Don't see much on this caliber so I thought I'd post some results. Only fired about 6-8 groups so far. Nothing over 1 1/2" for 3 shots so far. Last group .8" at over 3000 fps with 300TSX. Load developement about done with this bullet just going to shoot a bunch of groups to get an average. Very impressed with this caliber.

MTM. May I ask what powder you are using?

That would be 7828.

How much 7828 does it take to get that bullet up to 3,000 fps? I know what a 300 TSX feels like at 2500 fps and I'm working up loads trying to get to 2,600 fps in my H&H but thinking about 3,000 fps makes me wince

ouch.

quote:

Originally posted by Fjold:
How much 7828 does it take to get that bullet up to 3,000 fps? I know what a 300 TSX feels like at 2500 fps and I'm working up loads trying to get to 2,600 fps in my H&H but thinking about 3,000 fps makes me wince

I would say about 115 grns.

MTM

Can you give us more Data such as primer amount of powder your're using and O.A.C.L.
I've push 300 grain nosler out around 3100 fps but the groups were not very accurate. And I thought I'd try 300 grain TSX.
I had good groups with 270 grain TSX 111 grains of IMR-7828 however, I haven't chronographed them yet.

Thanks

Steve

Steve, I'm only useing 112 grs. under the 300TSX, Fed. 215 and 3.79 O.A.L. Pressure seems fairly mild? 107 grs I was getting soot on the necks, barely sealing the chamber. Great to see someone else has one of these. Looking at data guys are posting for the 338-378 with 250s I think the 270s should go pretty fast. Please let me know how you make out for speed with them. I originally was going with the 270 TSX but initial light loads with the 270 Hornady shot bad so I went with the longer 300 gr. Data for this gun is all over the place, Barnes lists 107 grs as max while others go as high as 118 grs.

I dont know where this cartridge ends... my 2nd 378 has a 24" 1-10 twist and I still can get 3100 on a 300tsx. I do not know why more people dont buy 378s as fanatical as people are about velo.

quote:

Originally posted by smallfry:
I dont know where this cartridge ends... my 2nd 378 has a 24" 1-10 twist and I still can get 3100 on a 300tsx. I do not know why more people dont buy 378s as fanatical as people are about velo.

I KNOW why I don't own one.....the H&H version is all the recoil I can handle and then sometimes that's too much!!!!!.

I once had a client named Wolfgang Ritzy who made a Texas heart shot on a puku with a 378 Weatherby. He was using 300 grain Barnes X bullets. The puku, which is about the size of a whitetail, was 50 yards away. He knocked it down but it got up and went another 50 yards.

Wolfgang shot again and this time it went down for good. Both bullets were still in the puku. The first went lengthwise through the animal and ended up perfectly expanded on the chest. It got up after that shot. The second shot hit the spine and the bullet stayed in the spine but lost the petals.

It made me realize that if you can't kill a puku with shock or so called energy dump with a 378 Weatherby and 300 grain X bullets at 50 yards then energy figures don't mean much.

They rate the ability of a cartridge to do work against other cartridges but they don't mean that the work will get done.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

I've about giving up on finding a decent load for my .378. It's probably not the cartridges' fault but the thing just sprays every which way.

Most likely it's the bedding or maybe the barrel but I'm frustrated.

I've shot subminute groups with the .460, .416, .458 and a couple of the NE cartridges so I don't think it's me. A few friends have played with this rifle and can't get any more consistent results than me. It will shoot a decent group and then the next 5 groups will be 8" to 12"!

It's a German Mark V in a Japanese stock with quality steel mounts and a new Leupold. The bedding has been done a couple times and I've tried a ton of different bullets and powders. I may rebed it one more time before I give up.

Kyler

Kyler,
Try another scope! Same problem I had with a rifle....almost sold the thing but tried another scope and realized there was nothing wrong with the gun, but the scope would no longer hold a zero.

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:

quote:

Originally posted by smallfry:
I dont know where this cartridge ends... my 2nd 378 has a 24" 1-10 twist and I still can get 3100 on a 300tsx. I do not know why more people dont buy 378s as fanatical as people are about velo.

I KNOW why I don't own one.....the H&H version is all the recoil I can handle and then sometimes that's too much!!!!!.

Vapo... that is the truth. My question about why you dont see more is directed twards shooters who love velo and long range and dont think about recoil until they shoot it.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Gorsline:
I once had a client named Wolfgang Ritzy who made a Texas heart shot on a puku with a 378 Weatherby. He was using 300 grain Barnes X bullets. The puku, which is about the size of a whitetail, was 50 yards away. He knocked it down but it got up and went another 50 yards.

Wolfgang shot again and this time it went down for good. Both bullets were still in the puku. The first went lengthwise through the animal and ended up perfectly expanded on the chest. It got up after that shot. The second shot hit the spine and the bullet stayed in the spine but lost the petals.

It made me realize that if you can't kill a puku with shock or so called energy dump with a 378 Weatherby and 300 grain X bullets at 50 yards then energy figures don't mean much.

They rate the ability of a cartridge to do work against other cartridges but they don't mean that the work will get done.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

Ted, Something tells me if your client had used factory loads maybe the results would of be different. It's hard for me to imagine the bullet not going all the way through. Maybe he loaded way down? Just my thoughts..steve

Kyler, I'd say try switching scopes before flogging it. My first .416 Rem drove my nuts till I changed out the fairly new Leopold. Cost me a ton of money shooting up expensive bullets. Maybe try the TSX my 338 is a one bullet gun. Lucky its the 250 Nosler.

Smallfry, what load are you useing? Looks like I've got room to go up.

FWIW when this cartridge first came out it was used on safari and reported as advertizing. The add by Weatherby stated that it was used to shoot a Cape Buffalo. That they errored and shot a bull on the front edge of a herd and the bullet (assumadly a steel copper clad solid from Hornady) completely shot thru the bull and hit another buffalo behind it. That would be spectacular except weatherby reported that the bullet totally penetrated the second buffalo and hit yet a third buffalo and killed all three animals.

I won't tell anyone this is a true story except it's true that weatherby reported it that way.

Now it's reported that it won't shoot thru a deer lengthwise.....stranger things have happened I guess.

quote:

Originally posted by Ted Gorsline:
I once had a client named Wolfgang Ritzy who made a Texas heart shot on a puku with a 378 Weatherby. He was using 300 grain Barnes X bullets. The puku, which is about the size of a whitetail, was 50 yards away. He knocked it down but it got up and went another 50 yards.

Wolfgang shot again and this time it went down for good. Both bullets were still in the puku. The first went lengthwise through the animal and ended up perfectly expanded on the chest. It got up after that shot. The second shot hit the spine and the bullet stayed in the spine but lost the petals.

It made me realize that if you can't kill a puku with shock or so called energy dump with a 378 Weatherby and 300 grain X bullets at 50 yards then energy figures don't mean much.

They rate the ability of a cartridge to do work against other cartridges but they don't mean that the work will get done.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

I am not disputing you in anyway and am not being arguementive, but, it is incredible that an X bullet didn't fully penetrate. Either a very tough puku or extreme failure on the bullets part! I wonder if that was around the time Randy Brookes was playing around with the X bullets. ( do to fouling, accuracy and expansion) I wonder if lot numbers and investigating with Barnes could yield answers.
I am not associated with Barnes, but would like to know why a 378 driving X bullets would fail to fully penetrate.

MTM I use 115 gr of 7828, but have had good luck with R22 also. Have you settled on a specific load?

Puku are no tougher than a whitetail deer. they are not tough. I do remember X bullets were new at the time but have no idea what the lot number was. it would have gone through the gut bag first. The first shot was edn to end right up the middle.

I have seen bullets do alot of strange things. I once had a client shoot a lion in the brain with a 9.3X64. It was 80 meters away and the bullet was a TUG, a tough bullet. The bullet stayed in the brain and did not exit. And yet you can take an old dried out buffalo skull and shoot through it from any angle with a 22 magnum.

VBR,


Ted Gorsline

Thanks smallfry, I've just been working up and haven't settled on anything. It's shooting better the higher I go, from here I'm just going to look for accuracy so it's nice to know a couple here shoot heavier charges. Once I've settled on a 7828 load I may try some other powders but if its going into around an inch I'll call it a day and try some 270s. I don't doubt for a second what Ted posted about the underpenetration but I've broken both shoulders of a good bull Elk with the 300 X out of a .416 Rem at 2900 fps This is a light bullet for caliber and was from some of the first ones around 89-90, possibly a year or two later. I think they'll work fine.

Some more X bullet trivia. I have a client named George who last year shot a bull eland at about 25 byards with an X bullet (not
sure of the weight) in a 416 Weatherby. It broke into five pieces, likely shaft plus 4 petals, and all five pieces exited.

VBR,

Ted Gorsline

Thanks Ted,
It seems when we think everything is figured out, Mother nature throws us a loop. Funny how animal bodies don't react the way ballistic gellatin does. For instance a bullet recovered from game always looks rougher than one from ballistic gelatin with bone added.

MTM

I was shooting a Hornaday 270 bullet, outstanding three shot groups at 100 yards

Hornaday 270 SP
Norma brass
Fed 215 primer
115 grains H-4831

I love this caliber!!!
I used to own a H&H but got ride of it and stayed with the .378

Steve

Fifteen years ago when I bought my Mark V .378 I ran into a gentlemen that hunted elk down in the Gila, southern New Mexico.
He stated that he knew where some elk were using this meadow in the early morning for feeding. He tied up his horse and mule and slowly moved to the meadows edge at first light he spotted a medium size 5x5 bull and a few cows at a distance of five hundred plus yards. When the bull turned broadside he took a shot using a old dead tree as a rest. The bullet hit the elk just behind the shoulder and fell instantly to the ground, the bull then got back up with wobble legs turn and 180 degrees and fell again never to get up. When he rode his horse over to the animal he said the animal was dead. Long shot.

Steve

Was that with the 378 Steve? What scope are you useing on yours?

MTM

Yes .378... I had a Swarovski however, I didn't like the eye relief with that much recoil, so I switch back to Leupold.
The Swarovski let me get up to close and personal OUCH. The Leupold has never hit me in the eye socket and has held together for fifteen plus years.

Steve

Thanks Steve, I've got a 2.5x8 on mine. Biggest scope I own, should be on a long range gun. Just enough eye relief.

Interesting thread.

Even an X-bullet is a "softpoint" and designed to limit penetration. Still, it would be among the best penetrators among "explosive-entry" bullets.

I shot an 1800 pound bison with a Barnes XLC and an iron-sighted .500 A-Square. 570 grains at 2405 fps MV impacting at 75 yards.

It was a hasty offhand shot as he was alert, disturbed and aware of the stalk and chase, and tensed with adrenaline, a split second before flight. It hit too high broaside on his right, above the heart and great vessels, below the spine, and clipped lungs only, as far as vitals are concerned. It knocked him flat over onto his left side.

He got up and fled straight away immediately. A "Portuguese Heart Shot" with a solid was next, a few seconds later. He went down then, and stayed where he fell. That was a GSC .510/570 grain FN at just over 2400 fps MV also.

Since he was still thrashing on his keel with all four legs folded, I did a "Texas heart Shot" on the ground, with a second GSC FN. He fell over on his side, again, and moved no more but for agonal breathing.

I walked up to point blank and shot him in the chest one last time with a second XLC.

Both XLC's were perfect mushrooms with all four petals intact, found under the offside hide of the chest.

Both FN solids had entered the rump and exited the neck of the bull, and may still be orbiting.

That gets to the point of my rambling above. An exit would have occurred on something as small as a puku, with a broadside. From stem to stern however, even the puku becomes "big game."

I shot a whitetail buck through the chest with a .375 RUM using a 300 grain Swift A-Frame at 2800 fps. That certainly went out the other side, leaving a hole in the off-side hide about an inch in diameter. Those Swifts will penetrate less than an X-Bullet, most likely, due to bigger frontal expansion. Higher velocity with a Swift might make it penetrate less, if it makes the expanded diameter greater, eh?

I think most will be able to draw the proper conclusions about bullet design/construction, impact velocity, resistance, penetration, and predictability ... or rather unpredictability, with non-homogeneous and physiologically variable animal targets.

BTW, IMR-7828 does seem to be THE POWDER for the .378 Weatherby. 111.0 grains of it with the Sierra GameKing is close to 2900 fps in my 25" CZ, and sub-MOA in the hammer forged CZ barrel. I like it. I will have to up the charge with the TSX 300 grainer.

quote:

Originally posted by ROSCOE:
Kyler,
Try another scope! Same problem I had with a rifle....almost sold the thing but tried another scope and realized there was nothing wrong with the gun, but the scope would no longer hold a zero.

I had the same problem with a .340 wby. and a pentax scope. I put leupold on the thing & problem solved

My standard plinking load is 115 grs H4831 (weighed), 250 gr Sierra, CCI250 primers, all in Weatherby brass. These will group within 1-1/2" at 100 yards until the barrel gets hot (which doesn't take many rounds). This cartridge is the best combination of speed and power there is. Sadly no longer chambered by Weatherby.

Shot the 378 again today. With the 300 TSX 113 grs. of 7828 got very sight ejector marks, hardly noticible but obviousely reached the top with this bullet. Accuracy still good at slightly over 1" but going to back off to 111 grs and consider that max. I'm posting this because this is a fairly new bullet, I didn't have data for this bullet so thats what it does in my gun.

So, are the 378 shooters here using muzzle breaks or can you all shoot this round from the bench without one? If so, a .8 group impresses the heck outta me.

I'd be more interested in it if I could shoot it "nekked" but without a break, I'd rather shoot 10 rounds from my 505 than 2 from a bare-barreled 378.

quote:

Originally posted by MTM:
Shot the 378 again today. With the 300 TSX 113 grs. of 7828 got very sight ejector marks, hardly noticible but obviousely reached the top with this bullet. Accuracy still good at slightly over 1" but going to back off to 111 grs and consider that max. I'm posting this because this is a fairly new bullet, I didn't have data for this bullet so thats what it does in my gun.

Thanks for the info about 7828. I load your loads this week.thanks..steve

quote:

Originally posted by tiggertate:
So, are the 378 shooters here using muzzle breaks or can you all shoot this round from the bench without one? If so, a .8 group impresses the heck outta me.

I'd be more interested in it if I could shoot it "nekked" but without a break, I'd rather shoot 10 rounds from my 505 than 2 from a bare-barreled 378.

no muzzle brake here on my 378 or 460 what so ever.

Steve

Then I would certify you as "recoil-proof". I find the recoil from a 378 about as obnoxious as it gets; worse than a 460.

No brake on my gun either. I think my old #1 460 kicked way worse than this Mark 5. I think I've stated this before but this is my first actual WBY rifle and I firmly believe it handles recoil very well. I'm useing a Past Pad under my jacket, it helps a lot. Don't know about prone, uphill in a t-shirt though.

I have never owned (or fired) a Mark V, but have fired my Harris Talon .378 Wby. from the bench and from the prone position (exploding a groundhog). The rifle is NOT braked. It shoots factory 270 gr Barnes X loads to about ~.8 inches at 100 yards, so I have never even bothered to work up another hunting load for it (although I did work up a plinking load with 270 gr Hornady softs).

I think the .378's recoil is overrated. The Ruger RSM in .458 Lott with the garbage factory recoil pad (before I switched it) was far more painful than my .378, which has a decent pad. That being said, I have gotten knocked in the head above the eye a few times by the scope, although it only drew blood once. I really need to replace the Burris Scope I have on it to one with more eye relief...

I shot my .378 Weatherby Mag thirteen years without a muzzle break, last summer I had one installed. Bad mistake I'm going to remove it and screw on a cap and go back to shooting without a break. .378 is by far the hardest kicking caliber I have ever put up to my shoulder.

Good Shooting

Steve