I have a large supply on hand of the old Remington 405gr SP .458" bullet.

My best load for my (miroku) Win 1885 45/70 prints 5 shot cloverleafs at 100yds. I'd like use it for a black bear hunt next spring.

I'm getting 1880 fps muzzle velocity, but knowing this is a pretty soft bullet meant for normal lever gun use, does anyone know what a "proper" terminal velocity range is for this bullet?

I'm expecting ranges from 25-200 yds on the hunt, just making sure when close-in that bullet at 1800+ won't just come apart on impact and limit penetration.

Or at 405 grains against a black bear a done deal regardless?

I tried looking through the pinned post about Michael458's work, but that's a lot of info...

I have used them at over 2500 fps in the 458 accrel and near that in the 458 winmag.. i THINK they are fine under 2000 fps, but even at light speed they "expand" and pass clean through big pigs...

iirc they are meant for 1500fps impact, but my personal experience says they'll do fine at higher speeds. I don't believe 300 lbs in black bear or boar is a measurable difference .. they'll be fine, hit hard, and deliver the game

quote:

I'm getting 1880 fps muzzle velocity, but knowing this is a pretty soft bullet meant for normal lever gun use, does anyone know what a "proper" terminal velocity range is for this bullet?

Don't worry the terminal velocity well be just fine.

I use them in my 458 Lott for deer they can be explosive at high velocity but carry enough weight to give expressive results. If you want to be rid of them I would be interested. But I think they would be perfect for the 45-70

An excellent bullet for the hunt are describing.

I have used them many years in a 45/70 lever action. My experience is that 2000 fps is the maximum velocity to push them. They fully expand and the core and jacket start to come apart at this speed.

I have used the Speer 350s on bear; they are made tougher; they kill them very dead very quickly. marlin 45-70. Those 405s are made thin and for black powder velocities. Not hot loads.

I agree with DPCD they are too soft, even on deer sometimes, did not quite work for me on occasions.

I still have a bunch. Worked great on a black bear at 100 yds going away. Hit in short ribs and made exit on offside just behind the shoulder. DRT. MV from my Marlin ~ 2110 fps, impact at ~ 1835 fps. Have also used the 400gr Speer at 1865 fps MV, impact velocity ~1550 fps. Dead bear at ten yards from where hit. Bullet retained 90.5%, expanded over 1". It's a lot softer than the 405 Remington.

I heard stories that Remington made that 405 softer also for a period and then went back to the original. Mine are not soft, and have a much better BC than the Speer, and are also dual diameter - the first half being a "bore rider". If the ones you have are like mine, I'd have no fear of pushing them to 2000 fps at least.

Bob
www.bigbores.ca

I liked the 350 gr RN Hornady back in the day in my 86 in 45-90 on deer and elk, later on I went to the thick jacket Hawk.Im sure there are better bullets than any factory bullet for the 45-70.