I was talking to a old timer rifleman/hunter/gunsmith the other day about shooting the 45-70 with 400grain bullets,he said that the U.S. Army had it figured right 100 years ago,that a 400 or 405 grain bullet would shoot thru a deer or bear long ways,does anyone have a picture of one of these bullets taken from game and is the 300 grain hollow point pretty much only good for paper punching/varmints like he claimed/not enough penetration /knock down /on heavy game?He also said the 500grainers gave up to much in trajectory and not worth the trouble..I wonder what that trajectory will be inside 75yards?He claimed adamently that the 400/405 grainers were the best all round bullets with boo-coos penetration on biggame...Iam wanting to load some up for black bear & Boar/deer season which is right around the corner,average shot will be 75yards & under on ridge tops /river bottoms and mountain Laural thickets..Iron sights only which bullet would you use?Speer 400FN or Remington 405FN?Others?Thanks in advance for any suggestions...

The factory 300 grain bullets have a good velocity but will not hold up on anything larger than caribou. The two exceptions are the Barnes X bullet and the Nosler Partition Gold bullet. The work wonderfully. There are several good 350 grain bullets that will work for just about anything you will run into.

I have used the Speer 400 grain bullet for years. It is very accurate and as long as you keep it under 1900 fps it will kill anything. I've heard good things about the Remington bullet but have never used it.

The army tested the 45/70 in the 1880s. It had a maximum effective range of 3600 yards. At that range the 405 grain bullet penetrated 4 one inch pine boards and lodged in the fifth. The 500 grain bullet penetrated all five pine boards and went 5 inches into the sand below them.

Being able to hit a target is more understanding the trajectory of the bullet than the bullet going too slow to get there. When tha army tested their loads one of the testers was able to regularly hit a 6 foot square target at 2500 yards. That was with the standard issued sights on the Trapdoor rifle. Today shooters are routinely hitting the targets at over 1000 yards and keeping their groups within 1 to 1 1/2 min of angle. Kenny Wasserburger is shooting at a target one mile away and hitting it regularly. Hope that helps. Jim

PS. With a good vernier sight I have taken caribou out to 300 yards with Sharps in 45/70 using 430 grain cast bullets at around 1300 fps. They all expired soon there after.

I use woodleigh 400gs in my 458 AR for deer, far less explosive than rem 405s...

1750fps, with that pointy bullet, will do wonders, but NOT for lever guns... its got a tiny FP nose.
jeffe

I started with the 45-70 way back in the old days (late 1980s early 1990s) before the 45-70 became really popular with the guide guns and super hard cast bullets. It had a small following in the woods of PA for black bear and deer. Almost everyone used 300g factory hollow points. They work spectacularly for deer, and are well designed for that purpose. Trajectory is no issue at all, just zero your rifle at 100 yards and you are good out to 125 with no thinking, thats miles in the mountain laurel.

For 400 grainers the Speer is my choice at 1700-1800 fps. It gives decent expansion for quick kills. No need for a bullet that gives super penetration for North American game. Its way more than is needed for deer but if you think that 600 pound bear is out there its nice to have. Same thing about trajectory, zero at 100 and you're good to 125. Once you know the rifle you can zero a bit higher and place shots out to 175 yards if needed.

I have used weights hunting from 300 to 500 in mine.
The 350's have been my choice. They have taken Whitetail from 15-100 yds as well as a couple of 550lb black bears in Canada last year. Of the two bears one was a pass through from 30 yards and one bullet was recovered in the hide on the off side. These were Hornady 350 RN at 2100 fps.

Blackbearhunter

What 45/70 rifle do you have?

Ruger #1,I got her irons zeroed today at 50yrds.

I too have a Ruger No1.

I have only killed deer with mine.

I have used a couple of different 300gr bullets, the 350 Hornady RN, and the Speer 400gr.

All were loaded over 56 gr of IMR 3031.

CAUTION... WARNING...

My No1 is an older model and the throat has apparently been changed as one of my friends 45/70 No1's could not take those loads, as I seated my bullets out past the factory crimp to tell them from factory loads, and lighter reloads suitable for the Marlin Lever.

I like the 350gr Hornady RN the best. If I was going to hunt black bear with the No1 in 45/70 that is the bullet I would use.

If I was going to use the Speer 400gr, [a good bullet] I would keep it under 1900fps as a previous poster suggested.

I personally like the Bear Tooth Bullets 425 Pile Driver. I'm going to warn you that it does a ton of damage to the meat, if you hit the shoulder, but does well if placed right behind it. One of the largest meplats you can get, and very short for it's weight. I like it in the leverguns and in BFR revolvers, but you could go with about anything in a #1 at that short of a range. You might want to try Barnes 300 X-bullet. It will kill deer easily, leaves a slightly smaller entrance hole and might not go all the way through past 75 yards. No lead in the meat either.