i have been offerd a 450 marlin leveraction short barrel gun

so i am wondering are anyone out there using such gun to hunt.

i am going on blackbear hunt next year and was planing to take 338wm or my 9,3x74 double this marlin might be the gun for this hunt?

have enyone use this on a big game??
regards

the 9,3 would be my choice, but the marlin is great for busting pigs!

Hello,
The 450Marlin round in the Marlin Guidegun is probably which rifle you are talking about and in my area, West Virginia, where the timber is thick w/ brush and thickets the rifle you mention is well accepted. The caliber is not very popular compared to the same gun offered in 45-70 Gov't round and even though the 450 is a bit stouter, the black bear or deer will not know the difference. If your shots are close, less than 150 yards or so, it will do fine on the normal black bear and then some if loaded w/ good load/bullets. My grandad's '86 Winchester/45-70Gov't rifle thinks it can kill anything and so far it has on black bear or deer or even a bull once! Good Hunting!

so the mariln 450 is more like fun factor.

In my country you are not allowed to buy caliber larger than 8mm unless you are going to hunt in other country.

i have permit to buy 460wby and 600ne for my african hunt later on.

Local sako dealer told me sako is making kodiak in 460wby in desember 2008.

i have not made up my mind about the 600 but i think it ends with heym

the owner of this marlin has used it on a whitetailhunt when he lived in usa.

He is asking for an offer on it
maybe i can use it on my next wildboarhunt in poland

quote:

Originally posted by trg-s:
In my country you are not allowed to buy caliber larger than 8mm unless you are going to hunt in other country.

In that case my choice would be a 8mm remington mag.

quote:

i have permit to buy 460wby..

I went pheasant hunting with a young (~28) gentleman who, 2 months ago, shot a 50 pound bull with a 460wby. It took 5 shots to bring the elephant down - 2 in the head, 2 in the chest/side, and 1 in the rear end.

BTW, I've heard, from friends who have been to Iceland, that the girls there are quite good looking. Is this true?

TRG,

The .45-70 case actually has more powder capacity than the .450 Marlin. So if you are a hand loader the .45-70 is a more capable round.
The .450 marlin was built with a belt for one reason and one reason only. So that the stouter factory loads produced in the .450 can not be chambered into a weak actioned .45-70.
The .45-70 when hand loaded to it's potential is a more powerful round than the .450 Marlin.

trg-s,
surestrike is spot on.
I owned a 450 Marlin Guide Gun once. Short barreled and ported.
Bad idea.
I dumped it in Alaska as boot on an M70 Classic .416 Remington. Very kind of them to take it off my hands for a $150 loss.

I still own a longer barreled Marlin 45-70 with no muzzle blast amplifier near the end of the barrel.

You can handload the 45-70 Govt. chambering in a Marlin to exceed the 450 Marlin, easily. The limiting factor is the action strength.

As surestrike says: greater case capacity with the 45-70 Govt.

No porting and a longer barrel makes the 45-70 a better Marlin than the 450 Marlin. No oxymoron intended.

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
No porting and a longer barrel makes the 45-70 a better Marlin than the 450 Marlin. No oxymoron intended.

As in the Marlin 1895 CB - with a capacity of 9 rounds!

TRG,
I have a Marlin ´95M with the 18,5" ported barrel. I bought it in 2001, one of the first rifles, arrived europe. First, I installed a used Zeiss Jena 4x32 scope, but the recoil destroyed it. Now I have a used Leupold scope, a 2,5-10x50.
About the .450Marlin. I don´t know about the laws in iceland, but in Germany it´s not allowed to load a round over the max. pressure. I have three .45-70 rifles and the max. pressure here is 2200 bar. With the .450 I can have more power in the legal area of 3000bar. This was one of the points, why I select this round. It´s the same easy reloadable round like the .45-70. I used only Norma N200 propellant behind Speer 300grs hotcore, 400grs FN, Hornady 300grs HP and 350grs FN. Now I will test same loads with IMR-4198 and the Sierra 300grs HP.
I forget, I have no hunting license in Germany, I´m only marksman and reloader. So I have no experience in hunting with the round.
But it´s a great round, I like it. In Germany I know same hunters, they use it with great success at wild boar and roe deer.
Here´s a pic.

Martin

I forget, if you want a bolt rifle, Steyr makes a 22" barrel rifle, the Mannlicher Big Bore only chambered in .450Marlin.
http://www.steyr-mannlicher.com/index.php?id=201&L=1
http://www.steyr-mannlicher.com/index.php?id=199&L=1
Martin

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
..You can handload the 45-70 Govt. chambering in a Marlin to exceed the 450 Marlin, easily. The limiting factor is the action strength.

..
No porting and a longer barrel makes the 45-70 a better Marlin than the 450 Marlin. No oxymoron intended.

No meaningful difference in capacity, and some listings have them as the same.. in THEORY the 416 rem can be loaded to higher velocity (not hotter) than the 416 hoffman.. difference? mebbe 3 FPS

the 450 marlin in a 21" barrel unported is the best of both worlds.. as your stout loads are going to be about the same as the factory loads, that you CAN buy at walmart...

I have a Guide Gun in 45-70 as well as in 450 Marlin. I also have a Marlin XLR in 450 Marlin with a 24" barrel. The Guide Gun handles a bit easier in the thick stuff but the recoil is a bit more stout compared with the 24".

I have used all on whitetails and the "thwack" when one of these hit a deer broadside is impressive. Even more impressive is the speed with which the deer go down (I also use my 6mm, 257 and 260 and I believe there is a difference in deer reaction).

For close-range hunting (less than ~ 150 yards), I can't see how the Guide Gun can be beat for nearly any game animal.

I agree with you. The xlr 24" model does get the most out of a 450 Marlin cartridge. 3500 ft.lbs of energy is nothing to sneeze at and it is conveniant for people that do not reload.

I believe the .450 Marlin would be more popular if it were offered in a Bolt Action. I own a .458 X 2" AMERICAN built on a Remington M-722 Action. The .458 X 2" is very similar to the .450 and it shoots great. I've taken six Deer with it using a light load: 42.0 grs/IMR-4198/300 grain HP bullet. If I use heavier bullets or loads you can tell it has a healthy recoil!

thanks for these answer.
This marlin look just like the one Martin post above.

akalinin: maybe this gentleman need something else than 460 :-).

i am not into crossbow hunt
but here is one crossbowlink

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJokpxvMmvA

BTW i think your friend is rigth on that one
we have won miss world 3 times so just come visit.

few of my hunting friends have 375 H/H 416 rigby,rem and wby 458 and lott and we meet few times every year to shoot on target and to have good time.
We dont have any game here to shoot with bigbore rifle that is why the cal limit is up to 8mm
but we go wildboarhunting in poland and some have been several times to africa to hunt that is why some have bigger guns.

Only big animal we have visiting us is polarbear we had 2 visit us in the same month.

nest question is what is fair to pay for 450 marlin in good condition

regards Magnus

A Poler Bear, they get pretty big. Must get to 10 Foot maybe 11' I guess thats why they have the 458 WBY and 458 Lott.

It's probably a decent caliber -- the higher powered 45-70 rounds can be handy...

My 1895 CB, however, is one of the nicest handling rifles I've ever handled, so if those are available...

quote:

If I use heavier bullets or loads you can tell it has a healthy recoil!

Yes, this can I agree! With 400-grainers and a compressed load of N200, the 1895M kicks very hard.

Martin

I reload for both the 45/70 and 450. Depending on the manufacture of the cases, the 45/70 has a nominal 3% larger case volume. I say nominal because this can be offset by various powders. If hand loaded both the calibers can be equals.

The 450 was developed by Marlin in concert with Hornady. The intention was to develop the 130 year original black powder cartridge and optimize it for modern smokeless powders and take advantage of modern metallurgy. That is why if you pick-up reloading manuals you will see three sets of reloading tables – one for the original trapdoor/rolling block rifles, one for modern lever actions, and one set for modern falling block (Ruger #1 etc). Early black powder reloading for the 45/70, 45/90, 45/100, 45/110, 45/120 was pretty easy – put in a fresh primer and dredge the case through powder to fill the case, level it off at the top and seat the bullet.

Besides the nominal difference in case capacity the 450 has a “belted†case and a smaller extraction rim. The purpose of the belt was to prevent a 450 cartridge from being mistakenly loaded into older trapdoor or older lever action rifles. Both cases can be loaded to the same pressures.

What this did for marketing was to allow ammunition manufactures to produce and retail a higher power cartridge with greatly reduced risk of it being used in older weapons. With few retail exceptions (Hornady LeverEvolution, Buffalo Bore, Garrett etc) over the counter 45/70 rounds are compatible with all three levels of rifles, while the exceptions above are explicitly for modern lever action/falling blocks etc, but this unfortunately doesn’t allow taking advantage of the cartridges full capabilities.

Differences I have observed are only between the Marlin 1895s I own - an SS, two G’s, a GS, and an M (450). The small rim of the 450 makes passing the cases through the loading gate easier and cycling the rounds feels easier to me. I can also load large meplat flat nose rounds through the loading gate easier because the smaller case rim of the 450 lowers the angle of cartridge as it passes through the gate and into the magazine.

Did a two-week plains game hunt in Namibia this past May and used a Ruger #1 and an 1895 GS (ported) with medium hand loads of 300gr hard cast over 37grs of H4198 and 300gr JHP over 42grs of H4198. Took two Gemsbok (one at 70 yds - JHP, one at 180 yds - JHP), a Kudu (at 80 yds - cast) and a Springbok (at 120 yds - JHP) without any issues.

There is a .450 marlin rifle in one of the Gunshops I visit. The owner said it has been there for some time. He thinks that people, who are interested in the caliber, are afraid of the recoil. So it remained unsold.

I work with 45-70 and .450 rifles of all barrel lengths. The factor which is not widely discussed is teh throat length on the .450. Using bullets that take advantage of the longer throat(which means they won't chamber in a 45-70 opens up case capacity so that there is no difference. A friend of mine is cutting custom molds that take advantage of the throat. I have been testing the bullets since last year. The map on the .450 is 43,500psi. Using that guide line the .450 using proper bullets will out power even the hot rod marlin 45-70 loads by a margin so slim it is splitting hairs. The beauty of this extra room is that bullets are being developed to take advantage of availible powder capacity and nose profile. Here is one I am currently working with.It is currently 500grs and has a .308 meplat. The nose profile prohibits its use in 45-70s. Anyone with a throating reamer could open it up enough to make it work though. reflex264

Yep,
Splitting hairs is what it is all about.
I think both the 45-70 Govt. and the 450 Marlin are cute.

quote:

Originally posted by Big Bore Fan:

Worlds collide! A classic American rifle with a monster scope like they tend to use in Europe. To my eye, it's looks miserable, but I suspect it's a great rig for low-light hog hunting. YMMV.

quote:

Originally posted by surestrike:
TRG,

The .45-70 case actually has more powder capacity than the .450 Marlin.

Maybe, but the case is of a much weaker design. You're asking for trouble when overloading a .45-70 case unless you are using black powder !! A .450 marlin is like a .45-70 on steroids !!!!

trg-s

I base my answer on the fact that you are in Iceland, and you probably do not have access to ammo and loading "stuff" like someone in the USA and you are limited on how many rifles you can have.

The 450 Marlin and a 45/70 in a Marlin are considered as equals in power. I have shot some game with the 45/70. It is a great close range cartridge.

However, I have also used a 9,3x74R, for quite a bit of game. I consider it superior to the 45/70, 450 Marlin by quite a wide margin, and I like the 45/70, 450 Marlin, but the 9,3x74R is better, especially for larger game like cape buff and elephant, which I have taken with a 9,3x74R.

Only you can decide if it is worth the "trouble" in getting ammo and the permits for the 450 Marlin verses another calibre.

quote:

A classic American rifle with a monster scope

Slatts,
I know, the scope is toooo big. My selection was a smaller one. But this was a used one, I get from a friend for only 100 bucks. The price for a good new one begins at 500.- €.

Martin

quote:

I believe the .450 Marlin would be more popular if it were offered in a Bolt Action.

Winchester's custom shop actually chambered (I believe a short action) M-70 for this round.

Hand loaded to 62,000 PSI it's quite a bit of bear medicine.

the 450 marlin/45/70 will smash any bear in existence and do so well. there's 45/70 loads that pretty much equal anything you find in the 9.3 but in a larger caliber with a larger frontal area so i'm not quite sure how they don't hit even harder for the top end loads.

if i was buying a 450 marlin it'd be in a blr that can handle much much higher pressures and has a shorter lever throw along with a stronger ejection system. in fact, i am gonna buy one of those, thanks for reminding me.

Here's a photo of my .458 X 2" AMERICAN, built on a Remington Model 722. No Recoil Pad, and it "Kicks Like A Mule!"