It is indeed a sad indictment that we appear to be split even within our own sports. I too, also see it here and on other UK sites where one persons opinions and experiences are not respected, just because they are outside the box.

FB, you may well be right in the fact that Shooting is next on the list of sports to hear the bell toll, I sincerly hope you are wrong and will do all I can to continue practicing the sports I love and have done since formative years.

Instead of bickering and in-fighting, there should be a coignetive approach formulated by all the sporting organisations, so that our sports can be presented, represented and moved forwards for the greater good of all concerned - and for those yet to try them.

In these "enlightened" times of diversity, one is expected to respect the values and traditions of everyone - why are our sports targeted by the minority that seeks to control the majority?

Rant Over

I know there are many out there that feel the same way as us but human nature and the break down of standards in this country as a whole are contributing factors to how people behave towards one another in this case other shooters. clubs can be a problem wildfowling clubs especialy so,in many no one as a good word for any one else and they are mostly on a selfish one upmanship trip and they dont care how mutch bother they cause. it is often like a its a knockout contest where who can we cause trouble for this week? every meeting brings yet more bother that is not bother realy they just need to grow up but wont the love trouble, and if they shut the foreshores in scotland clubs willl take over and we will have all the trouble up there too. thats my rant

Dear All

Trying to get a united front in the world of UK hunting and shooting is like trying to herd cats. Just see if you can get a bunch of pheasant shooters and deer stalkers to work together without argument. I sit on a hunt committee and shoot fur and feather and the lack of understanding is quite vast. This lack of cohesion makes us easy prey of the anti.
What I did find interesting was the opposite state of affairs when I hunted with my cousin in Germany. Yes they have hunting exams and state interference compared to the UK but by forcing everyone to know and understand the other groups activities I felt there was less antagonism and more respect and open pride in their traditions and heritage
I personally would like to see more regulation in Firearm training after a novice on a shoot last week shot a hole in the ground next to the shoot captains foot.I would also like to see that the FLO's also have to sit the same qualifications and show competance in firearms use and safety. These new rules could be voluntary and apply to new applications only. In the military I got lots of firearms training on safety but hey thats my presonal opinion.
I dont expect the strong individualism we Brits have in our culture will ever change, this was made apparant when I offered to do a talk to the local BASC and BDS groups on deer dogs and cold scenting wounded game. Apparantly it would be too difficult to organise and anyway no-one ever misses or loses a shot animal so no need to extend the knowledge base.
We live in interesting times.

Regards

Mark

Andy,

I agree completely with what you say and I don't say we are on the way out. what I do think is that shooting will come under attack from the bqack door. Via game rearing, lead shot and competence exams, and probabbly some stuff we haven't even seen yet...

I recently got told by my FLO not to send in an application for my dads FAC until he has got DSC1.. when I explained "tactfully" that this was not a legal requirement and wasn't grounds for refusal I was told thhey don't care. I offered to sponsor him for a year but they told me that even though in most cases this is acceptable not now. Apparently because he is my dad I was not trustworthy enough to vouch for him although I could vouch for Joe bloggs on the street!!! So here is what I do. I submit the application and if they refuse it then they can put their reasons in writing and I will deal with it from there onwards.. every time someone capitulates to these requests a precedent is set for the nextman making entry to our sport more difficult.

Joining the shooting organisations together is the best way to help protect all aspects of our sport IMHO. Game to eat has been a huge success for the CA and is now well established. Instead of joining together BASC has now launched its own "Game's On" campaign... I'm not trying to just bbyatch about BASC, but sometimes they need their heads banging together.

Anyway enough ranting abboutmy favourite hate!!

It's the weekend I am on a mission!!

Laters,

FB

We dont want any tests at all look at the dmg a waste of time gained nothing from it at all. the basc want to stop the fire arms laws changeing any more full stop, whats the point in certs for this that and the other when guns are baned. We dont want educating we want protecting from them and bowing to preasure to train is thair way of triming numbers only every one believes them and wnt see common sence.

Dear Stag Wolf

You may be one of the many who has been brought up with firearms and taught how to use one safely and how to identify and kill whatever species of beast you wish humanly.
At present in theory all a new firearms applicant needs to shoot an animal is adeqate suitable land. He/she may not have a clue about about anything else, they may just like killing for all I know. After last weeks negligent discharge of a shotgun on a shoot would you in theory like to explain to the next of kin that the shotgun owner had never been shown how to shoot a shotgun safely.
I am not a wilting lily when it come to my rights to own a firearm but I have seen what happens when a bullet hits an innocent civilian.
This country is full of 'bleeding heart detached meat is from Tescos pain in the arses.'
The shooting community needs to be proactive and coordinated and yes the DSC/DMQ taught me nothing about firearms but if you have it there is one less bit of ammunition you give the anti lobby. Stamping our feet and saying its not fare will make zero difference. I feel quite strongly that attack is the only form of defence and we have to beat the govt by being one step ahead of the game. BASC should have been more active with the other field sports organisations much earlier in relation to the Hunting Ban but this is the stubborn attitude that prevades all sectors of the field sports community ( just listen to a the fishing fraternity at the moment).

I'm mature aged and coming up on middle aged. Saying that, I view myself as a young shooter hunter when comparing myself to the median age of shooters and gun owners. Recently I was at a more prestigious gun shop and the owner looked me in the eyes and told me that my generation are going to get all the best quality guns for next to nothing. All I had to do was just out live the baby booming generation. As that generation starts to pass away, generally all their next of kin have no use for guns so they will go up for sale. Supply and demand will kick in and the prices will drop like a rock because the young generation has been socially conditioned that guns and hunting are unnecessary or even evil. This is further aggravated by negative experiences the young generation receives when they attempt to join a local club where they are ostracised for just being new to the sport and inducted with factional inter club politics not to mention infighting with the other shooting disciplines. I’ve seen this short sightedness turn some our new much needed future members sour towards the sports. Why not we all try and give the next generation some good experiences to start off on and show them a unified front.

Point to remember, “divide and conquer†has been one of the most effective methods to win battles and wars for as long as history has recorded and if you look at nature, that is how predators single out and take down there prey… Now are we going to be the hunters in this of the prey???

Mark,

You are right in as much as THEORETICALLY the qualifications should give us a better defense.

A couple of years ago I stopped taking out paying guests on my shoot because of the level of incompetence amongst the customers. I was just supplementing the lease money rather than a business while I was on Sabbatical for a year, playing gamekeeper.

Beleive it or not my worst experienceswere with DSC hoders that were relatively new to the sport. What I decided on was that the biggest danger was "Buck Fever", something that no matter how well you shoot on a weekend course at paper you need to conquer through experience. Under these situations Identicfication/selection went out of the window and shots werre taken where I had reccomended they waited. These incidents were my first 2 customers that had open FAC's and DSC 1&2 respectively. The latter is now a published jurnalist in the shooting press and when I read his article a few weeks back I nearly fell off my chair!!!

Anyway my point is that although there is merit in the training in the classroom the most invluable point I can think of is the Apprenticeship. That is why I have no problem with the restriction on a new FAC holder that they must go out accompanied for their first year or so of owning a rifle. An experienced stalker will be able to calm a novice and guide the situation to a favourable conclusion. In this way confidence is built and the lessons learnt are much more valuable.

Just my Tuppenth,
TSFK as FB

Here we are boys, hows this for a foxing rifle? caliber? .223rem. what more do you need.
Pete

Dear Former Stalker Known as FallowBuck

I agree with you whole heartedly with the apprentice system. I sort of do the same thing with friends initially by putting them in a high seat where the deer activity is quite low and watch how they handle the firearm and situation before we move to the more deery areas.
If it make you feel better I have been out 8 time in the past 2 weeks and not managed to shoot a single fallow ( seen 2-30 per outing ) but they are either in unsafe positions, too far, behind the high seat or spot you at 250 yards trough the trees as the undergrowth has now collapsed. Next desperate trick is to sit down with a tripod and ambush the beasties.
Waidmannnsheil to your future success.

Regards

Mark