What kinda accuracy are you getting with yours? what is good for a 17?

I own 3 of them..

Bought a Marlin when they first came out..
it is a tack driver...

then bought a NEF, single shot.. paid $99.00 for it at Bi Mart..its even more of a tack driver..

finally picked up a Ruger 77/17 Heavy Barrel..
nice trigger, isn't as accurate as the NEF but is as accurate as the Marlin, which is a good accomplishment..

my resistance of singing its praises tho, has been ammo costs..

if I was not a hand loader, I'd probably love it all the more..

but since I am, I think it is spendy to shoot..and I can load up a 223, to do more, for a lot less.. with as good or better accuracy..
this is important especially on high volume shooting..

20 boxes of ammo cost more than I originally paid for the Marlin..and 500 rounds or 10 boxes cost more than I paid for the NEF..

It has its place, but that space is better filled by my 223s instead...

Savage L/H Heavy Barrel.

Accuracy is very good. On a calm day it will pretty much shoot <1" @ 100 meters (108 yards) - effects of wind are pretty detrimental on the accuracy, just depends on if you're shooting in in a breeze or a gale.

Like, Seafire I'm not enamoured with the cost of it's ammo though.

I also have a Marlin 917v. Accurate, 1.5" at 120 yards, but again very susceptible to wind deflection.

my cz is good for about an inch, my win 1885 is about the same, however what i use more is the mach 2 auto from magnum research because of the ammo cost. mach 2 ammo is less than half of hmr and if you keep your eyes open can be bought for 3-4 a box

I have a Savage Heavy barrel and it shoots 1-1.25 at 100 yds. My buddy has the Fancy thumbhole/stainless Savage and it shoots consistent clover leafs at 100. Its pretty incredible. My Savage absolutely prefers the Federal Speer TNT's. It doesn't shoot the polymer tips well at all. i chose the Savage for the accutrigger. My father has the Marlin and the trigger is absolutely terrible. He also had terrible problems w/ the extractor in his. But it shoots well.

I bought the first heavy barreled Marlin available in VA way back when! I still own it. It still shoots consistent 5 shot groups into ridicoulously small patterns after approximately 4200 rounds down the tube. When they first were announced I figured they'd be copper fouling little P.I.A.'s to clean! Not the case! I have yet to find a spot of "blue" on a patch after Sweet's 7.62 copper remover! Just doesn't happen! Accuracy stays with the round after repeated, no cleaning, lengthy shooting sessions. I run a patch or Hoppe's # 9 through the bore every 600 shots or so whether the accuracy is falling off or not!! The Marlin booklet that comes with the rifles says, "You may not need to clean the bore". They were right but a lot of 17 caliber cleaning rods were sold because of the 17HMR!!
To date I have owned or set up for others, 38 different rifles in 17HMR. They have been Marlins, Savages, CZ's Rugers, NEF's and even owned one Remington in 597(they are subject to a recall now and Remington is offering paltry sums for returning them considering their initial cost!!) and ALL OF THEM have delivered less than 1", 5 shot groups at 100 yards! They are the most consistent, accurate, short range varminters(100-180 yards) ever devised!! And you don't have to pick up brass and reload!!
I know that you can probably load 50 rounds of 223 or 222 or 222 Mag or even the 17 centerfires for near equal cost but just for pure shooting fun, the 17HMR is the most amazing thing utilizing smokeless powder and polymer tipped bullets ever developed!! Long live the 17HMR!! If nothing else, it caused the ammo companies to develope 22Magnum ammo that can be counted on to deliver acceptable accuracy and killing efficiency(Hornady's 30 grain loading with Vmax's and Remington's 33 grain loading). They knew without doing something the 22 Magnum would be relegated to obscurity within a very short timeframe! My thoughts and those would be hard to convince otherwise! BTDT for a while!! GHD

I have a Savage (left Hand) which I love! 100yard groups can be covered with a dime.

In Africa, I have shot tons of rabbit, an Impala, Steenbuck, and a few Vervet monkeys.

I only use the 20gr Hornady's. I wish someone would make a bonded bullet for it.

My hunting buddy and I bought Savages a few years ago, before the accu-trigger. His is righthanded, mine is lefthanded. I did trigger jobs on both and glass bedded them. Both shoot sub-one-inch groups at 100yds. Both have ammo preferences, but shoot the 17gr better than the 20gr.
As has been stated, the sheer enjoyment of shooting them is the biggy. We hunt prairie dogs most of the late spring and summer. Even though the cost of the ammo is high, we save time and never have to worry about running out on a trip.

Have any of you ever install a brake on your 17's? I'm not suggesting I need one, but I think that with one, the barrel wouldn't even budge.
Wonder if anyone makes a bolt-on like they have for AR-15 type rifles? If they do, I would like to give it a try.

quote:

In Africa, I have shot tons of rabbit, an Impala, Steenbuck, and a few Vervet monkeys.

I have never had the desire to go to africa..

however if I found myself in africa, I can not think of anything more fun that riding in the back of a LandRover, with a 223 and stopping to nail monkeys out of a tree every now and then..

I've got a Sako Quad hunter. The 17HMR is so much fun to shoot I've never even zeroed the .22mag barrel. It shoots honest 100 yard half inch groups on a still day. I couldn't be happier with it.

The 17mach2 is lots of fun too. ZERO recoil impulse.

Seafire,

Funny you say that, since I have had some of my best times in Africa doing just that! Not with monkeys but baboons, guinea hens, rabbits, springhares, etc with small bore rifles. If you have a like-minded PH, you can literally kill hundreds. The native staff like the meat as well and get a kick watching you do it.

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:

quote:

In Africa, I have shot tons of rabbit, an Impala, Steenbuck, and a few Vervet monkeys.

I have never had the desire to go to africa..

however if I found myself in africa, I can not think of anything more fun that riding in the back of a LandRover, with a 223 and stopping to nail monkeys out of a tree every now and then..

My first HMR was built on a Martini Cadet action, with a GM .920 fluted stainless barrel. Reamer was purchased from Pacific Tool and Gauge. This rifle puts 20gr. Vmax's into 3/8" to 5/8" (5 shot groups 100 meters) depending on the breeze. Wind will open groups to almost an inch, but one can hold for that. It doesn't like the TNT bullets, 17gr. nore 20gr
Second HMR is a marlin bolt gun that puts 17gr. Vmax's into 5/8" at 100 meters. The Marlin has a 6-18X scope,while the Martini sports a 6.5-20X. We use our hummers for gophers (Columbia Ground Squirrels) from 50yards to 240 yards, then the small case centrefire .17's for 200 to 450 yards. 450yds. is farthest shots we have to make in the area we hunt, either prone off bipods or from a bench set up on the quad. With accuracy capable of head shots at 200 yards, the HMR is an incredible rimfire, however ammo costs are about the same as loading for my .17AHornet and .17ABee.
A big plus is being able to see every hit- same as with the little cased centre-fires.

quote:

If you have a like-minded PH, you can literally kill hundreds.

What constitutes a 'varmint' is more a social construct as opposed to a biological reality in this case. Sure primates can be a nuisance and as kids we shot a few to 'control' them. As an adult I got over this desire to whack everything that moved. Shooting large numbers of a species like guinea fowl is illegal and a sure sign that a PH is greedy, not to mention ecologically illiterate and ethically bunkrupt.

Sorry to rain on that parade, not my intention to enter an argument, but killing 'hundreds' of small game is poor conservation management IMO.

Kayaker,

Good point, and I cannot disagree with you on that as I think you would be correct if this occured on a fenced-in game farm like you have there in South Africa. I should have added that although we did kill lots of rabbits,springhare, guinea's, etc, it was done over the course of 14 days and more importantlt, on a HUGE wilderness area of over 200 square miles...not a fenced-in game farm area where you would be descimating an entire population. If you factor the huge area combined with the high rate at which rabbits breed, I don't think that our actions had any negative impact at all.

As for my PH being greedy...I don't think so! We did not pay anything to shoot small game and it was all greatly appreciated by the trackers and staff.

Looking back on my origional post, I did not mean the word "Tons" to be taaken literally. I did shoot alot of small game though....

In central Otago, New Zealand, it is not unusual in late spring to have an explosion of 1/3 - 1/2 grown rabbits. (Explosion may be a poor choice of words although a 35gn Berger 20cal bullet at 3700fps from my 20VarTarg can certainly cause an explosion) I know of shoots where over 600 rabbits were taken in a nights shooting by the rabbit board in an ateampt to control - eradicate them
Initially a friend used a 17hmr but there is a breeze blowing more often than not and found he was limited by this althougn a still day shot might reach out to 160m. He sold it on and built a 20VarTarg as well when he saw how efective the 20 was.

Von Gruff.

Marlin 17v 1/2 MOA at 100 yards.

Mine is a Cooper M57. It is deadly. I've confirmed kills on pd's out to 287yds providing it is a calm day.

Dukxdog,

I see from your avitar that you have killed an Elephant, yet you still get enjoyment from shooting p-dogs! Same here...I don't think that anything in my hunting life will ever come close to killing my Leopard, but I still do enjoy my small game hunting.

BTW....287 yards is a hell of a shot with a 17, and I'm surprised that that little bullet is still lethal at that range. I was shooting my 17 at 250 yds and I could clearly see the copper-colored streaks hit the target...pretty cool.

Early Marlin, maybe the most accurate rifle I have to 50 yards an absolute tack driver!

quote:

Originally posted by Leopardtrack:
Dukxdog,

I see from your avitar that you have killed an Elephant, yet you still get enjoyment from shooting p-dogs! Same here...I don't think that anything in my hunting life will ever come close to killing my Leopard, but I still do enjoy my small game hunting.

BTW....287 yards is a hell of a shot with a 17, and I'm surprised that that little bullet is still lethal at that range. I was shooting my 17 at 250 yds and I could clearly see the copper-colored streaks hit the target...pretty cool.

Like you guys, even after three trips to Africa, I am still a PD shooter 1st and foremost. My buddy ChopperGuy shot a prairie dog at a lasered 287 yards with his 17HMR.

Our favorite type of prairie dog shooting is walking the towns with our 17HMR R93's, 500 shots a day is the norm.

Like SeaFire, if I had time to reload, I could do it cheaper. I see the 17HMR as a rimfire version of the 22 Hornet/218Bee class of cartridges. Not really capable of killing the larger animals like the centerfires, but good cheap fun without the handloading time issues.

Dave Funk
www.CongressNeedsFunk.com

Being from New York, I have not had the chance yet to shoot PD's, but I would love to do it one day! Where do you fellas go? I have no idea how to go about it....do you use a guide?

quote:

Originally posted by f224:

quote:

Originally posted by Leopardtrack:
Dukxdog,

I see from your avitar that you have killed an Elephant, yet you still get enjoyment from shooting p-dogs! Same here...I don't think that anything in my hunting life will ever come close to killing my Leopard, but I still do enjoy my small game hunting.

BTW....287 yards is a hell of a shot with a 17, and I'm surprised that that little bullet is still lethal at that range. I was shooting my 17 at 250 yds and I could clearly see the copper-colored streaks hit the target...pretty cool.

Like you guys, even after three trips to Africa, I am still a PD shooter 1st and foremost. My buddy ChopperGuy shot a prairie dog at a lasered 287 yards with his 17HMR.

Our favorite type of prairie dog shooting is walking the towns with our 17HMR R93's, 500 shots a day is the norm.

Like SeaFire, if I had time to reload, I could do it cheaper. I see the 17HMR as a rimfire version of the 22 Hornet/218Bee class of cartridges. Not really capable of killing the larger animals like the centerfires, but good cheap fun without the handloading time issues.

Dave Funk
www.CongressNeedsFunk.com

quote:

Like SeaFire, if I had time to reload, I could do it cheaper. I see the 17HMR as a rimfire version of the 22 Hornet/218Bee class of cartridges. Not really capable of killing the larger animals like the centerfires, but good cheap fun without the handloading time issues.

ya know Dave,

out in Lakeview, shooting sage rats, I watched a couple of locals out there shoot sage rats out to 300 yds with 17 HMRs and pretty consistently..

of course the sage rats never saw it coming...

these guys had a Marlin heavy barrel, and a Savage heavy barrel...

they both were using some old Redfield 6 x 24 varmint scope with some sort of range compensating reticle... they were saying the scopes were something along the lines of early 1980s vintage....
some folks would be impressed with the 17 HMR being able to do that...

myself tho.. I was impressed with ability of that old Redfield Scope... small target at that distance.. wind potentially blowing a light bullet all over the place...

but these two old boys were nailing those things with the first shot about 80% of the time..

goes to show, the right optics and knowing how to apply its capabilities, can really add a whole new fun dimension on the HMR..and the highly overlooked 22 mag as well...

with the polymer tipped technology applied to the 22 Mag, with 30 and 33 grain bullets, it takes on a whole another dimension in both fun and capabilities..

my bad, but I just get away from that red mist addiction tho... so out comes the 223s again..

I buddy of mine left his NEF with me when he went over seas for a few years. He also left a bunch of federal ammo.

I haven't been impressed at all with it or the ammo. 2 inchs at 100. Shot some cotton tails with at around 60 yards(depending what part of the garden they are in). Had many of them run off after good soild hits. Wacked a crow with it at 167 the crow hopped a couple of times after a good soild body hit.

Ammo to high price doesn't kill nearly as well as I like. ( could be the brand of ammo).

I well never buy one for myself for some reasons I don't own a 22 mag I can load better and cheaper ammo for any of my center fire 224s.

Checking up on posts so I will respond.
1) Leopardtrack.......putting a "suppressor" on a 17HMR defies the laws of physics! They work even with the 'more than twice the speed of sound' velocities of the 17HMR. Different than a suppressed 22 but it does work! Try it sometime!
2)kayaker.........you are raining on the parade! Varmints is varmints!! They reproduce faster than the surrounding "earthoshere" can support them and need to be kept in check! i am not a fan of poisoning or other methods od "humane" reduction in numbers but hunting(or shooting as it would seem in a PD field or ground quirrel or sage rat) would seem to be acceptable. As far as shooting the troublesome monkeys in South Africa(baboons and other such)I don't think that the shooting will ever render them to the ranks of "threatened" on the greenie list!
3)Seafire...You and I have these discussions before. The 17HMR is a legitimate accuracy nut and an absolute head turner in it's abilities!! I don't recommend it for 200 yard shots to the ill appropiated (knowledge of ballistics) rifleman but to a legitimate long range shooter, the 17HMR can perform!! Head and neck shots are called for and the accuracy of the round (inherent it seems!!)calls for adequate glass to acheive the results!
4)p dog shooter.............Center mass shots are not acceptable with any caliber or chambering! The reason you have experienced crawl-offs is that you or you guides or your buddies have told you to "hold in the middle of him" and shoot!! Results would have been the same with any caliber you chose! I have seen more crawl-offs on groundhogs using the 30 calibers where people thought they "we're shooting a 308 or 30-06 or any variant" of 30 calibers and hold center mass!! There are only 2 exceptions to this "rule of center mass" I have ever witnessed...........the tried and true varminter.......22-250 and GOD'S CHOSEN CHAMBERING.....25-06!!
I'm a fan of the 17HMR! I'm a fan of the .172 centerfires, .224's and 6mm's and the .257's. Have some respect for the vermin and go afield with a rifle capable of accuracy provided the person behind the rifle is somewhat capable of accuracy themselves!! Charlie (GHD)

I use a supressed (not muzzle brake!)cz 452 17hmr. Very good long range bunny gun, around 1"@100yds. With the supressor the neighbours don't notice the noise so much as I use it for fox control in very built up areas.

Martini W/GM barrel - loves 17gr. Vmaxs any make. Will manage 1" to 1 1/4" groups with TNT's which it doesn't like.
3/8" to 5/8" with Vmax's.

Marlin - steel barrel - 1/2" to 3/4" with 17gr. Vmax's, 2" with 20gr. HP's- YUK!

I use either rifle for head and chest shots on our gophers to 200 meters, and the .17Marlin for a walk-around gopher gun as having 5 clips full, helps keep my kill rate up. My buddy got his right cateracts fixed and the Martini single shot is too slow now that he can see.

I've posted this before but to me at least it exemplifies what an accurate HMR is like.
This happened in I believe the second year after the HMR came out. I bought a CZ Varmint and mounted a 6X20 Weaver Grand Slam on it as well as installing Eric Brooks trigger kit.
On a particularly fine spring morning at the range I shot 9 "consecutive" 5 shot groups at 100 yards that agg'd a .72. The smallest was in the .4's and the largest was about a 1.2 inch-ish group as memory serves.
Granted conditions were fantastic and I was having a good personal day but still and all for a rifle I paid somewhere around $350.00 for to shoot like that amazed the snot outta me,still does.
Sad to tell that particular rifle has been claimed by my beloved bride for her personal popper and I had to buy an Anschutz, two actually , ones a bolt handgun.
I love the round! It's like an HO scale .17 Ackley Hornet.
Howdy Daryl, is this the Daryl I think it is??

quote:

Originally posted by seafire/B17G:
...they both were using some old Redfield 6 x 24 varmint scope with some sort of range compensating reticle... they were saying the scopes were something along the lines of early 1980s vintage....
some folks would be impressed with the 17 HMR being able to do that...

myself tho.. I was impressed with ability of that old Redfield Scope... small target at that distance.. wind potentially blowing a light bullet all over the place...

but these two old boys were nailing those things with the first shot about 80% of the time..

goes to show, the right optics and knowing how to apply its capabilities, can really add a whole new fun dimension on the HMR..and the highly overlooked 22 mag as well...

Seafire, I have one of those scopes on my 6mm Rem. I picked it up for a trade on a 3X9 Simmons several years back.
I figure I paid nothing for the Simmons as it came with a rifle that was already priced below it's value...

The guy told me the AO did not work and he needed a scope that would work on his 30'06 so I traded him (he was tickled). I sent it back to the Redfield repair place in Florida (can't remember the name off hand) and for I believe $70 they completely went through it and gave me a 2-year warranty.

That scope is amazing. The clicks are precise and repeatable, optics are excellent, it must have been built before things were "new and improved....". Or as I like to say, "MADE IN CHINA BY THE LOWEST BIDDER."

Never overlook older "vintage" scopes when you find them. They can be rebuilt and most are made better than scopes costing MANY HUNDREDS of dollars now.

quote:

Originally posted by montdoug:
Sad to tell that particular rifle has been claimed by my beloved bride for her personal popper and I had to buy an Anschutz, two actually , ones a bolt handgun.

You poor guy!
I'm sure the doctor told you to, "Take TWO Anschutz and call me in the morning..."

Belly laugh on that one Flippy!

quote:

Seafire, I have one of those scopes on my 6mm Rem. I picked it up for a trade on a 3X9 Simmons several years back.
I figure I paid nothing for the Simmons as it came with a rifle that was already priced below it's value...

yeah Flippy, it will be interesting to see what Leupold is going to do with Redfield now that they own it..

I am also looking at some of these scopes that one never heard of, but can provide a good value with a lot of features, for a decent price..

of course I put different values on a scope going on a rimfire than I do one going on an 06..

some of these like Hammers, Muellers etc are worth a look see..

of course BSA and Barska are off the list right off.. although I did see a new 4 x 16 BSA Contender that looked pretty darn interesting at the sportsmans whorehouse in Medford..

At 50 yards it seems like I can put a box though my CZ Trainer on 12x magnification in about a quarter size group without missing the 10 ring, but we always have at least a light breeze and my 100 yard groups are typically terrible. It's purpose in life is to kill ground squirrels and it does that very well out to about 100 yards. I've hit rabbits at 175 yards and crows at about 125 with nice lethal results. And it is tough to beat for a neighborhood gun - with the 17 grain plastic tips you almost can't get it to ricochet.

I love shooting mine.

I don't fret ammo cost because I use several different rifles while sage rat shooting. When digger shooting there isn't the volume issue.

Mine is a converted Ruger 77.22mag.
I added a Green Mt blued, heavy fluted .17HMR barrel. I simply sanded out the barrel channel to fit.
Accuracy, to date, is superb.

The scope is a Nikon 4.5x14 side focus and the trigger is just under 1#.

It's a neat little rig.

quote:

Originally posted by Flippy:

quote:

Originally posted by montdoug:
Sad to tell that particular rifle has been claimed by my beloved bride for her personal popper and I had to buy an Anschutz, two actually , ones a bolt handgun.

You poor guy!
I'm sure the doctor told you to, "Take TWO Anschutz and call me in the morning..."

I have a CZ 452 Varmint rifle in 17 HMR.
Did a trigger job, and the rifle shoots!!!!

BTW- Green Mountain .17 HMR barrels rock. Years ago, just after being bitten by the bug, I entered a 50 yard Bench Rest match for rimfires, winning it with my little Martini and it's 18 1/8" bl. It gets 2,884fps with Hornady 17gr. Vmax ammo. My 5 group agg was .175" - larger int he 1/4" range, with a best group of .087". That's bench, double bagged at 51 lasered yards from the muzzle. They sure have potential.

Also - the .17 is the largest calibre you can have a 5 shot 3/8" group with, and have paper between each hole. Been there, one that. Even larger looking groups should be measured - they can be enlightening as to actual size.

I live in prairie dog country. The Cooper 57M LVT 17 HMR is one of the rifles in the pickup with me when I go after the p dogs but for the closer shots I like to use the little 17 HM2 rifle.

quote:

Originally posted by Blacktail53:
I love shooting mine.

I don't fret ammo cost because I use several different rifles while sage rat shooting. When digger shooting there isn't the volume issue.

Mine is a converted Ruger 77.22mag.
I added a Green Mt blued, heavy fluted .17HMR barrel. I simply sanded out the barrel channel to fit.
Accuracy, to date, is superb.

The scope is a Nikon 4.5x14 side focus and the trigger is just under 1#.

It's a neat little rig.

Definitely a Nice Set up Blacktailer!

I have a 12" 17 HMR barrel on a contender that shoots under 1" groups . . . have shot plenty of squirrel with it - mostly shots from a few feet to 50 yards . . . longest shot at 125 yards on feeder raiding racoons. My wife has an 18" 17 HMR barrel for her contender, also shoots very tight groups. Obviously, its a little easier to get tight groups at longer ranges than the 12" pistol (unless I can get a really good rest on the pistol).