I was out at the range today and put 50 rounds through my CZ 375. Most were offhand, rapid fire 3 and 5 shot strings at 50 and 25 yards. I then shot 3 3-shot groups from the bench since I'm planning on having my 375 rebored to 470 Capstick, both my gunsmith and Jim Dubell said to make sure it's a shooter otherwise rebarrel rather than rebore it.

It was a bit windy and I'm used to more magnification (I have a 1.5 - 5x Leupold) on it and I'm still getting used to this whole hold it firmly thing from the bench ... So much for my excuses ...




The other two groups measured just over .700" center to center ...



Chuck

50 rounds of 375?

You're a tougher man than I.

I would think that if you rebore the barrel it doesn't matter how it shot before, it will be different after being so extensively modified.

Actually both my gunsmith (Kevin Weaver who specializes in bench rest guns) and Jim Dubell of ClearWater reboring told me it will generally shoot as well or a tad better than it does now. So if my barrel wasn't shooting well not to rebore it.

Regards,
Chuck

Well, they seem to be the experts.

But the accuracy of a barrel mostly depends on the quality of the rifling which is completely replaced in reboring, no? Maybe I am missing something.

I don't think you're missing anything, I'm just not very good at explaining it.

There's just no fixing a crooked bore which was Jim and Kevin's concern. So if it's straight and the steel is good (not stressed) then the reboring is basically a cut rifling process with hand lapping. So it should be superior to the original mass produced barrel. The fact that my barrel shoots well now, bodes well for the future.

By the way, I uses a PAST pad when shooting from the bench and I don't think I'll be shooting 50 470 Capstick rounds off in an afternoon.




Chuck

If I had a CZ .375H&H that shot that well, I would not rebore it to .475 and end up with a whippy, thin-muzzled 470 Capstick.

I would rechamber it to .375 Weatherby and expect to still shoot the .375H&H just as accurately.

That wss my other thought Rip, it would probably serve me better most of the time since I'll probably only make it to Africa once or twice, but Alaska more often and Colorado elk season every year.

So if I go up in caliber you would recommend rebarreling? Krieger recommends their sporter contour 6, my 375's a sporter contour 4 by their measurement which is the same contour as the CZ 550's in 458 Lott (which doesn't mean they're not whippy).


Chuck

I think .458 is the practical biggest with that barrel contour.

By all means, rebarrel for a 470 Capstick. But preferably not a shooter like your .375 H&H.

Get another CZ, and a McGowen 1:10" TWIST or does Krieger do 1:10"? With a muzzle diameter that is about .750", sounds like a No. 6.

"DON'T FIX WHAT AINT BROKE".

Shame to rebore that one! It seems to shoot.

Rechambering to 375 Weatherby would be cheaper and faster too. I've always wondered what those 350g Woodleigh PPs would do to game at 2550 fps ...



Chuck

chuck 375, I had Brockman re-stock my 375 CZ with his laminated stock that has the configuration of an old english bolt rifle. i load 71 of RX 15 in WW cases with fed 215 and will shoot 3 300 gr NF softs 3 300 gr NF solids and 3 300 gr NF cup points it a ragged hole at 100 yards.

Just love the rifle. After I fired the first 100 rounds the action became slick.

A little more practice and a higher power scope (for load development only) and I'm sure the rifle can shoot better groups than I can. My action is tight (no wobble) but slick now. I'm very happy with my rifle. It's a bit muzzle heavy but if I decide to rechamber to 375 Weatherby I can replace the mercury recoil reducer in the stock with a heavier one to get the balance where I want it.

I'd leave it alone!!!!

wow, I really need to get a scope on mine to see what it's cabable of. I shot mine for the first time today and got a 3" group with the open sites.
how do you like that leupold scope of yours?

It's a nice scope, but If I was going to keep it as a 375, I'd opt for a 2x - 7x Leupold Vari X III. The Leupold 1.5 - 5x will work fine on my 470 Capstick.

Why not keep the 375 as is and put the rebore budget towards a CZ Rigby or Lott?

quote:

I'm planning on having my 375 rebored to 470 Capstick

If you were to have had this discussion with Harry Manners, who shot more than a thousand elephants with his .375 H&H, I am sure he would have advised you to keep your rifle the way it is.

Harry Manners has recorded his extraordinary experiences as a professional ivory hunter in the picturesque and romantic land of Mozambique. Hardcover: 389 pages; Publisher: Rowland Ward Publications

Some info on his carreer ... http://babelfish.yahoo.com/translate_url?tt=url&trurl=h...intl=us&fr=yfp-t-501

Warrior

I too would leave the rifle "as-is", that dog definately hunts! Save your money and put in into another "project" rifle. My CZ550 .375 shoots 1 MOAish but your group is very impressive.

It's pretty nice to get a shooter once in while, but if I just had to have something different then I'd go with the 375 wby rechamber. I don't care for barrels being as thin as the 470 rebore would come out to be with that particular contour. Rodney.

I would leave that one alone ?
I have been reading taylor, and He loves the 375 H&H for just about all african hunting.
If you want the 470 capstick , just cause you want one I understand.
But if that target was on an elephants shoulder (or a cape Buffalo) And you are using the right bullets, he would be as dead as dead gets.(I never been to africa so I am no athority, but this is from what I read in taylors book)
But ,If your hunting somthing bigger and meaner than an elephant or a cape buff , You better get that 470.
...tj3006

It'd be a shame to rebarrel a rifle that shoots that well. Why destroy what is a known quantity?

IMO, if you don't want a .375, then sell that gem of a rifle to someone here at ARF! IMO, like, ummm, me?

It's used at this point though. I'd say you'd have to discount it heavily. Send me a PM with your best offer...

Chuck,
I'm scratching my head on this one.

Why would you want to do anything to that rifle?

You are comfortable shooting it, it shoots well. It will kill anything on the planet as long as you do your part.

This is rifle looneyism at it's finest.

But I have been guilty of stuff like this myself. I owned a CZ 375 H7H that shot great, loved shooting it, but felt I needed a 416 Rigby. Needless to say hindsight is 20/20. The Rigby was just too big, hated shooting it at the range.

PS
No pictures of the rifle.

Unfortunately rnovi, I have too much into it (about $2K) to sell it cheap and no inclination to do so . I had AHR put their sweet trigger on it, install a 3-pos M70 type safety, straighten and fill the bolt, glassbed it and put an NECG masterpiece sight on it. Before that as part of the initial order I had CZ dual crossbolt it, do an action job, install a mercury recoil reducer, barrel band and high vis front sight ...

Picture if you haven't seen the rifle yet, it's kinda pretty ...



Since it's my only rifle (I typically only hunt with one at a time, my son's got the 270s) I kind of want it to be a bit different. Rechambering to 375 Weatherby is something I've given serious thought to ... Kevin Weaver could do that for me here, and it could still shoot 375 H&H ammo in a pinch.

Chuck

Chuck what kind of recoil pad is that your using on the 375?

I think it's a KickEze, not sure, CZ put it on, but I'm going to replace it with a Pachmayer XLT. It's already coming apart and I need a little more LOP so a thicker recoil pad should solve both problems for me.

That's a real nice rifle. I would keep it just the way it is.

Definitely a fine looking and shooting rifle, and it would be a shame to butcher the barrel to .475 with that thin muzzle.

Perfect as a .375, O.K. for a .416, pushing the envelope for a .458, definite no-no for .475.

If you rechamber to .375 Weatherby, you get to leave the .375 H&H stamping as is.

You then get to add a finely engraved "375 Weatherby" filled with gold, above the "375 H&H" ... it will digest both equally well.

The 2001 .375 Weatherby throat is just enough to allow you to load long enough to fill the 3.8" box length.
Only 0.3700" of parallel-sided freebore.
It cleans up the .375 H&H chamber and throat quite nicely.

It will easily do 2800 fps with 300 grainers and about 2600 fps with 350-grainers.

There is one catch:
The CZ barrel is a 1:14" twist instead of 1:12".

You really don't need anymore bullet than 300-grainers anyway.

I have rechambered the basic Euro-Lux-Hogback .375H&H CZ 550 Safari Magnum to .375 Weatherby, glass bedded with pillars and crossbolts.
With the 25" factory barrel I have, and loaded to 3.750" COL, 88 grains of H4350 gave over 2820 fps with 300-grainers. Accurate too.

It is all the rifle you need for anything.

The gyro-stability factor of a .375 caliber bullet of any weight is greater when fired at higher velocity in a given twist.

Thanks Rip, I appreciate the advice. The 375 Weatherby seems like a good fit. I have loaded the 350g Woodleighs and they seem very accurate in my rifle.

I checked on the CZ web site, it said the 375 H&H had a 1 in 12" twist rate, but of course it wouldn't be the first time a company's web site was wrong ... here's a link

http://www.cz-usa.com/product_detail.php?id=50


Chuck

Well that is great.
However if they say 1:12" now, then it is new, and a good change.
My old one is 1:14" and they used to advertize that twist.
Have you measured the twist yourself?

No, and I'm not sure how to. It would be a good thing to know. Any help much appreciated.

Chuck

A brass jag with 2 fins 180 degrees apart and having groove diameter as outside diameter of the opposing fins that fit inside the grooves (even-number grooves like 6-groove) works best.

However you can improvise and get within +/- 1/2" on the twist by using a good fitting brass jag for the bore and a patch that makes it tight.

Use a ball-bearing-handled cleaning rod.

Get the patched jag started down a clean bore from the breech, until the rifling engages and you see the rod slowly turn on the ball bearings as you slowly advance the rod.

Stop. Wrap a piece of masking tape around the rod near the handle, and make a flag standing radially straight vertically upward on the rod near the handle, using the tape as a rooster comb/flag or mark it with a Sharpie, axial to the rod long axis as a spin reference.

Mark the rod with the sharpie at another point nearer the breech, in a circumferential mark on the rod, such as adjacent to the rear edge of the rear receiver ring. Point A on the rod. This is the reference mark for length of travel of the rod down the bore.

If you use a long rod, you will have 2 or 3 feet of run to check twist in.

Advance the rod so that point A disappears down the barrel.

Watch the "rooster comb" or rod mark/flag near the handle.

When that rooster comb has done one revolution (360 degrees) as you advance the rod, stop.

Mark the rod circumferentially again at the same reference point adjacent on the receiver, using the Sharpie. This is point B.

Pull the rod out and measure from A to B along the rod shaft.

If that distance is 12 inches, the twist is 1:12".

If the A-B distance is 14", the twist is 1:14".

Got it, thanks Rip.

I measured my twist rate as you suggested and it came out very close to 1 in 12, I confirmed it with CZ. They said it's been 1 in 12 for a few years.

Thanks again,

Chuck

I have a Sako 375 H&H and mine will do the same as your CZ 375 H&H.

Chuck, i had my .375 Sako re-chambered to .375 Weatherby about 20 years ago. I've always been glad i did it. Mine still shoots .375 H&H factory ammo well. I did lose 40 fps off of factory ammo, which i consider insignificant. With hand-loads i gained 200 fps.

Thanks all, I have until November to decide. This board is full of great advice and great people.

Thanks,

Chuck

there's no problem going to .475 with that HEAVY barrel, just trim it to 23" ...

great shooting rifle, and I bet if you do your part, it will do the same in .475

Thanks jeffeosso, I've kind of decided if I'm going to go to 470 Capstick, I'll have Krieger rebarrel it, true the barrel to the action, and pillar bed it. It will probably cost another $400 over the rebore, but then again it's probably my last big game rifle and I'll be passing it on to my son (hopefully many years from now!).


Chuck