MY LATEST 4-GUN BIG BORE RIFLE PROJECT - TONGUE-IN-CHEEK

Hello All,

I thought to share my latest "Big Bore" rifle project.

I've always been partial to rifles with Martini actions, and I have 17 in my collection by various makers from .22 short up to 12 gauge.
Some are commercial, some are custom, some are customized. Well, here are 4 from my latest project.

I call them my "Mini-Big-Bores". All are built on commercial BSA M-15 actions with custom barrels, custom stocks, and custom forends.
The first 3 are identical, weighing 7 pounds 5 ounces each. The last one has a bull-barrel with an upgraded rear sight. It weighs 9 pounds 6 ounces.

Calibers are: 297-230 Morris Short - 297-230 Morris Long - 297-230 Morris Magnum - 297-250 Rook



The 297-230 Morris Short and Long are British Cartridges that were used for training and practice. A special "Morris" adapter tube was inserted into the barrel of a 577-450 Martini Military rifle, with no other changes. The 297-250 Rook is a standard "old-school" cartridge for Rook (crow) rifles. The 297-230 Morris Magnum is a "new world" wildcat designed to obtain higher velocities. All the cartridges can be formed from 22 Hornet brass by trimming and inside neck reaming. It only took me 10 hours to prepare brass and load 50 cartridges for each rifle. (200 total) The 3 Morris cartridges are loaded with 45g .223 dia. bullets, and the Rook is loaded with a 50g .251 dia. bullet.

Here's the fun part ........

Recoil energy for "maximum loads" in rifle order is ..... 0.08 ft/lbs - 0.29 ft/lbs - 0.3 ft/lbs - 0.22 ft/lbs

When compared to the recoil energy of my 700NE at 115 ft/lbs - it means I can shoot the 297-230 Short a total of 1,437 times to equal the recoil energy of 1 shot with the 700NE. The 297-230 Magnum has 4 times the recoil energy of the short, so shooting it 383 times equals 1 shot with the 700NE. Shooting these Mini-Big-Bores is a welcome break between shots when shooting the "real" Big Bores. Another plus is powder efficiency because I can load 90 of the 297-230 Morris Short cartridges for each 700NE cartridge. The last picture is to scale.

As always, your comments are welcome.

love the effort!! you stayed with the paradigm the entire time! well done! i was chuckling pretty heavily on this.. only thing better would be if you had played with the 6.8 rather than the 25 ACP as the basis!!
i really like rook rifles.. though i adore and love park rifles ..

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
love the effort!! you stayed with the paradigm the entire time! well done! i was chuckling pretty heavily on this.. only thing better would be if you had played with the 6.8 rather than the 25 ACP as the basis!!
i really like rook rifles.. though i adore and love park rifles ..

Hello jeffeosso,
Thanks for the reply.

The basis was the 22 hornet. Now that I've made the brass, it should last a lifetime of shooting. After fire-forming, I neck size only.

yeppers.. but the .251 bullets... for laughs, i have a "low recoil" load for my 257 bob with acp bullets ... 1 they RARELY make it to the target with chrono showing STUPID vels, if it reads (blue streak anyone) and 2 the "groups" looks like 000buck at 50 yards ... with 10 rounds making perhaps 3 holes ..

Nice collection of custom rook rifles, like the sights on them

quote:

Originally posted by jeffeosso:
yeppers.. but the .251 bullets... for laughs, i have a "low recoil" load for my 257 bob with acp bullets ... 1 they RARELY make it to the target with chrono showing STUPID vels, if it reads (blue streak anyone) and 2 the "groups" looks like 000buck at 50 yards ... with 10 rounds making perhaps 3 holes ..

Hello jeffeosso'
Thanks for the reply.

Chronograph velocities are: 740 fps for the SHORT - 1365 fps for the LONG - 1475 fps for the MAGNUM - 1305 fps for the ROOK

I've been shooting indoors at 50 feet to work up loads. I plan to test outdoors at 50 yards on the next nice day.

quote:

Originally posted by wildmansix:
Nice collection of custom rook rifles, like the sights on them

Hello wildmansix,
Thanks for the reply.

The three 297-230 rifles have A-17 front sights with original BSA No. 30 rear sights. The Rook has an A-17 front sight with an upgraded Parker Hale PH15A rear sight.

Very nice flinch-prevention rifles.
Sure would be fun to squirrel hunt with them.

If ever presented with a mass attack by any hordes of small pests, have four ammobearers with you, each one with his specific box of ammo, for greatest speed in reloading.
You will be responsible for handing off each rifle to the proper ammobearer for the reload.
Or just shoot your shorts in all of them,
and try not to crap your pants if overrun.
Fix bayonets !
Butt stroke to varmint !

What is with .223 bullets and .251 bullets in .297 rifles?
I vaguely remember the .297 from reading about old cartridges, but did not pay enough attention to that lesson.
Now I understand just how useful the .297 rifle can be.

Rip ...

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
Very nice flinch-prevention rifles.
Sure would be fun to squirrel hunt with them. ........... What is with .223 bullets and .251 bullets in .297 rifles?
I vaguely remember the .297 from reading about old cartridges, but did not pay enough attention to that lesson.
Now I understand just how useful the .297 rifle can be.

Rip ...

Hello RIP,
Thanks for the reply.

Here is the wikipedia link that gives some additional information.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.297/230_Morris

Here are the links that tell about the 3 different cartridges.

http://www.cartridgecollector.net/297230-morris-short
http://www.cartridgecollector.net/297230-morris-long
http://www.cartridgecollector.net/297250-rook-rifle

The 297-230 Magnum has no vintage reference.

At first I wasn't sure what the "297" stood for - but I knew it was not the bullet dia. Later I found an explanation in the book; "Centerfire American and British Pistol and Revolver Cartridges" by "The National Rifle Association Library Book". (see below)

The 297 is the approximate Head Diameter of the cartridge (.297") and the 230 is the approximate bullet diameter. (.230") I think the "230" may actually be groove diameter for black powder loads, with an original bullet of .225 diameter, so that the over-size groove was to allow for the black powder fowling. Original factory loading had a grease wad and a cloth wad under the bullet to reduce that fowling.



The barrels on my guns are modern of .224 groove dia. but I use .223 dia bullets to be on the safe side when experimenting with smokeless powders for these rifles. No confident data exists for smokeless powder. I'm using 2400 and I'll likely switch to .224 dia. bullets in the future.

buckstix,

Thanks, another British cartridge naming convention that is as clear as mud, as usual.
The Eley Bros. book is where I saw the .297/230 Morris Short & Long.
The Long is just the Short with a longer neck,
like baby .461 Gibbs No. 1 & 2.

Rip ...

quote:

Originally posted by RIP:
buckstix,

Thanks, another British cartridge naming convention that is as clear as mud, as usual.
The Eley Bros. book is where I saw the .297/230 Morris Short & Long.
The Long is just the Short with a longer neck,
like baby .461 Gibbs No. 1 & 2.

Rip ...

Hello RIP,
Thanks for the reply.

Yes, the longer neck of the LONG increases case capacity that allows "twice" as much powder than the SHORT.

quote:

Originally posted by buckstix:
Yes, the longer neck of the LONG increases case capacity that allows "twice" as much powder than the SHORT.

Then the longer neck in the .297/.230 "Morris" Long was of much greater relative benefit than for the Gibbs .461 No.1 & No.2,
where it allowed only to increase a 90-grain charge to 100 grains of BP in the Express load.

Read of the devil on the internet and he appears !
Reading a Donald Dallas book today I see pictured a "Morris" .230 Short and this:

"Rook and rabbit rifles were designed to fire at a range of between 50 to 100 yds
using a small charge of powder and small bullet to ensure that the spent bullet did not travel too far;
as J.H. Walsh in the Modern Sportsman's Gun and Rifle put it
'with larger bullets, the danger of wounding labourers in the fields,
and others out of sight of the shooter, is largely increased'."

I thought that Walsh quote was quite Victorian.
I could almost here it being spoken with a mouth-full-of-marbles British accent.
Pip, pip, cheerio.

Rip ...

Hello RIP,
Thanks for the reply.

Another advantage of the little SHORT cartridge is that it travels slow enough, that if the bullet is off course, you can run along side and "poke" it with your finger to redirect it to the target.