As much as I like the new Rugers they are still relatively inexpensive bolt rifles with plain, soft American walnut stocks which, on hard recoiling rifles like the 375 should be properly and soundly bedded.

quote:

Originally posted by Paolo9,5x73:

quote:

Originally posted by eurocentric:
Purchased a new Ruger Hawkeye in .375 Ruger. Did a basic inspection and cleaned the bore and action first. Fired 16 Rounds (Hornady factory ammo 270 grains) at 50 yards. Accuracy was very good (3" groups), firing open sights, cracked stock after 14th round. Fired two more rounds and the bullets were not even hitting a target at 25 yds. I plan on having the stock replaced, this rifle should really be 9-10 lbs, glass bedded and dual crossbolts. In its factory configuration its too light, it kicks more than a 375 H&H firing 300 grains. I would have been happy to have paid an extra $300 for Ruger to have made it heavier and sturdier. Just an amateur's opinion.

The 'African' is very handy rifle, but:
1. Jucier recoil pad is needed
2. The barrel on two I examined was not centered in the stock.
3. The best quoted price was $869
For just over $500 I bought new CZ550 'Medium' (std. action length) FS 9.3x62 with rings.
One can get QUALITY PPU ammo to the door step for $20/box, and nothing needs to be done to the rifle prior to field use.
Oh yes, they load rounds with 286gr oryx slugs 2hrs from my home at $40/20 pack.
The 'African' is nice handling piece, but I just don't want to spend extra time tinkering with it.
PS. Ruger does make heavy .375H&H built on gigantish magnum action and 270gr SP Hornady "Heavy Mag' Interlocks start flight at avg Vo of 2870fps. Me thinks you have purchased wrong Ruger.

Paolo, I agree with you about the 9.3X62 and the Ruger Safari Magnum. I think the "Hawkeye" is much better suited for the 9.3X62 and wish Ruger had chambered it in that caliber instead of the .375 Ruger. I have a CZ 550 American in 9.3X62 and it is a joy to carry and shoot and several hundred dollars less than the Ruger in .375 Ruger. I also have a Ruger Safari Magnum in .375 H&H. It is a bit on the heavy side but, as a consequence, it is very easy to shoot.

Dave

Interesting, All the CZ-550's around here are as much as the Ruger $800 +/-. The Ruger Safari Magmum is lighter and less bulky than any CZ-550 I've handled. Just my observation.

Had extensive conversations with Ruger Wednesday, yesterday and today, I did voice my recommendations about the rifle. They requested I ship the rifle to them for inspection and replacement, which I wont do, I plan on replacing the stock anyways. They did report that there have been a few complaints and reports of regarding the wood, but they attribute them to poor shipping packaging and careless handling by shooters, not one of them (ruger employees) considered anything wrong with the current configuration. Again, my only reason for calling was to suggest improvements for the current hawkeye model, I am impressed with its accuracy and quick cycling. I do prefer wood over synthetic. One of the sales persons mentioned complaints numbered around 50, from cracks to chipping to loosening, from estimated 5,000+ sold. The insinuation from another employee was that it was a very low figure for such a high-powered rifle. I have a second hawkeye and had it inspected as well, and the gunsmith informed me it is sound.

I honestly dont know if that is a high or low figure, any thoughts on this?

quote:

Originally posted by boom stick:
Good luck and keep us posted about how Ruger deals with this issue.

I would love to see a kevlar or carbon fiber stock for the 375 Ruger.

I am not a fan of the rubber overmold.

Sorry to hear about your cracked stock. I went the CZ Safari Magnum route, there were a lot of great reveiws and a few really bad ones. I sprung for the glass bedding, dual crossbolts, etc. had to send it back once but the love the gun. It was a lot more expensive (I went for the fancy stock), cost me $2100 after all was said and done. Mine weighs just over 11 lbs (I had the mercury recoil reducer added). Here's a link to my post on it. Stay the course with your Ruger, it sounds like a great cartridge, and make Ruger fix it for you.

https://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/4711043/m/440108918

quote:

Originally posted by chuck375:

I went the CZ Safari Magnum route...Mine weighs just over 11 lbs

Pretty gun but that's a SERIOUSLY HEAVY .375!

I know, the plan is to eventually rebarrel to .470 Capstick so I figured I'd get used to the weight. I shoot more than I carry it (opposite of a guide or a PH), so I don't mind carrying a couple of extra pounds when I do hunt. My .270 weighs 9 lbs with scope, and I've been hoofing that up and down the rockies hunting elk for along time.

quote:

Originally posted by eurocentric:
Purchased a new Ruger Hawkeye in .375 Ruger. Did a basic inspection and cleaned the bore and action first. Fired 16 Rounds (Hornady factory ammo 270 grains) at 50 yards. Accuracy was very good (3" groups), firing open sights, cracked stock after 14th round. Fired two more rounds....

Not sure why you'd keep firing rounds after the stock cracked. By that point the action screws were probably off torque and you may have caused more damage than necessary. Did you remove the barreled action from the stock during your inspection? If so, what torque settings did you use on the action screws when you put it back together??

I also don't understand why you refuse to allow Ruger to replace the stock. If you intend to use an aftermarket stock, you should want to keep an unaltered factory stock in the event you need to send the rifle to Ruger for any future repair. Let them replace the stock if it is their fault.

As to your suggestion that this particular rifle needs to be heavy, I completely disagree. It is only a 375H&H class rifle and having it out the box in a moderate weight/more compact package w/ great fixed sights is as much a plus to the overall package as the 375R cartridge itself. I actually cut a bit more weight off mine and find it ideal for such a rifle. It has stout recoil, but it is still not in the same league as 416+ rifles.

Send it back and let it be fixed. If you intend to use the replacement wood stock, epoxy an all-thread rod through the webbing between the trigger and mag box inlets. You can counter sink that and fill the recess w/ black epoxy such as marine-tex and it will look like the past Winchester M70 stocks. Properly bed the rifle and relieve the tang, and you should have no issues.

GVA

I talked to a local gun smith about having my .375R African glass bedded. He asked why and I told him that there have been reprots of the stock cracking. He told me if you keep the the action and barrel tightened to the stock there should be no problem. He stated that many of the problems of cracked stock could be linked to loose screws. So if the screws loosen with fireing it could be the culpret.

Any thoughts?

I don't know if he is full of shit or not, but my action is tightened down and so far I have seen not cracking. I only have 40 rounds through it, all factory 270 grain rounds. I'm going to put another box through it this week and I wwill report back. I love the wood stock and would hate to go to a synthetic. Maybe a stock from another manufaturer would be better.

I´m bumping this one guys.
Any further news about stock problems with the African?

Am about to pick up my 375 Ruger African tomorrow, and have just a little concern about the stock / bedding.
Guess I´ll have it bedded and a Pacmayr Decellerator installed.

Really looking forward to get my hands on this one

On the Ruger with that angled front bolt, you definitely need to check to make sure they don't loosen after the first five or six shots. I have seen this happen even with .270's and '06's, so it would be a real problem on a .375. I would say a bit of glass would be a good idea at the start on a .375.

quote:

Originally posted by Arild Iversen:


Am about to pick up my 375 Ruger African tomorrow, and have just a little concern about the stock / bedding.
Guess I´ll have it bedded and a Pacmayr Decellerator installed.

IMO this is a wise decision!

I have put over 150 rounds through the African with NO problems, I DID RE-BED the rifle before I shot the first shot as I always do to any factory rifle. I think the weight is perfect on the rifle, I am shooting loads that match the 375 H&H and don't feel a need for speed when the velocities of the 375 H&H have done quite well the past 90 some years on all manner of game.

About 100 rnds thru mine and no issues either. I haven't done anything to the rifle other than clean shoot clean shoot clean shoot and clean shoot. I'd like to bed it just for something to do if nothing else.

Hey Dirk, thanks for nothing you turkey! I usually enjoy at least several trips to the range to work up good loads for a new rifle. Due to your advise I ended up with good accurate loads on the first trip! Jerk!

Now what am I going to do with my time?

Ruger replaced my stock, but I did add a second cross-bolt and have not experienced any issues since. I attended a gun sale at Cabelas in PA and met with 5 other fellows whom had experienced issues similar to mine.

Here is my opinion on the .375 Ruger; nothing more then my personal bias.



1) I do not believe adding 50-100fps MV to the .375H&H velocity will make a hill-of-beans difference.
2) Any competent rifleman shooting appropriate bullets out of a .375H&H is looking at a dead animal, providing they place that first shot properly.
3) Since the competent rifleman places that shot properly to start with, the argument for rapid fire follow-up shots is weak IMHO.
4) I bet that any experienced rifleman that does an honest rapid-fire test comparison of the .375H&H vs the .375Ruger is not going to find any difference in speed of fire, cycling the action etc...
5) All of the original conditions that dictated the original .375H&H cartridge design still exist today; that is that the beautiful taper of that case allows effortless feeding and extraction in any situation!

I am aiming comments at Phil Shoemaker, since I know he loves the round and is "selling" it in an upcoming Rifle Magazine article. No offense Phil, but I bet if you did a rapid-fire test, between the H&H and Ruger .375's, your firing times would not be any different, certainly not enough to justify the shorter case's theoretical advantage, which is a selling point of the round.
If you have done such a test Phil, I would love to know the outcome!

I do agree that the Ruger Hawkeye is a fantastic value! The Ruger rifle package/value is the #1 sellingpoint of it in my opinion, nothing about the mathematics of the cartridge design convince me different.

There is one definite benefit to the .375Ruger and that is that some guys are going to part with their .375H&H and this is good news for me and all the other riflemen that do not own the noble .375 H&H cartridge, true King of the .375's!

I hope they do sell lots of them, because I will am hoping to scoop a .375H&H that somebody unloads.


Any comments are welcome, from Phil Shoemaker or any other objective AR members!

Alternatively, one could say that the only thing the 375 H&H has on the 375 Ruger is that it came first.

I own both the H&H and Ruger and don't prefer one over the other really.

I bought a LH Remington a few years ago and have been very happy with it. The H&H is very accurate and I've used it on a quite large bull moose here in Dillingham and on a trip to Zimbabwe last fall. The buffalo and plainsgame I took with the H&H seemed to think the H&H had not lost any stopping power since it's creation in 1912.

I bought, use and like the Ruger 375 because it was promoted as a comparable cartridge to the H&H and came in a LH configuration in a CRF action for a reasonable price. For us lefties, there aren't many options and compared to buying a Safari Grade Pre 64 Winchester, the Ruger African seems like a real value.

As moose season seemes to be wetter than not the last few years, I'm not sure I'll be using the pretty African this fall. The Remington H&H is better suited for bathing. When I travel back to Zimbabwe in '09 to hunt again I'm not sure I'll bring the Ruger there either due to potential lost luggage/ ammo issues.

The .375 Ruger 'shore looks good out on the rifle range!

Going for the Ruger 375 was a pretty simple decision for me.
I had promised my son my M70 Safari Express i 375 H&H as a graduation present for his PhD, and was looking around for another (big) medium bore for myself within my budget.

Then the Ruger 375 came up in a handy package, and based on comments from a few guys here on AR, among them Canuck, I decided to go for the Ruger.
Got it yesterday, and so far only fondling
but it looks ok.

The open sights suited my ugly face in an exellent way, just lika shotgun.
Looking forward to burn powder with this one

quote:

Originally posted by Scott King:
Hey Dirk, thanks for nothing you turkey! I usually enjoy at least several trips to the range to work up good loads for a new rifle. Due to your advise I ended up with good accurate loads on the first trip! Jerk!

Now what am I going to do with my time?

Scott, sorry I rained on your load work up party at the range, maybe next time. Dirk

No question the Ruger Hawkeye is a fantastic bargain, that alone will likely put the .375Ruger over big time.

Is there an experienced rifleman out there that has put the two head-to-head and tested them? I'd love to hear comments about that if anyone has.

I see a .375H&H in my future. I am hopelessly nostalgic, for instance I am still convinced that the .300H&H is the finest .300 magnum...

Isn't the 375 Rooger being hyped as faster than the H&H version, with only needing a 20" barrel to do so? Because a 20" barrel is so much handier?

Then why is a 23" barrel on the hawkeye?

Rooger ad

If the 375 Ruger is lounching the Swift A-Frame with the same speed as my 375 H&H did, hit the point of aim with just as good accuracy and function as flawlessy, then I´m a satisfied customer.
And I see no reason whay I should not be...

About nostalgia and such, I´m not that much concerned.
But as a user of the fine 375 H&H for more than 20 years I understand the feelings

Personally I believe there are simply too many fine .375H&H rifles and fans of the cartridge to ever see it die, but I believe the .375Ruger will be the "red-headed step-child" to it...

I wonder if a man can get a Ruger Hawkeye in .375H&H?

I don't want to get off topic, but does the fact that you pay the better part of $1K for a rifle and before you shoot it, you have to spend another 10-20% of the original cost "fixing" it so the stock won't crack, bother anyone else but me? It would be like going to a GM dealership and buying a $50K truck and before driving it, take it to a mechanic and put another $5-10K into it before it was usable?
Again, maybe it is just me, but when I buy something, especially a fairly expensive something, I expect it to be able to be used, for what it was designed for, as soon as I get it.

quote:

Originally posted by congomike:
I don't want to get off topic, but does the fact that you pay the better part of $1K for a rifle and before you shoot it, you have to spend another 10-20% of the original cost "fixing" it so the stock won't crack, bother anyone else but me? It would be like going to a GM dealership and buying a $50K truck and before driving it, take it to a mechanic and put another $5-10K into it before it was usable?
Again, maybe it is just me, but when I buy something, especially a fairly expensive something, I expect it to be able to be used, for what it was designed for, as soon as I get it.

If you get the ugly Hogue stock, I doubt that it would break. That cracking problem must only happen with a small number of the wooden stocked .375Rugers.

If one skims through the different posts on AR concerning big bore rifles, I guess one will find a conciderable number stating that quite a few are due to a bit of touch up, not only Ruger. CZ among other hits my mind.

I have rifles that are as they came out of the box, and other that are delt with in different ways.

A little bedding job and a better recoil pad wont hurt any rifle in this price level I guess.
If it´s really needed that´s another question.

IMHO, the selling points of the 375 Ruger over the H&H is the lighter rifle built on a less expensive non-magnum lenght action. The only 375 H&H in its price range is the CZ in heavier rifle.

So far, my only complaint on the 375 Ruger is the thin red ruger recoil pad, which I'll replace with a Pachmayer Decelerator shortly.

Troy

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:
Isn't the 375 Rooger being hyped as faster than the H&H version, with only needing a 20" barrel to do so? Because a 20" barrel is so much handier?

Then why is a 23" barrel on the hawkeye?


Rooger ad

The 23" barrel is on the African. The Alaskan has the 20" barrel. They are both versions of the Hawkeye. Get it?

Gentlemen

I brought a Ruger Hawkeye in 338 Win Mag for my 458 AccRel (AR) conversion

There is no doubt the stocks on the new wooden Hawkeye models are thinner in profile, but with a little tender loving and some attention the stock can be beefed up

I have now shot about 30 - 35 rounds thru my 458 AR and quiet a few 500 grainers at 2300 fps, recoil was swift and I'm positive quiet a bit stronger than the 375 Ruger would kick, but the walnut Hawkeye stock holds true, all of this from a hawkeye stock only intended for the 338 Win Mag



The least anybody can do if they want the gun long term is :-

duel crossbolts, a 1/4 inch wrist pin thru the pistol grip, add a second recoil lug, bedded it from tip to tang with Devcon Steel bed, most impotantly releave the rear tang from touching the action and added a limbsaver recoil pad

And I did ALL of this BEFORE I even fired a shot

I'd consider this minimal INSURANCE on these kinds of rifles, Please Don't get me wrong I'm just generalizing here, but I think it's bad form for anybody to buy a gun you know has the potential to crack the stock, you hear stories about stocks cracking, so you are aware it could happen, but you do nothing, shoot it anyway until it does crack and then complain

regards
S&F

ShortandFat I'm impressed with that bedding job. I have some rifles you could do for me!

S&F, very good comments and extremely nice bedding job! I do however think that your comment should be a generalized statement…the exception perhaps being a custom rifle where the buyer has already paid to have it well bedded...but even then I like to look “under the hood†to see how well things are put together regardless of make or model.

It’s always interesting to read the any post regarding the 375 Ruger whether discussing the cartridge or the Hawkeye rifle….really seems to bring out the lovers and the haters regardless of the question asked!

Ok, so here’s a few of my comments. Right up front I’m a native born American but have never been enamored with Winchester’s Model 70 or Remington’s Model 700 – I recognize that I’ve blasphemed too many participants of this forum but such is life – we’ll all get over it, at least I will. I do however really like standard length Model 98 Mauser action’ based sporting rifles - so my cartridges will be a bit shorter than 3.4†in OAL, 375 H&H length cartridges are not allowed, hence my use of 257 Weatherby, 264 WinMag, and 30-338 WinMag cartridges...I do enjoy maximizing my performance even though I’ve owned a few 30-06 based M98s in the past.

I like the 375 H&H cartridges; it’s spawned many derivative cartridges over its lifespan and I hope it stays alive for many years to come. It definitely would have been interesting though to imagine what would be the “popular†cartridges of the day had the world not suffered WWI and WWII in the first half of the 20th century.

I like the 375 Ruger cartridges, it has already spawned a number of derivate cartridges and only time will tell what its overall impact will be; I also hope it prospers for many years to come!

Now the CZ rifles, I don’t own one but I do like them. I do however recollect that just a few years ago CZ was having similar stock splitting problems with their heavy caliber rifles until they began using two cross bolts. I believe the bean counters at Ruger will be soon forced to allow the Hawkeyes to be fitted with two cross bolts from the factory which should eliminate their stock splitting issue as well.

So...if you like the long ones, that's OK...if you like the short ones, that's OK too...myself, I like the standard length ones so the 375 Ruger would be my choice. And, were I to not use a standard length M98 Mauser action for a 375 Ruger then I’d most likely purchase the Ruger Hawkeye.

Anyway, my two cents. Jim

quote:

Originally posted by Canuck:
Alternatively, one could say that the only thing the 375 H&H has on the 375 Ruger is that it came first.

And if the 375 Ruger came first, and the H&H was intoduced today, the shooting public would laugh at the H&H...

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:
Isn't the 375 Rooger being hyped as faster than the H&H version, with only needing a 20" barrel to do so? Because a 20" barrel is so much handier?

Then why is a 23" barrel on the hawkeye?

Rooger ad

The ruger verrsion is supposed to duplicate the velocity of the H&H in a shorter 20" barrel, but I think the African has a 23" barrel for more velocity and to look more like a rifle you would take to Africa.

quote:

Originally posted by gohip2000:

The ruger verrsion is supposed to duplicate the velocity of the H&H in a shorter 20" barrel, but I think the African has a 23" barrel for more velocity and to look more like a rifle you would take to Africa.

Since when has Rooger ever cared about looks???

[/QUOTE]
Since when has Rooger ever cared about looks???[/QUOTE]

I dont know about Rooger whoever they might be .

Sturm, Ruger & Co on the other hand has some beauties. What about the 44 mag Super Blackhawk 7 1/2 bbl single action revolver, the M77 European full stock rifle, the M77 RSM rifle or the No1 single shot rifle among a few?
They are defenately beautifull weapons in my book.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:

quote:

Originally posted by gohip2000:

The ruger verrsion is supposed to duplicate the velocity of the H&H in a shorter 20" barrel, but I think the African has a 23" barrel for more velocity and to look more like a rifle you would take to Africa.

Since when has Rooger ever cared about looks???

Could ask the same about Remington.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:


Since when has Rooger ever cared about looks???

Ruger rifles look fine to me, although I must say that form trails function by a long margin, when it comes to hunting rifles.

quote:

Originally posted by onefunzr2:

quote:

Originally posted by gohip2000:

The ruger verrsion is supposed to duplicate the velocity of the H&H in a shorter 20" barrel, but I think the African has a 23" barrel for more velocity and to look more like a rifle you would take to Africa.

Since when has Rooger ever cared about looks???

Why do you have such a bug up your ass about rugers? Just wondering.

Demonical, I am not trying to sell anything, only reporting on my experiences and I stand by everything I have said about the 375 Ruger. In my opinion it is an genuine improvement over the 375 H&H.
No one will notice any difference on game and only a very few who are intimately familiar and competent with bolt rifles, especially those who use them on dangerous game, will see any difference in a shorter case. A slightly shorter bolt throw doesn't seem like it would matter that much, unless you are under stress and your life is at stake, then it seems to matter a lot!
The real difference is that they can be chambered in standard actions which are commonly available and cheaper to manufacturer. That is why the 300 Win so quickly supplanted the 300H&H.

I purchased two Ruger 375"s as soon as they came out - one Alaskan and one African - and have used them now for over a year. My son recently returned from working in Zambia in order to guide this spring bear season. He was so impressed with the Ruger that as soon as bear season ended he went out and bought a stainless ALaskan and swapped me out of the wooden stock from the African. He has pronounced it THE perfect Alaskan rifle that will do for everything is Africa as well.

I have not sold either of my 375 H&H rifles but I have been able to compare them all side by side and, nostalgia aside, I like the Ruger better. I am not alone in this opinion either as I know one quite famous Zambian PH who is currently having D'Arcy Echols build him a 375 Ruger on a pre-64 action. They started to build a 9.3x64 but decided the 375 Ruger was a better choice!

As to the wooden stock cracking problem - yes they do crack, but so will virtually every wooden handle if used long enough. The famous pre-64's were notorious for it. The one on my African model recently started to develop a crack due to the soft Am walnut compressing behind the recoil lug. I glass bedded it and added a second recoil lug and am hopeful that will solve the problem.