It has an NECG Masterpiece banded and hooded front sight, and barrel is 24" long instead of the usual CZ 25". Looks like a 10" twist by McGowen, which is most excellent for Bridger Brass Flat Nosed Solid-solids. This one is walnut and matte blue.

My dealer says CZ told him only 4 of the .505 Gibbs have been shipped so far, and he got two of them, one of which went off to Montana, and one of which is staying with me. He said CZ may take six months to make any more of them.

I wish that CZ would do lefty's. RIP go and have fun with the new toy!!!

505ED

quote:

Originally posted by 505ED:
I wish that CZ would do lefty's. RIP go and have fun with the new toy!!!

505ED

505ED,
"Ah feel yore pain," as Slick Willy would say.

fritz454 of Bridger Bullet fame got dibbs on the other one.

I've got 25 of his .505/550gr FN Brass solids to try in this baby cannon, against the Steel Mistress, versus the A-Square factory loads with round nose brass solids of .505/525gr persuasion.

Are there any doubts as to which will penetrate deeper and straighter?

It has been an hour since your first post and no pictures yet?



Congratulations on the new rifle. How many .50 and .50 plus bores live at your house now?

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:

He said CZ may take six months to make any more of them.

Maybe CZ is letting the customers do the beta testing.

Hey Rip,

WHERE ARE THE PICTURES, MAN


Hog Killer

Charlie and Hog Killer,
Everytime I get photos hosted on a site it goes tits up.
Look it up on the CZ web site. The bolt face is very thin around the rim. I haven't even tried it to see how it feeds. It is "spec" gun that a dealer ordered and I pestered him about for 5 months: "Is it here yet?"
Good night.

Ron, congrats, what kinda loads do you plan? And pics. Steel mistress?

quote:

Originally posted by fla3006:
Ron, congrats, what kinda loads do you plan? And pics.

Forrest,
I believe you posted them from the shot show. They may be the same guns shown there. Were there any matte blue ones? Mine looks new with no "demo" marks, however. 500 grains may be right about the "beta testing."

Ron, I deleted those pics. The rifle I handled was matte blue, plain-jane walnut, not the best inletting, fairly basic like most CZs, also relatively light weight. I'd be sure and fully glass, maybe add some weight.

Dammit RIP, common decency, the morality of everyman, should have damned well told you not to make this post without photographs.

Couldn't wait to boast, huh? Get out your digital camera, take some shots, upload them to Photobucket, and post 'em. You're too damned old to have me playin' your daddy on this.

So, in the meantime, does it have double crossbolts (bet it doesn't) and decent bedding (double or nothing)?

quote:

Originally posted by fla3006:
Ron, I deleted those pics. The rifle I handled was matte blue, plain-jane walnut, not the best inletting, fairly basic like most CZs, also relatively light weight. I'd be sure and fully glass, maybe add some weight.

Yes, now I recall how plain that one was.
Mine does have fancier walnut.
Weight is indeed 10.75 pounds bare, empty.
Muzzle diameter is 0.825" at the 24" point, exclusive of the NECG band of course.
I would not want it any heavier, but it does have a muzzle light and lively feel to it. I will get used to it.

Seems O.K. for a factory spec rifle. It will be a shop mule for the Steel Mistress.

MR,
No crossbolts and no glass bedding, but that will be corrected. Hey, it was pretty cheap for a starting point on .505 Gibbs.
I'm pooped for sure now, and don't feel like messing with a camera. I did go and join Photobucket, so, later ...
Good night. Sleep tight.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
....I did go and join Photobucket, so, later ...
Good night. Sleep tight.

FYI - I've never had a problem with http://www.Hunt101.com

Congrats on the new 505!!

However,
there's is NO WAY i would bed that rifle prior to 100 rounds of ammo going through it.. and if it damaged the stock, cz would be replacing it, as I spoke about this exactly with Jason.

jeffe

Yheeppee The one going to Montana is MINE all mine. Now the UPS waiting game begins.

I would bed and cross bolt it before I shot it...Here are the facts of life, any 505 that is not glassed, double recoil lugs, cross bolted will split a wood stock and tear the fibers out of a composit stock. There are just some things good inletting cannot handle. Those really big bores will eventually pound a gap in the recoil area and then they get a running start at the stock..Cross bolts can prevent most of this, but glass is the best route..I have seen some real nice custom rifles by well known makers who claimed that if the gun was properly inletted it would hold, well gues what, in the middle of Africa one sheared at the grip, the other split out the action mortise then the grip split...Out comes the African bush repair in the form of Micro Bed, but it wasn't pretty...Few American smiths have delt with the big bores.

The other thing with the big 500s IMO is use a receiver sight, ghost peep, or shallow V irons, scopes go tits up pretty regularly..and big bores are for short range shooting so a scope should not be needed...

Just my opine.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
MR,
No crossbolts and no glass bedding, but that will be corrected. Hey, it was pretty cheap for a starting point on .505 Gibbs.
I'm pooped for sure now, and don't feel like messing with a camera. I did go and join Photobucket, so, later ...
Good night. Sleep tight.

I know the price was right and I'm just breakin' your cojones, but you know that.

Do you have ammo or the makings yet? Don't be tempted to shoot it before doing the stock work.

I split the stock behind the tang on an unbedded and uncross-bolted big bore in barely more than 20 rounds once. And it was NOT as big a boomer as the .505 Gibbs, either.

Stu,
I think hunt101.com is the latest one to go kaput. Photobucket now, eh?

I reckon I better glass bed, pillar bed and cross bolt fore and aft of the magazine box. A gunsmith with proper jig and drill will do the crossbolts, and I can do the rest.

I hear what Jeffe is saying, but CZ is unlikely to supply any better wood the second time around, and you gotta do the glass bedding eventually anyway.

Then an AHR trigger and safety. Then it might be presentable.

I'll go rummage around for a camera ...

Another crappy detail on the CZ Safari Classics is how sharp the edges are on the barrel band sling stud. They should have radiused or beveled them just a tiny bit.

Ray,
Jawohl, no scope is best, but I have a 2.5X Lepold in Talley rings that might hold up.

MR,
I have 40 rounds of the A-Square produced CZ factory ammo, and the RCBS dies and some Bridger solids to try. I am still waiting on the Jamison brass.

http://www.imagestation.com

May have a glitch once a year..

mike

please take a well lit close up of the bolt face!


Am I on your ignore list?

Ron, Photobucket is easy to use and works well. I transferred all my files from Imagestation because of frequent problems.

I use a 60s vintage 2.75x Bushnell ScopeChief II on my Wells. So far it is holding zero and I shoot quite a bit. These were fairly expensive state-of-the-art scopes in their day, bright and clear, but do not have constantly centered recticles.

From the imagestation.com Membership Agreement:

"You may not take the results from your use of the Service and link to them, or mirror pages from the Site on another website, or create links from other websites onto any area of the Site."

That's one of the reasons why so many times a photo with a link to imagestation doesn't show up here on AR when viewing a thread.

-Bob F.

Bob,
Right. Funny that Imagestation used to work fine here until the latest upgrade by AR.com. I gave up on Imagestation. Now Hunt101.com appears to be in arrears.

Stryker225,
Huh? Back to the .505 Gibbs,
I gotta post some details of this one. Photos pending when I get them, including the bolt face.

Flash: The magazine box is stamped ".375 H&H" and is the ribbed sheet metal one that has been modified with a welded on attachment of thin sheet metal at the front that extends the box to 4" long and allows an insert of an approximately 1/8" rubber pad to line front of the box as a bumper for bullet nose battering!!!
The follower seems to be a specially shaped and thinned one in vertical dimension/thickness.

Also, after removing the stock, I finally discovered a small amount of epoxy bedding around the primary action recoil lug, and also the F-block contraption for the barrel recoil lug is bedded in epoxy in the forearm, from the factory, and looks really minimalist and sloppy, but hidden when assembled.

The sidewall of the action is marked Pm = 3800 BAR below the wood line, just above the magazine box, on the outside left side of the action. What's that, 55,000 PSI? 1 bar = 14.5036 psi.

The box holds three down. The A-Square ammo feeds from the magazine very smoothly, believe it or not, but the bolt won't close on a chambered round!!!

The ammo seems to measure within specs, so my chamber is either too tight, short chambered, or there is some crud in the chamber that needs to be cleaned out. There were a few particles of styrofoam in the chamber that had come from the luxurious packaging: plain cardboard box with CZ logo, styrofoam molded insert, and clear plastic garbage bag wrapping the rifle. No literature/manual, no warranty/registration card, no test target ... none of the usual papers that come with the standard CZ 550 Magnums.

I will try cleaning the chamber and resizing some brass to the max and see if the bolt will close. This may be a serious problem, but I hope not. Sheesh!

The .404 Jeffery was Peter-Paul-perfect in magazine box dimensions and function in every way.

This .505 Gibbs needs some sorting out. I hope fritz454 has a better experience. I never saw his gun nor compared it to mine. I just picked up what was offered to me on this "spec" rifle from CZ.

Thanks for the update. Good luck with the chamber issues -- I hate to hear that.

We will patiently await the pictures.

Ron, I would expect to see it here on Tuesday or Wednesday and I'll let you know about the chamber and the other specifics. If needs be I've got a 505 Gibbs reamer that is being used by a friend right now but I can certainly get it back as soon as he's finished with it so if you can wait a bit we can get the chamber issues worked out.

I'm definitely going to cross bolt and glass bed as soon as it gets here. Also stop by Gentry (he's a half mile away) and pick up a three position safety and trigger one for the 404 and the 505 plus maybe a couple for stock. If you need one let me know I may be able to get a discount as he and I exchange material fairly often and the more you buy the cheaper it usually is.

The 404 feeds my solids just great once I smoothed the rails a bit. I thought I was going to have to make a single stack but it works great. Now it’s as slick as goose shit. I hope the 505 is the same in the feeding department. That makes my life a lot simpler.

I had the same lack of paperwork with the 404. I hope CZ doesn’t let a good thing go sour. If they start to maximize profits at the expense of quality and the other little things eventually it will bite them in the ass. Look what happened to Winchester after 64 when they went to a push feed.

I won’t be shooting the 505 for awhile anyway. I got trampled by on of my 3 year old quarter horses on Thursday. I’m actually pretty lucky to still be here. I’m bruised up pretty bad with one broken rib and a nice hoof shaped bruise just off center of my back. So I’m going to heal up a bit before I drop the hammer on anything bigger than a 30 cal. Dam horse is lucky it’s not going to the canner but it’s the best conformed horse I’ve seen in a long time. It will make a great cutting or roping horse.

I did a count last night of my ongoing gun projects and the count is 42. All have been started and some are almost complete. I think I need to not get going on anything new until I get that number in at least half. Every time I log on to AR someone has another great idea on a gun or caliber I’ve got to have. You guys are bad for my bank balance but boy do I love it. I’ve got a CCW colt 1911 compact I started building in 1996 and it’s still not even half way there yet. I think I need to quit my day job.

Sorry for hijacking your thread but the docs got me on morphine sulfate and I’m feeling pretty good.

I’ll get pictures of the 505 when she get here and post along with the 404.

Have a good weekend all.

John

RIP is the gun dealer you bought your 505 off of Whittaker's or somewhere else?

John,
Take heart.
I think it is the A-Square-loaded, CZ factory ammo that is the problem.

I pulled the bullet from a soft and a solid load and saved the powder for analysis.

I noted that it took a lot of resizing effort to run the new brass through the size die, and I bent the depriming pin in my $395 RCBS dies.

The flash holes are undersize and very irregular on the two pieces of brass I looked at.

After resizing the brass would chamber in my gun. So I just fired the primers on the two pieces of brass and then re-seated the A-Square solid and one of your Bridger solids to make dummies.

These chamber easily.

Your solid feeds fine from the left side of my box, but hangs up when fed from the right. The round nose solid feeds smoothly from either side.

The inside of the box, ramp and rails are very rough and need a polish and maybe a little bit of reshaping of the ramp to get that Bridger solid to feed smoothly from both sides.

I am off work today and have some time to set up for pictures.

Maybe we can compare them here, as they progress. Dave Gentry does good work, and I am always interested in anything from him if you get a lead on something.

So far the problem seems to be the ammo, not the rifle.

If you mess with horses long enough, you are bound to get hurt. Get well soon.

quote:

Originally posted by Jarrod:
RIP is the gun dealer you bought your 505 off of Whittaker's or somewhere else?

Jarrod,
Yes, Darrel Whittaker is the big dealer. I am taking the CZ ammo (made by A-Square) back to see if we can get it returned and have CZ notified that the ammo they are supplying does not fit in the chamber of the .505 Gibbs.

I have no issues with the .404 Jeffery, as I rolled my own from scratch with Norma brass for that one.

The funny thing is that A-Square loaded ammo lists for $125 for 10 rounds. Maybe A-Square wants $80 for 10 new pieces of brass? That is ridiculous.

I am still waiting on Jamison, and will go Horneber if I don't get Jamison soon.

Ron, I've got 60 pcs of bertram but you know that story. I'll use these on low pressure loads only. If you get a lead on Horneber let me know as I'll buy a bunch.
John

I recently got my Horneber 505 from Huntington's. I also picked received my RCBS 505 dies from them about a week ago. They were in stock. :-0

Photos:

.404 Jeffery above.
.505 Gibbs below.
Ruana Pig Sticker from Montana.
Sheath handcrafted by RIP.
Medicine Bag contains complete set of teeth from a Kodiak brown bear skull pickup I found while deer hunting with a .375 Weatherby:



Buttstocks, .404 on left and .505 on right:


Muzzles with lint from oilcloth:



.505 3-down and .404 5-down, box contents.
.505 is A-Square brass, bullets left to right are A-Square 525gr Monolithic solid, Dead Tough soft, and 550gr Bridger Brass FN solid.

.404 bullets in DWM brass (old stuff just for dummies) and one piece of Norma, North Fork 380gr SP, FP, and old Ogive FP, Swift 400gr A-Frame, Barnes X 350gr which I suckered Ray out of, his last 76 of these discontinued bullets:



Boltface1:



Boltface2:

Rip,

Your 505 sure looks a lot better than the one I saw at the NRA show in Houston. You were not kidding about the bolt face, they openned it to the max possible.

Hog Killer

Thanks, Hog Killer. It could turn into a serviceable rifle with some work and some new brass for handloading.

The .404 Jeffery weighs 9.5 lbs. bare, 25" barrel, .666" muzzle diameter. Scope is a Leupold 1X-4X. The rings are some of the trim, old BRNO ZKK 602 type, but I have Talley mediums and Warne lows with QD levers. The .404 Jeffery feeds anything and the box is perfect in size for the .404.

The .505 Gibbs weighs 10.75 lbs. bare, 24" barrel, .825" muzzle diameter, and should be good for some kicks. Needs some feed work.

The rifling in both barrels is 10" twist McGowen, and it doesn't get any better than that . That makes them worthwhile.

Roger,
After getting whacked $400 for the RCBS dies, I held off on ordering the Horneber brass from Huntingtons, since I have Jamison on order. But, since Nickudu says Horneber .505 Gibbs brass is the best thing since sliced bread, I better get some too.

John,
don't buy up all that Horneber brass from Huntingtons.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
Photos:

Thanks for the pictures -- some nice rifles there. I'm glad that the problem seems to be the ammo rather than the chamber.

Nice rifle, RIP. I started one before CZ announced their plans and my bolt face looks pretty much the same as yours. I'm waiting for a reamer to headspace mine and a new floorplate from J. Wisner.

That's the second instance of 505 ammo that wouldn't chamber that I know of recently. A friend got a bunch of 505 from Superior (Bertram brass) that wouldn't chamber in his Champlin 505. Sent it back and got a second lot; same problem. Superior made good on it and he got some that worked but I bet they didn't full length resize the first two batches befor loading.

BTW, Huntington's sells cast 600 gr. 505 bullets also made by J. Wisner if you want to play with any.

Both rifles very nice Ron. The 505 is not the one on display at NRA.

That's some nice wood. Way above average. Good figure in the butt stocks.

Your experience with the A-Square ammo adds another to an unfortunately long list of complaints I have heard about them, including poor quality control, soft brass, split case necks, etc.

No experience with the 505, but you might check the neck thickness on the brass. I've had this problem on both Bertram and A-Square. Some 425 WR Bertram cases I got recently would chamber in the rifle when empty, but when I loaded a bullet, it would no longer chamber. I put and extra heavy crimp on, and it chambered. A check of the case necks showed they were pretty thick, and the .001 or so difference with the bullet tension was enough to cause them not to chamber. I've noticed this is a common problem with a lot of the specialty makers.