quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:
I have to go with Indy on this one. I pulled a Camp Perry results bulletin from a few years back. Over 1100 of the best shooters with the best equipment including the military teams could not place 20 rounds through a 7" 10 ring with a 13" aiming black. High score for one of the matches was 197. There are some cleans shot standing but far and few between.

If you can consistently shoot 6" groups standing with a big bore at a 100 yards that is pretty good in my book.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike70560:
Official NRA Highpower matches fire 20 rounds from each position, hence the scores based on 200.

Been a while since I competed, but it used to be 10 rds off-hand 200 yds SF, 10 rds 200 RF sit or kneel, 10 rds prone RF 300 yds, 10 rds SF 500 or 600 yds. There are 50 rd ad 100 rd variants.

The 223 comparison at a thousand yards is irrelevant due to reading wind, consistant velocity, your 55 grain bullet would die out at about halfway, etc, etc.

Yes it is a ridiculous comparison, much the same as saying shooting 3" at 100 yds is the same as shooting 6" at 200 yds. At least not off-hand.

We also shoot reduced distance matches at 100 yards. 10 ring is 3.35" and aiming black is 6.35". I have never seen a clean shot in one of these matches, I know it happens, but the scores are very similar to the full size targets at 200 yards.

Notice how the bull doesn't shrink by a factor of 2. The bull on an SR target is about 2.2 times larger than a SR1 target.


I am sorry for injecting highpower in big bore but it was the best comparison I could make.

Shooting any rifle is the same basic mechanics, big bores add in the adjustment to recoil. I have shot competetively in the military with m16, m14, m60, m1911, and M9. I have also competed in NRA HP rifle, and IPSC. I would still like to try handgun silhouette though, those guys are amazing. That being said, a 10 rd offhand group at 200 yds is a far deal tougher than a 3 shot 100 yd group offhand.


Back on topic,

I still feel consistent 6" groups standing at 100 yards are very sufficient to hunt cape buffalo. Smaller groups are something to strive far and can happen at times with enough practice.

I think you missed the point of the argument, a couple of times. But thats OK. Standing at the 100 yd line, relaxed, shooting at a stationary target, with a clearly defined target area, is not the same as having walked 5-10 miles, amped up on adrenaline, and shooting at a target hidden by a whole lot of buffalo. The idea was not to settle for a 6" target, but shoot as well as you can so that sight alignment, hold, and trigger pull are autonomic.


I am practicing with my 470 Nitro for an October elephant hunt. My goal is at 25 yards, 4 shots, under 2", in under 10 seconds. Right now group size is good, working on speed with the Krieghoff, need to shave off about 2 seconds.

Enjoy the pachy hunt! 470 NE is a great cartridge for that. You may not believe it, but if if you could keep your sight alignment, you would be able to hit 2" at 50 yds as well. 100 yds would be doable, just really hard with the short sight radius and less than perfect hold on the rifle. As for advice, practice going from port to mount to fire one shot at a time and keep it to around 3-4 seconds.

quote:

since I can shoot my .223 varmint rifle at 1/2 moa at 100 yds, I am gonna win NRA match

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:

quote:

since I can shoot my .223 varmint rifle at 1/2 moa at 100 yds, I am gonna win NRA match

John,

You wrote, "...since I can shoot my .223 varmint rifle at 1/2 moa at 100 yds, I am gonna win NRA match..."

Just to clarify things, we were discussing offhand. You cannot shoot such groups offhand.

The angular error that creates a 1/4" miss at 100 yards does not create a 1" miss at 200. The 200 yard miss is 1/2 inch. They teach that in the ninth grade.

The offhand component of NRA Highpower matches can be either 10 or 20 shots. 20 is more common. It was 20 when I won sixth master in the Navy Cup (national championship). It's 10 in the CMP (service rifle) matches.

The reason Mike's 100 yard bull is not exactly 1/2 the size of the 200 yard bull is because allowance is made for bullet diameter. You get the higher score if the bullet just touches the higher scoring ring.

Handgun silhouette shooters cannot consistently hit a 6" bull offhand at 200 yards. Period.

quote:

I am practicing with my 470 Nitro for an October elephant hunt. My goal is at 25 yards, 4 shots, under 2", in under 10 seconds. Right now group size is good, working on speed with the Krieghoff, need to shave off about 2 seconds.

quote:

Originally posted by Indy:

quote:

Originally posted by Robgunbuilder:
Yup- 3 inches offhand at 100 yrds. 2 is better yet. Seriously you actually can do it and with express sights too. I've seen much better. Practice enough and you will amaze yourself. - Rob

Get a litle serious.

That's equivalent to a 6" group at 200 yards. Anyone who can do that 20 shots in a row can shoot 200 out of 200 possible and win the national championships at Camp Perry.

I'll bet none of your spacegun shooters can do that. I hold a Master card in NRA Highpower and I can't do that.

If you can group 6" or 8" off hand at 100 yards most of the time, you're doing good. I can do that and I killed a Cape Buffalo. Remember a buffalo is a lot larger than a deer.

quote:

Originally posted by Robgunbuilder:
Remember my old thread on what distance did you shoot your DG at? Most DG was shot at 40 yrds or less. If you can keep all your shots on a paper plate at 50 yrds your set. Thats all I care about. -Rob