dsiteman,

I'm lucky enough to buy, or 90% of the time have built, what I like. The CZ's "fit" me well, they work, and the price is very good. At Ruger pricing, I can build a custom with equal wood, and vastly superior workmanship. I have no issues with the Ruger, other than the pricing...ridiculous...and their support of Bill Klinton...will they slide in bed with Hillary next year?

Rich
DRSS

Idaho Sharpshooter:

1) Please take a look at my last post. I would like to hear your answers on actions.

2) I have handled and/or shot over at least two dozen different RSM's in each of the offered chamberings. I have never seen nor have I heard of anyone other than you seeing a Purple RSM. Might be an excellent investment opportunity for you.

3) What do you estimate the cost of a custom stock? Minimum $2,000 USD labor plus cost of wood?

4) What do you estimate the cost of a quarter rib installed? $1,500 USD?

5) What do you estimate the cost of an "intergal" machined barrel? $2,500 - $4,000 USD?

Buliwyf I think the idea you are trying to convey is that the CZ-550 is a rotten piece of bullcrap and only the Ruger Safari Magnum is worthy...

Everybody just keeps re-stating their opinions anyway, it's not like you are going to sway the thickheaded CZ owners and the Ruger guys are already convinced... aren't they?

Idaho Sharpshooter:

Please publish a line item quote from a gunmaker to bulid a custom rifle meeting the Ruger RSM factory specifications.

That would be a helpful post to the members.

No Demonical, I'm looking for facts.

BTW, while you're hear, have you seen the elusive Purple RSM?

quote:

Originally posted by Buliwyf:
No Demonical, I'm looking for facts.

BTW, while you're hear, have you seen the elusive Purple RSM?

No, my friends .416 Rigby is a gorgeous rifle. Perfectly blued, nice wood.

Unfortunately he had a nasty mishap with XS copper solvent. Didn't get it all out and it corroded the chamber very badly. He has to take to a 'smith to get the chamber cleaned up. Hasn't been able to shoot it for over a year. I think he's nuts to have waited as long as he has, but that's the deal.

I loved everything about his rifle except the balance. Terribly heavy barrel. There is a benefit to that though; if you're recoil shy the heavy barrel soaks up recoil pretty good.

I am already on record as to my opinions on the CZ vs Ruger subject, no need to rehash them yet again...

....or if you are physically strong and appreciate the balance of the RSM.

I just priced both rifles through my dealer. In a .416 Rigby, the CZ with a laminated stock (with two crossbolts) is $1049 plus freight and tax. The Ruger is $1661 plus freight and tax so the difference is about $600. The plain wood CZ would be less of course.

Who would have ever thought that you could buy a .416 Rigby for around $1000 or less!

Dave

Thanks for the facts Dave. Much, Much different economics than Idaho Sharpshooter. However, I see the new regular wood CZ 550 at the price point of your proposed laminated model (good deal for you) and I see the new RSM at your price point or slightly less (I don't know what the price is on the special order "Purple" RSM Idaho Sharpshooter talks about )

The Ruger No.1 chambered in .416 Rigby was around $700 USD and requires no "tweeking or gunsmithing". Available in both blue/walnut and stainless steel/laminate.

George Hoffman and Bob Taylor deserve a bunch of credit for keeping the .416 caliber alive and kicking. I think the Ruger RSM was the first new factory bolt rifle chambered in .416 Rigby - a dream of Bill Ruger.

Bul, I have some trading stock so I will probably make my decision based on what gives me the best trade although, as we discussed, the CZ just seems to suit me better. Even though the Ruger is more, it may be the better "value" of the two. I don't really NEED a .416 but I REALLY need a project, just something to screw around with, understand?

I shot a big bull bison last fall with my .404 and my son and I are going out to shoot his bison this fall. He will probably use my RSM .375. He is a great big guy, about six foot eight and, like you, he likes the Ruger better than the CZ's. I think I am going to just give it to him for Christmas to keep it in the family.

Anybody need a Remington CDL in 7mm Ultra Mag with or without a Leupold Vari III 4.5X14 scope? That's what I will probably trade.

Dave

Dave,

As I posted to you earlier on this thread, choose the rifle that fits you better. Period.

The Ruger RSM and the Ruger No. 1 are not "project" rifles. The CZ 550 is a "project" rifle and will fit your needs better. Go with the Bavarian (Hogsback) stock and give it a chance!

Your son is going to get a dandy x-mas present! Not only is he a great big guy, but brilliant also!!

The best thing about the RSM bedding system is its accuracy potential. Combined with the fat barrel and no sling base sticking through the forend from a barrel band imbedded in the wood, it is super accurate, with the right load.

My "generation 2" RSM in .416 Rigby (.810" muzzle diameter, 24" barrel, and barrel band sling out on the free barrel beyond the forend, as it should be) produced this group, .140 MOA for 3 shots at 100 yards:



BTW, my RSM is one of those mythical "purple rifles" actually a two-tone, purple action and black barrel.

So which should someone buy if they do not want to customize their rifle, but doesn't want to have to worry about a stock cracking? (my main concern)

Jeez guys

It really is about personal preferance! I have owned at the same time a CZ .416 Rigby, CZ 375 H&H, Win Pre 64 375 H&H,
Win Classic SS/Syn 375 H&H, Ruger RSM 416 Rigby and 458 Lott RSM.

All nice rifles that would make any owner proud.

In .416 Rigby I choose the RSM over the CZ in that FOR ME the RSM handled recoil better and was a better looking rifle. It is accurate as hell too. I just didn't take to the Euro stock of the CZ, but YMMV.

The .375 H&H cartridge is a much tougher nut. I love the accuracy and recoil of my CZ but the "trimness" of the Win 375s wins out. I am still at odds over reworking my Pre-64 or the Classic.

My RSM Lott is my favorite rifle :eek. I would be interested in a shotout of the "euro" stock vs the "classic" in the CZ. The Lott rules as a ground squirrel pounder IMO!

I always say buy what fits you and what turns you on. Rifles now days such as Ruger and CZ are pretty good off the rack. ALL will require a tuning to insure perfect fuctioning.

Get what you like and make certain it fits you and functions!!!!

Reread the last part of this post if required!!

I don't want to come across as a wise ass, as I'm really a newbie myself (25+ years of shooting) but I have been through the "what ifs" and "shall Is" and "If onlys" to know that if one sticks to basics one will succed more than most. In other words buy what you like and shoot it! CZ turns your rudder go for it. Hell, if you want to try something different just move it on AR

Buy what you like, shoot the hell out of it and if you want to try something else good for you!

John

Dr. Berry,

That's "lights out" shooting. Wow! Let's see now is that the arrow or the Indian. You shot the same group with Leonard's .500 Schuler Jumbo, the same group with your .470 Capstick, and now the best of all groups, .140" @ 100 yds with your Ruger M77 RSM .416 Rigby!! I heard in the breeze that you're finacially broke, where do you get monies for ammo Your shootin eye ain't broke Well Done!

The Ruger RSM secondary recoil lug design is an aid to accuracy because it is not welded to the barrel and allows the barrel to "float" giving the rifle its best opportunity to shoot.

Excellent markmanship!

Bugle,

The Ruger RSM is your best bet if you don't want to customize. The Ruger is priced with the quality of workmanship that provides a high probability of not needing to spend maney with a gunmaker.

CZ has priced the CZ 550 knowing that there is a higher risk factor of needing to get a gunmaker involved to solve some problems.

The market is efficient. Its about buying the rifle that meets your needs.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
The best thing about the RSM bedding system is its accuracy potential. Combined with the fat barrel and no sling base sticking through the forend from a barrel band imbedded in the wood, it is super accurate, with the right load.

My "generation 2" RSM in .416 Rigby (.810" muzzle diameter, 24" barrel, and barrel band sling out on the free barrel beyond the forend, as it should be) produced this group, .140 MOA for 3 shots at 100 yards:



BTW, my RSM is one of those mythical "purple rifles" actually a two-tone, purple action and black barrel.

Ron, excellent group!

I enjoyed reading your post. This week I have been toying with the idea of getting a .416 Rigby and I am trying to decide between a CZ and a Ruger. However, I am not sure if "pinpoint" accuracy should be the deciding criteria.

I have a CZ in .404 Jeffery that will also shoot 400 grain Woodleighs in to nice tiny little groups as well as an "off the rack" 9,3 CZ that came out of the box shooting nearly one hole groups with 270 grain Speers. Sometimes accuracy is more of function of finding the proper load and bullet combination. My RSM in .375 H&H is not as accurate as my CZ's but it is more than adequate for hunting pupposes. However, that kind of accuracy, while confidence inspiring, is hardly necessay in a DGR. If you can put five shots into a two inch group at 100 yards with your favorite bullet, you are good to go!

The great thing about AR is the exchange of opinions. While you see the heavy barrel on the Ruger as an asset, most posters seem to see it as a detriment. I really enjoy shooting my RSM in .375 H&H. It IS heavy and all that weight up front from the heavy barrel really soaks up the recoil. It is a pussycat to shoot. However, I would have to say that the balance and "pointability" of my CZ's is a bit better.

Dave

Dr. Berry,

I'm launching a search for one of them "Purple Ones". 2nd Generation eh. They shoot like the Hammers of Hell

Thank God for contraception! Only one more Kid still "at university."

The POI of the rifle above was adjusted 2" right and 1" down and then was spot on at 115 yards. Left fouled, it went to Botswana and drilled the test target tacked to a Tuli Block thorn tree at 100 paces, dead center. One shot was enough for the PH's approval. One shot more, 7 days later, and the Okavango 42-inch buff was down for the death bellow.

That was 2001 and I plan another trip every 10 years. I spend a lot on toys and family. A trip every decade to Africa is more realistic for a humble little "country doctor" with a lot of other hobbies.

I should be able to get in Seven Safaris before I kick off.

Dear Little Country Doctor,

So the economic model is one practice shot and one real shot for a total of two shots every ten years So a 10 pack lasts, humm lets see, 50 years! That's doable!

quote:

Originally posted by Buliwyf:
Bugle,

The Ruger RSM is your best bet if you don't want to customize. The Ruger is priced with the quality of workmanship that provides a high probability of not needing to spend maney with a gunmaker.

Thanks Buliwyf for the response!

Justin

quote:

Originally posted by Dave Bush:
The great thing about AR is the exchange of opinions. While you see the heavy barrel on the Ruger as an asset, most posters seem to see it as a detriment. I really enjoy shooting my RSM in .375 H&H. It IS heavy and all that weight up front from the heavy barrel really soaks up the recoil. It is a pussycat to shoot. However, I would have to say that the balance and "pointability" of my CZ's is a bit better.

Dave

Dave,
You'll notice that I voted for the CZ early on.
And I do love my 6.75 pound Pre-64 M70 custom .375 H&H pea shooter.
I do hate lugging the fat barreled Ruger.
However the Third Generation RSM in .416 Rigby has slimmed down to 9.5 pounds, and is just right.

I have purchased 3 different CZ .416 Rigby rifles. One got rebarreled to .458/.338 Lapua Magnum. Two are intact still.
I only own one RSM in .416 Rigby, Ol' Purple, but it is spooky-accurate, and I could never get rid of that one.

BTW, my best .416 Rigby CZ rifle is 0.75 MOA as compared to the 0.14 MOA RSM.

CZ's can be more than accurate enough.

Hello Dr. B,

Do you use your existing non-modified two CZ's as they came from the factory or are you planning to use them on custom projects?

Is Ol'Purple the most accurate big bore you've seen? What were the years the 2nd Generation were manufactured?

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
I do hate lugging the fat barreled Ruger.

RIP,
Just get that thing bored out to .475 or .510!!

My 1st generation M77 MKII Magnum is also "purple", I guess. The receiver is a slightly different color than the barrel. Since I was not the original owner of the rifle, I just chalked that up to potential re-blue of the barrel after re-boring, or when the very first owner had a detachable muzzle break installed (which I don't believe has seen use since Dave E owned it).

Cheers,
Canuck

I concur with Canuck that fat Ruger barrel balances out very well with a 0.510" bore!

The decision has been made! I ordered a CZ .416 Rigby this morning with a laminated stock. I should have it within a week or so but will not able to shoot it for a bit as I am recovering from eye surgery. I am going to have my guy bed it and, if necessary, polish up the action a bit. I'll keep you posted on how it comes out.

Dave

Idaho Sharpshooter:

quote:

CZ is basically an overgrown Mauser 98 action.

This is a quote from your post. You go on to infer there is a guide rib on the bolt and a slot in the top of the receiver of the CZ therefore I'm asking you to tell me where it's located on a CZ 550?

Does a CZ 550 have a bolt guide?

quote:

Originally posted by Buliwyf:
Hello Dr. B,

Do you use your existing non-modified two CZ's as they came from the factory or are you planning to use them on custom projects?

Is Ol'Purple the most accurate big bore you've seen? What were the years the 2nd Generation were manufactured?

Buliwyf,
There is another poster here who goes by "Dr B" whom I do not wish to be confused with.

You can call me Rip.

One CZ will stay as .416 Rigby. The other is awaiting rebarreling to 500 Mbogo right now. Gunsmiths and action makers.

Ol' Purple is the most accurate rifle over .40 caliber that I have ever owned, or fired. Let us see if anyone else can top it.

Roughly, RSM availability by years, I am sure "sumbuddy who know" can fine tune the dates:

Gen 1: 1990-1995
Gen 2: 1995-2000
Gen 3: 2000-present

Thanks Rip.

Idaho Sharpshooter:

Your post:

quote:

The Ruger doesn't have a guide rib on the bolt or slot in the top of the receiver for one.

What you left out is the CZ 550 does not have a "guide rib or slot" Gotta read your posts very, very carefully. You're a very clever fellow The last of the "Purple" RSM's was 7 years ago? 10 years ago? 15 years ago? I saw an old "Purple" Sako priced at $2,700.00 USD yesterday and the owner told me it was a "tack driver". Must be somthin about the Color Purple

Just the facts, Idaho Sharpshooter, just the facts.