a year) recoil tolerance is reached at about the 30-06 level. Then we start to get into the flinch territory. Hell, for some people, a 243 kicks a lot.

I believe a lot of recoil tolerance is a learned thing, and also an accumulative thing.

I started with a .222 and then later a .30-06. To be honest I thought the .30-06 kicked a bit and didn't like it a lot . I did shoot hundreds of rounds through it.

Then I bought a .375 H&H and it did kick. Eventually I learned not to wear just a T-shirt on the bench. BUT the key point is the .30-06 became a pussy cat.

Next was a .450 NE and again the .375 doesn't bother me much. My new 9.3x74R feels like a .22.

So I'm planning to jump ahead a bit and get a .577 NE. That should fix them all (the brain cells that is).

I've only made a couple of sambar sojourns. I think for a 'flatlander' a light rifle is better than a heavy calibre one, but my 9.3mm double will probably make the journey anyway. It isn't too heavy.


Gryph

"hundreds of sambar" - what did you do with all the meat?!

quote:

believe a lot of recoil tolerance is a learned thing, and also an accumulative thing.

hit the nail on the head John.

hollis, yeah, I'm pretty sure Ken was kidding, but you know him, he does it with such a straight face, you can never tell!
I look forward to getting a copy of his latest edition. The old one was (and is) a damn good read.
NitroX, some people here just don't do enough shooting to learn to tolerate the larger bores. one or two boxes a year just isn't enough.
I was lucky, I got started off with the .22, and gradually worked up through the centerfires till the 416 RM was no problem. Then the injury, now a 7x57 is about it for me.
That's O.K, I can live with those limitations. But I have seen an awful lot of guys buy a 300 or 338 mag as their first CF, screw on a scope, and go hunting. And then wonder why they devlope a flinch. But, that's Vic, where the principle big game critter is the Sambar. Other states are no doubt far different.
I still feel that the average guy is better served by the 270, 30-06 or similar, practising a lot, and picking his shots. Then maybe getting a bigger bore as the recoil tolerance developes.

Cheers, Dave.
Non Illegitium Carborundum

[QUOTE]Originally posted by NitroX:

I've only made a couple of sambar sojourns. I think for a 'flatlander' a light rifle is better than a heavy calibre one, but my 9.3mm double will probably make the journey anyway. It isn't too heavy.


That's O.K, NitroX, you'll be the one carrying it, I plan on being in a treestand just downwind from a wallow.

Cheers, Dave.

quote:

Originally posted by Sambar 9.3:
I still feel that the average guy is better served by the 270, 30-06 or similar, practising a lot, and picking his shots. Then maybe getting a bigger bore as the recoil tolerance developes.

I agree 100%.

I do not believe a new shooter should buy anything that kicks more than a .30-06 as their first centrefire medium bore rifle. Unless they are big or well built, even then.

I don't see why a .270, .308 or .30-06 shouldn't last a lifetime of sambar hunts.

quote:

Gryph

"hundreds of sambar" - what did you do with all the meat?!

John in answer, thats over close to 30 years of it all and with deer hunting including with a hound team,meat often dosent go far at all,when hunting its generally with "the fellas" and dont worry mate there are always hands that are put out when a deer go`s down often a bloody lot that dont actually hunt too....geez i remember times when a bloke was lucky to get a good roast or two when the carve up was done...anyone worth his salt shouldnt have too many problems nailing a doz deer a year if need be..its the big stags that take some doing mate hahaha and i`m still learning as of last week when i was beaten again (by a spikey too)