Just wondering if anyone has or have had a 416 Express. Cartridge
Is built on 350 Remington mag case. My dad has one and loves his. His shoots a 300gr Barnes at 2650fps w a .75 group at @ 100 yards.

Hoytshooter, welcome to AR. You'll find lots of wildcatting folks here. Sounds like a neat build...like a 416 Short-Mag.

An internet search shows that Handloader's Jan/Feb 1994 #167 had loads by Ken Waters for that cartridge.

George

Seems to me that if I had a .416" bore that I'd want to use a standard length cartridge so that I could use heavier bullets in it.

quote:

Seems to me that if I had a .416" bore that I'd want to use a standard length cartridge so that I could use heavier bullets in it.

Depending on the action guess you can seat the bullet long like some of the 400 Whelen shooters are doing.

How different is this from the 416 ruger?

Interesting, another wildcat based on the .350 Rem mag case. I'm not really interested in most of the short mags but I do like very much like the .350 Rem mag and what can be built on it. Plus it's pretty much the original short action magnum.

I posted a month or so back questions about another one that was in a recent issue of Reloader magazine. This one is called the .460 Wyatt. The article didn't list any particulars like powder charge or velocity so I emailed the magazine. All I got back was that the owner of the rifle shown hadn't sent any in with the article and they wouldn't give out his email address inorder to protect his privacy. So I pretty much drew a blank.

That .416 does sound interesting as it seems to give enough velocity with heavy bullets all in a short light rifle.

I read about the 416 Express in Ken Waters' Pet Loads book. He stated that he intended this cartridge to be a modern take on the 405 Winchester and advocated its use on elk, moose, and bears. Not seeing the need for full-size 416's/400gr bullets in North America, he states that he wanted a handy lighter weight rifle designed for 300-335gr 416 bullets. His goal was to achieve 2300-2350 fps shooting 300 gr bullets. In testing the cartridge in a short action Ruger Model 77, Ken Waters achieved 2450 fps with 300 Barnes X (non-TSX) and 2250 fps with a 335gr Northern Precision semi-spitzer. The test rifle had a 22 inch barrel.

It sounds like it would be an neat cartridge for those interested in a short-ranged thumper. I think it perfectly met the goals for which the cartridge was designed. If available at the time of the experiment, I speculate that he would have used either a WSM or RCM case as the basis this wildcat.

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It sounds like it would be an neat cartridge for those interested in a short-ranged thumper

For sure not every one needs to wring out the last bit of velocity that can be had in any one caliber.

I have a bunch of 300gr Barnes originals that would make great killers in this round.

My take on a short case 416 is it needs to get the needed velocity from a short barrel. Not over 19" and 18" is preferable. Even shorter is very nice. If the round can give a 300 gr TSX bullet 2500 fps from an 18" barrel in a short action. It has awesome potential. I do think the WSM case is a natural for that. I had built a 416 Taylor with an 18" barrel and it would give around 2650 fps. With the 300 gr X bullet. However it weighed far too much as the builder figured he knew more than I did about rifle weight for me. I got rid of it. But, the idea is solid. A 7 or 8 lb compact thumper .

I built one off a ruger 77 compact mag action. I really like how it shoots. Have a 20 in barrel on it and it's weight is right at 7.5 lbs. I have been shooting 350gr at 2250. Could push them faster but that was the first load I tested and it shot sub MOA.

Seems to me the 416 in all forms has been necked up and down from a phonograph needle to a baseball bat..The results in the field don't change.

Based on that I like the .416 Remington, its served me to perfection in a 8.75 lb. rifle.

But to a wildcatter such trivia falls on deaf ears and so be it, its all about fun and games anyway and the only difference in men and boys it the cost of mens toys comes to mind!! Been there don't that!

Very cool and excellent wildcat...72gr H20 plus...similar to the 40 x 2" Winters or the 416 x 2" Beartooth and ballistics very close to the 416 Taylor in a short action using faster burning powders designed for the smaller case, what's NOT to like.

There have been several 416/350RM wildcats, mostly with minimal tapered, almost straight walled cases and the short neck shortened even more, for a gain of ~5 gr more volume...they all do excellent jobs.

I started to do one for my Marlin 336 levergun but got sidetracked and lost the return route. It would work much better in a 71/86. Might not get quite the velocity due to pressure constraints but it would still be a conversation starting, one off with bragging rights.

I did find the WSM case to be a better design for a short action 416 as you can do the same case manipulations and gain almost to 90 gr H2O, but that case wasn't so readily available when the 350RM wildcatting began. Every time I pick up my M336 I start thinking of just having someone do me a barrel instead of taking the time to do it myself...time is short and to many projects to finish anyway.

The 416/350RM is ~25 +/- gr H2O smaller in case size than the Ruger or Rem, basically 25-30%...a modified 416 WSM(already available)is about 10+/-gr H2O smaller or about 10% which makes it a short action 416 Ruger/Rem without splitting hairs, but the larger case will handle heavier bullets much better because of the longer mags and ability to seat out to ~3.6", against ~2.85", and if you do use a LA you defeat the purpose of a SA cartridge.

The trouble with wildcatters is they increment...increase/decrease incrementally from the start point...i.e., start with a 17 FB and end with a 600 Overkill after a while...hahahahahahaha.

The 416/350RM is an excellent wildcat, all the various "makin's" are much cheaper than custom stuff and readily available, I don't think you can go wrong building one...just think how cool the 350 RM 660 Rem was or the 600 Mohawk...now if I could ONLY find a CHEEP one....

http://specialtypistols.infopo...6077864/m/9320082086 or 416 Express at Specialty Pistols.


Luck

350 mag tips in a short action would be a GREAT north american round -- though obviated by the 416 ruger, which could be loaded down to this level

Very true, Boss...I've always had a bit of trouble with the "why/why not" when it comes to larger cals/heavier bullets for larger game going with a shorter case and SA when starting with a large case and large cal will fulfill so many more applications by reloading to fit the bill.

There are always applications where a short case is the only one to fit and I just never could figure out what/why the 1/2" difference in action length was such a big deal, but we cal ALWAYS come up with plausible sounding arguments for the toys we want and the WAY we want them.

The short, fatties, WSM/RSM, somewhat negate that minor question and wildcatting the Gibbs case to 2" can produce a case that brings it close to a 2.5" mag case, ~100 gr H20 and all the other mods being relatively simple to do or have work arounds in todays wildcatting world.

But...that's what wildcatting and asking the questions brings to the table...with all the other caveats added.

LUCK

quote:

Originally posted by Ray B:
Seems to me that if I had a .416" bore that I'd want to use a standard length cartridge so that I could use heavier bullets in it.

So we should only be shooting the 300 Wby, 300 RUM and 30-378 in a 30 cal? 30-30, 308, 30-06 have no place because they don't shoot the 200+ bullets as effectively?

Cool wildcat, I dig it.

I think many on this board forget that not every cartridge over 8mm meeds to be able to knock down elephant from 500 yards. Some like big bullets, doesn't mean they need to dislocate their shoulder shooting them.

Served my time in the wildcatting field, cost me a lot of money for nothing, but then so did golf and team roping!!

If one is going to use the big bores for African, Australian, or where ever DG exists, then its important to keep to the factory calibers, its just not worth the risk although some have gotten away with it, self included, its still not a smart thing to do, it can ruin a very expensive safari, and one thing I guarantee is Africa is never predictable, whats OK today can change in a heart beat..